Pocket 380 issues

[SteadyD]

I have had a host of issues with pocket 380s over the past 6 months. I had two LCP II pistols that required a trip back to Ruger. One of them had to be replaced because it couldn’t be repaired. I’ve had two Kahr CW380s go back. One is still gone (going on 8 weeks) and the other is still iffy. And now my Beretta Pico is going to go back for a second time (first time to replace the mag release pin, which kept walking out when shooting)... These little pistols are perhaps just too delicate to hold up to heavy use and the tolerances so tight that they are more likely to have issues tha full size guns. Also, I have the worst luck with guns.... at least any I’ve purchased after Sandy Hook. It seems like my troubles started then. Perhaps quality control took a backseat to the need to pump out so many guns to meet demand?

Today at the range my Pico trigger went dead. I took it apart and found that a little metal tab that holds part of the trigger spring was simply gone. It crapped out at about the 800 round mark.

Pic one is the spring on the left side, still being retained by a metal tab. Pic two is the spring on the right side with the metal tab just gone.






Has anyone else had so many issues with these little guns? I have to pocket carry at work and these little pistols are by far the most concealable but they aren’t exactly inspiring confidence. Two had issues that cropped up after round counts over 600 but the others were problematic from the start. Each had its own strange set of problems. Fortunately, Beretta, Ruger and Kahr have been good to work with on these issues.

 

[Jeb Stuart]

I have two Pico's and have ran a few thousands rounds through them with no problem One has well over 2500 rounds. Heck that was quite a bit of time ago. Can only guess how many now. The other is around 1500 rds. I have a Kahr that has over a 1,000 rds. A few hiccups at first but runs fine now. Still finiky on ammo, but runs fine on PrecisionOne which is the bulk I shoot, however the Pico's seem to like anything. The only thing I have done is replace recoil springs on the Pico.
I had a number of LCP's over the Years and they all went down from grip cracks, frame cracks, and rail splits. Ruger would replace them and I am down to one, which I do not shoot any longer. Just a truck gun now. Don't want to force my luck on Ruger with so many being replaced.

Since the Pico is modular, I know a few owners that did replace a few parts themselves. I am not sure from your pic, but I believe you could just replace the spring. I bought a few extra parts for mine just in case but have not had to use them.
The nice thing about the Pico is every thing like the receiver and chassis is Stainless Steel and not aluminum. And the grips are replaceable for $18.00. So cracks and splits should not be a issue.
There really are not a lot of parts, and you should be able to do any of the minor repairs yourself. I have actually broken mine down and removed and reinserted that spring.








Here is the manual.

https://www.google.com/search?q=Beretta+pico+manual&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-b-1-ab

 

[Sistema1927]

Thanks for posting this. In order to visualize your problem I disassembled my Pico. Much to my chagrin I discovered that my trigger bar was sitting below the sear/hammer, instead of being engaged with it.

I carried a non-functioning gun today, and would have tomorrow as well had I not read this.

I am guessing that Beretta will send you another trigger bar, since those tabs are an integral part of that piece.

Also, how often do you clean that pistol? The way it is designed, it is a breeze to get it nice and shiny, unlike the amount of crud that I see in your pics.

 

[NIGHTLORD40K]

My Pico has been flawless so far, but packing .380 power in to such a tiny package at a certain price point means there will always compromises made during the design process and the resulting assemblies will be highly stressed and have a correspondingly shorter service life, as well as being more finicky when it comes to ammunition and grip.

There is a reason most of the early pocket pistols were .25 and .32s- and they were all steel and wood!

I have also had far more issues with pocket pistols, but accept that they are less reliable than their larger cousins. Once you get to the size of, say a SIG P225 or S&W 3913, the problems largely go away.

 

[Sistema1927]

I am not sure from your pic, but I believe you could just replace the spring.

The part he needs is the trigger bar, part # 7 in the manual.

