Police, wrong house, kill homeowner in error

[BLACKHAWKNJ]

If I was a homeowner I would have a Dutch Door, in the upper panel I would have a sliding door-like a speakeasy from the 1920s-"Joe sent me." Were I more into electronics, a camera and a 2-way communications system. And perhaps several floodlights.

 

[Blue Jays]

/\/\/\

@BLACKHAWKNJ , society has moved us very far beyond that type of solution.
Nobody wishes to be separated from a violent intruder by under 1-foot of distance.

 

[shafter]

A complication that one can envision by entertaining a conversation at all is subsequently being ordered to step outside for a "conversation" that the person at the incorrect address does not want or deserve. What happens when one totally overlooks the knife clipped to his/her jeans pocket? "Knife! Knife! Knife! Subject has a knife!”

Increasingly in this crazy world…my comfort level exists with my family and a tiny circle of very dear friends.
Trustworthy and wonderful people I have known my entire life or at least multiple decades at a very minimum.

Per the OP subject…all this can be prevented by simply continuing to cook dinner, watch television, do a healthy workout in the home gym…and continue to remain safely behind locked doors ignoring the doorbell.

Police can't order you outside without a warrant. They may use sneaky words to try to lure you outside but if you speak through the door they can't come in and they know it.

If the police are outside on my doorstep and I know that I've done nothing wrong whatsoever I'm going to talk through the door and find out why they're here and what they need. Maybe I'll go outside and speak with them, perhaps not.

If you act sketchy and furtive then the police may get a warrant for whatever crime was reported and if you don't clarify that they are at the wrong house then it may be your address they put on the warrant.

 

[The Night Rider]

If you act sketchy and furtive then the police may get a warrant for whatever crime was reported and if you don't clarify that they are at the wrong house then it may be your address they put on the warrant.

Wait a minute. The police were at the wrong house.

The fact that you're acting furtive and sketchy doesn't change the fact that they were supposed to be at 6521 Lafayette Street and they showed up at 15111 Wycliffe Drive. (Two houses I lived in in Omaha, in case anyone is wondering)

They can't get a warrant based on the fact that they showed up at your house by accident and you acted "Sketchy".

It occurs to me after reading this discussion that if the police ever showed up at my house the first question I would ask them is what house are you looking for what address are you trying to be at.

 

[shafter]

Wait a minute. The police were at the wrong house.

The fact that you're acting furtive and sketchy doesn't change the fact that they were supposed to be at 6521 Lafayette Street and they showed up at 15111 Wycliffe Drive.

They can't get a warrant based on the fact that they showed up at your house by accident and you acted "Sketchy".

It occurs to me after reading this discussion that if the police ever showed up at my house the first question I would ask them is what house are you looking for what address are you trying to be at.

You don't get what I'm saying. The police were responding to a report of a crime. They got the wrong address but until they learn that it's the wrong address they are going to believe they are at the correct location. If they are at what they believe is the scene of a possible crime they may well apply for a warrant for the location where they meet someone acting furtive. The warrant will have that address on it. The judge will have no way of knowing the officers are wrong. Depending on the nature of what's being reporter the officers may determine that they have exigency and make entry anyway.

I'm pro law enforcement and have done that job myself. Even so I don't want cops at my house. If they're at my place in error I'll do whatever I can to send them on their way politely and with the correct information.

 

[old lady new shooter]

if the police ever showed up at my house the first question I would ask them is what house are you looking for what address are you trying to be at.

This is a very good idea. Thanks.

 

[Old Dog]

If you act sketchy and furtive then the police may get a warrant for whatever crime was reported and if you don't clarify that they are at the wrong house then it may be your address they put on the warrant.

Nope. That's not how it works.

So did everyone posting in this thread bother to view -- and listen to -- the complete body-camera footage that's been released? Listen to the family's lawyer's statement? Watch the interview with the wife? Notice that the victim came through his doorway and did not have his handgun pointed at any of the officers while having a very bright light aimed at his face? The "hands up!" warning came as shots were initially fired by the officers.