 

[NIGHTLORD40K]

I have two Pico's and have ran a few thousands rounds through them with no problem One has well over 2500 rounds. Heck that was quite a bit of time ago. Can only guess how many now. The other is around 1500 rds. I have a Kahr that has over a 1,000 rds. A few hiccups at first but runs fine now. Still finiky on ammo, but runs fine on PrecisionOne which is the bulk I shoot, however the Pico's seem to like anything. The only thing I have done is replace recoil springs on the Pico.
I had a number of LCP's over the Years and they all went down from grip cracks, frame cracks, and rail splits. Ruger would replace them and I am down to one, which I do not shoot any longer. Just a truck gun now. Don't want to force my luck on Ruger with so many being replaced.

Since the Pico is modular, I know a few owners that did replace a few parts themselves. I am not sure from your pic, but I believe you could just replace the spring. I bought a few extra parts for mine just in case but have not had to use them.
The nice thing about the Pico is every thing like the receiver and chassis is Stainless Steel and not aluminum. And the grips are replaceable for $18.00. So cracks and splits should not be a issue.
There really are not a lot of parts, and you should be able to do any of the minor repairs yourself. I have actually broken mine down and removed and reinserted that spring.


View attachment 802444

View attachment 802445

View attachment 802446

Here is the manual.

https://www.google.com/search?q=Beretta+pico+manual&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-b-1-ab

Yep, his trigger bar broke- the spring should be fine. An easy, if annoying, fix.

 

[SteadyD]

Thanks for posting this. In order to visualize your problem I disassembled my Pico. Much to my chagrin I discovered that my trigger bar was sitting below the sear/hammer, instead of being engaged with it.

I carried a non-functioning gun today, and would have tomorrow as well had I not read this.

I am guessing that Beretta will send you another trigger bar, since those tabs are an integral part of that piece.

Also, how often do you clean that pistol? The way it is designed, it is a breeze to get it nice and shiny, unlike the amount of crud that I see in your pics.

I was about 225 rounds on today’s range session so it was pretty dirty.

 

[Jeb Stuart]

The Trigger bar is easy to replace. And yes they are thin. I just looked, I have most of the parts for replacement. I have heard of the trigger bar getting bent. I would go to MIDWEST and get most of the parts and save on shipping cost. Most are not very expensive. These guns really are built to last a long time. I see no reason they cannot go on indefinitely. But I like the gun so much, I bought a second one which I use one for carry and one for range work. I keep 380 ammo in my car and many times will stop by the range for a few boxes of ammo out of the one I carry. Both get shot quite a bit.

You pic of your gun really was dirty. I wonder if that may have had something to do with the breakage.

 

[jar]

I haven't had any experience with any of the modern 380s but I've been using a Sig p230 and an East German Makarov since the mid '90s and so far nothing has broken on either. No idea of how many rounds have gone through either but certainly a fair number. They do get cleaned well after every use and if they have not been used for awhile before then before going back into the carry rotation.

 

[NIGHTLORD40K]

I haven't had any experience with any of the modern 380s but I've been using a Sig p230 and an East German Makarov since the mid '90s and so far nothing has broken on either. No idea of how many rounds have gone through either but certainly a fair number. They do get cleaned well after every use and if they have not been used for awhile before then before going back into the carry rotation.

+1 on the P230 being a great pistol! Never had a Mak........

However, both of these are a whole order of magnitude larger than the current crop of .380 pocket pistols, with correspondingly greater heft and extra measures of parts durability.

 

[98bluewave]

Glock 42 .380 is a little larger but absolutely trouble free and shoots great! Also have the Sig P238 but prefer the Glock for carry.

 

[bassjam]

The only .380 I've owned is a Ruger LCP 2nd Gen, but after 8 years of carry and somewhere around 1,600 rounds it's always been reliable. It is starting to feel a little loose so I'm planning on replacing it with a Kahr CW380 or P380.

 

[Jeb Stuart]

The only .380 I've owned is a Ruger LCP 2nd Gen, but after 8 years of carry and somewhere around 1,600 rounds it's always been reliable. It is starting to feel a little loose so I'm planning on replacing it with a Kahr CW380 or P380.

Bassjam, From my experience with LCP's, I have advise friends etc. to start looking closely at the LCP starting around 1500 rds. Examine the grip, chassis and rails. Yes, they are very reliable up to a point. I shoot pocket gun more than most people, and I know many that will not put 1500 rds through a pocket gun. I also have the Kahr which is a very well made little gun. again all stainless Steel. Very tight tolerances. But they do have a break in period, so beware. No big deal, and they can be finicky on Ammo. My two Pico's are extremely reliable. The only failures I have had were some cheap bulk reloads and that was a few bad primer strikes. But once again the Pico has second strike capability and they would fire on the second strike. A really nice feature for a Pocket gun.
The Kahr is a very pleasant little shooting great sights. Just spend some time with different ammo. It does not like any with a long OAL, Mine really loves PrecisionOne Plus P. Both the Kahr and the Pico are rated by the manufacturer for Plus P or higher pressure ammo.
** And of course if the LCP cracks or goes down, they will replace the gun.

 

[paulsj]

What you have there are deep conceilment pistols designed for defensive use where distances involved are measured in feet not yards. Mine has had about 100 rounds through it in 5 years since I bought it.
When you buy sub $300 mini pistol in reality you are buying a modern version of FP-45.
Most cost about $50 to make but can't be sold for say $100 because companies like Ruger have to fix most what's shipped to them for free because for some enigmatic reason that is what customers in this business expect

 

[George P]

These little pistols are perhaps just too delicate to hold up to heavy use

You are correct; they were not designed as hi-round count range toys.

 

[Jeb Stuart]

You are correct; they were not designed as hi-round count range toys.

I would say you are correct on aluminum chassis guns. I do not agree with that statement on Steel chassis guns. they can take a lot of abuse as they have proven this. And, like a revolver need diligent training and frequent training. I shoot a lot of fast 10 yds. And I consider them a fun gun to shoot.
That said, I also train with A small Phoenix HPA 22.cal. They can do wonders for quick point and shoot skills. And they are very accurate at 10 yds. Shoot 200 rounds of 22.cal and 100 rounds of 380. Works out well.
And shooting and handling this small 22. alway makes me want a Colt, Kimber, Sig. Love the feel in the hand.

 

[Sistema1927]

I was just thinking that when you get that new trigger bar that it would be best to apply a little lube at the place where the spring contacts that tab. The way it is designed, the spring rubs back and forth on that tab, and without lube any grit or grime will just act like saw teeth on that part.

 

[George P]

I would say you are correct on aluminum chassis guns. I do not agree with that statement on Steel chassis guns. they can take a lot of abuse as they have proven this. And, like a revolver need diligent training and frequent training. I shoot a lot of fast 10 yds. And I consider them a fun gun to shoot.
That said, I also train with A small Phoenix HPA 22.cal. They can do wonders for quick point and shoot skills. And they are very accurate at 10 yds. Shoot 200 rounds of 22.cal and 100 rounds of 380. Works out well.
And shooting and handling this small 22. alway makes me want a Colt, Kimber, Sig. Love the feel in the hand.

View attachment 802514

Except the OP was talking about poly-framed guns, not steel ones.

 

[bannockburn]

To hear of all these problems with various other pocket size .380s makes me appreciate my Colt Mustang and SIG P238 all the more.

 

[Jeb Stuart]

I was referring to chassis not grip FRAMES. As was said, the Polymer grip FRAMES can be changed any time.

Sitstema, good point, I am going I am going to take my down and apply a little lube on these point. Maybe? I usually take my down and clean in a sonic cleaner with Ballistol Milk. Leaves a very fine lube on all the parts.

 

[Armored farmer]

Nothing throws cold water on you like a broken ccw. It sure does drain your confidence.
My LCP has been good.

I had a NAA .22 mag that failed me twice. I had to let it go. I think it was too small and delicate.
EDC is hard on guns.

 

[GRIZ22]

The only pocket 380 I own is a S&W BG380. I've carried most of the time as a backup or even a main battery when it had to be that small. had it for 4-5 years and have put at least 2000 rds through it. Zero malfunctions and no issues. It eats any 380 I've fed it and I shoot it about as good as a J frame.

 

[George P]

I was referring to chassis not grips. As was said, the Polymer grips can be changed any time.

Sitstema, good point, I am going I am going to take my down and apply a little lube on these point. Maybe? I usually take my down and clean in a sonic cleaner with Ballistol Milk. Leaves a very fine lube on all the parts.

LCP and similar are not poly grips, the frame is polymer