The officers had reason to believe that they were, in fact, at the wrong house -- in fact, were joking about it -- while the wife and three children who were present state they (1) did not hear the officers ID themselves verbally and (2) believed that someone was attempting to break in the front door. Based on the audio from the body-cams, the officers were acting awfully casual in spite of responding to a call that indicated an act of domestic violence had occurred. Nevertheless, did the homeowner make a fatal error in judgement? Yes. This incident was a cluster**** of the first magnitude. But I'm far more critical of the officers' response than I am of the victim.

 

[shafter]

The footage shows the officers knocking like any regular person would. If I heard a tap tap tap like that on my door I would absolutely not be thinking that someone was trying to break in.

I can't see how anyone had an issue with how the officers responded.

 

[The Night Rider]

You don't get what I'm saying. The police were responding to a report of a crime. They got the wrong address but until they learn that it's the wrong address they are going to believe they are at the correct location. If they are at what they believe is the scene of a possible crime they may well apply for a warrant for the location where they meet someone acting furtive. The warrant will have that address on it. The judge will have no way of knowing the officers are wrong. Depending on the nature of what's being reporter the officers may determine that they have exigency and make entry anyway.

I'm pro law enforcement and have done that job myself. Even so I don't want cops at my house. If they're at my place in error I'll do whatever I can to send them on their way politely and with the correct information.

I understand what you're saying but I don't think it's likely they could get through all that whole process and not realize at some point they were not standing in front of the house that Sharon Claridge sent them to

 

[wayneinFL]

The footage shows the officers knocking like any regular person would. If I heard a tap tap tap like that on my door I would absolutely not be thinking that someone was trying to break in.

I can't see how anyone had an issue with how the officers responded.

Regular people don't knock on my door at close to midnight then hide in the dark and shine lights at it. I would be suspicious, too. I would want to know who is out there, but I wouldn't be able to have a conversation with police through the door if they won't get near the door. They would have to wait it out, because it's a bad idea to open the door.

Or step out the back door, lock it and walk around front. Of course, there's a risk there, too, but it's just a risk to you and not your family.

I don't think anyone else has mentioned this- what was going on at 5308, while all these officers are at 5305? Somebody could have been in a lot of trouble over there.

Anyway. People make mistakes. That's why pencils have erasers.

 

[herrwalther]

We've discussed this before. Don't open the door until you know who is outside. There are all kinds of reasonably priced camera systems, peepholes and other ways to see who is at the door before you open it. I never stood in front of the door when making contact. That's how we were taught years ago. You might want to look at a way you can view the sides of the door.

This. I am without a doubt alive today because of having a camera overlooking my front yard. I live out in the middle of nowhere. Remote. Houses are clearly marked, so no mistaken address issues. I get woken up one morning to a banging on my door at 6AM, very rare. Grab my gun and check the camera. Sure enough, police car in my yard. I put the gun down and answer the officer with empty hands. I know if I had opened the door with a firearm, I probably would have been shot.

 

[shafter]

Regular people don't knock on my door at close to midnight then hide in the dark and shine lights at it. I would be suspicious, too. I would want to know who is out there, but I wouldn't be able to have a conversation with police through the door if they won't get near the door. They would have to wait it out, because it's a bad idea to open the door.

Or step out the back door, lock it and walk around front. Of course, there's a risk there, too, but it's just a risk to you and not your family.

I don't think anyone else has mentioned this- what was going on at 5308, while all these officers are at 5305? Somebody could have been in a lot of trouble over there.

Anyway. People make mistakes. That's why pencils have erasers.

The reason cops knock and then step out of the light is pretty apparent by what happened in the video.

 

[Zygodactyl]

I had a scary situation last year. I live in a rural area; my house is set back from the road and I have a locked gate across the driveway. I was working on my laptop at about 1 a.m., when I heard a loud banging on my front door. I know the gate is locked so nobody should be at my door without permission. I grabbed my J model .38, (closest weapon) and approached the door. I saw lights shining through the window at the top of the door. I hit the porch light and peered through another window. All I could see was the light shining on the front of the house. I did see a vehicle parked at the gate and when a passing car illuminated it, I could see that it was a patrol car. The person lowered his light once and I could see a uniform, so I cracked the door and asked what was going on. The 38 was behind my back and not visible. The officer said they got a 911 call that hung up that pinged at this address. I told him not us. I dropped the 38 into my back pocket before opening the door. I kept him in front of me and walked him back to the gate, still locked, he had climbed it. My guess was a passing car butt dialed 911. It kind of shook me that if I had not hidden the 38 I might have been shot. I was a little miffed that he had climbed my gate but the Sheriff's office in my county is pretty good, and they do solve most of the crimes in the area, which is more than I can say about where I used to live.

 

[Blue Jays]

"…The officer said they got a 911 call that hung up that pinged at this address. My guess was a passing car butt-dialed 911…"

Ugggh, that is very unfortunate to learn!

My previous understanding was a 9-1-1 call had to originate from a known landline attached to a specific physical address to enable a direct police response. If passing cars can now call 9-1-1 while driving past places one could envision this becoming a new (dangerous) prank for kids. You learn something new everyday.

 

[wayneinFL]

The reason cops knock and then step out of the light is pretty apparent by what happened in the video.

I'm not saying they didn't have a reason, but do you see why that puts someone in an awkward position? Unless they have cameras somewhere besides their front door, they don't know who's out there. You say that a regular knock on the door at midnight with no one in view of the camera, and that wouldn't raise any suspicion with you? You'd just step right on out the door?

Maybe the solution is if someone is knocking on your door at midnight and you can't identify them, you call 911. Not perfect, because the dispatcher doesn't know the cops are at your address, but maybe someone would put 2 and 2 together.

That has to be a better solution that just sitting there waiting for whoever is outside to kick in the door.

 

[shafter]

I'm not saying they didn't have a reason, but do you see why that puts someone in an awkward position? Unless they have cameras somewhere besides their front door, they don't know who's out there. You say that a regular knock on the door at midnight with no one in view of the camera, and that wouldn't raise any suspicion with you? You'd just step right on out the door?

Maybe the solution is if someone is knocking on your door at midnight and you can't identify them, you call 911. Not perfect, because the dispatcher doesn't know the cops are at your address, but maybe someone would put 2 and 2 together.

That has to be a better solution that just sitting there waiting for whoever is outside to kick in the door.

It's simple, if they thought a home invasion was about to go down they should barricade in place with their firearm and call 911. If they had followed that simple advice the confusion would have been cleared up in seconds. Why on earth would anyone open the door when they suspect violent criminals are outside? We've discussed this point so many times here on THR and most people seem to get it but you always have that one person who just doesn't get it.

The point here is that bad tactics get you sued, killed, or incarcerated. Use good common sense and you'll navigate through life unscathed because when it comes to gunfights even when you win you lose.

 

[lightman]

It pays to look out before answering the door, now days. Like others have said, cameras are now fairly affordable. If I answer the door late I have a gun on me but I don't display it.

Kind of on the same subject, everyone should have their address posted and see that its correct. I've worked in places that they were not correct or displayed.

 

[Frulk]

I have my opinions on this occurrence but will keep them under wraps. I do think the city of Farmington, NM is on the hook for a large pay out. Will be interested to see how that plays out.

 

[The Night Rider]

Ugggh, that is very unfortunate to learn!

My previous understanding was a 9-1-1 call had to originate from a known landline attached to a specific physical address to enable a direct police response. If passing cars can now call 9-1-1 while driving past places one could envision this becoming a new (dangerous) prank for kids. You learn something new everyday.

I've never called 911 on my phone but I have had to call 911 on the company phone and at least in Colorado Springs if you dial 911 your phone is locked until Police/EMS arrives on the scene.

So if some kid did that as a prank it would lock their phone and 911 would probably be able to locate it

 

[Jeff White]

I can't speak to changes in technology since I retired or for how the 911 system works everywhere but I worked in a rural area and we were dispatched to the cell tower several times on a 911 hang up. The system gave the 911 tele communicator the cell tower address. They soon figured out the addresses of the cell towers and stopped dispatching us to them. But for awhile if someone butt dialed 911 and disconnected the police were on their way to the cell tower that picked up the call. It was a huge waste of resources to drive down country roads looking for a residence that didn't exist.

 

[shafter]

I have my opinions on this occurrence but will keep them under wraps. I do think the city of Farmington, NM is on the hook for a large pay out. Will be interested to see how that plays out.

Police get sued for everything these days and often times the dept will just settle regardless of how it would play out in court but in this case it's doubtful. The police were lawfully present at that location and were shot at.

 

[wayneinFL]

I can't speak to changes in technology since I retired or for how the 911 system works everywhere but I worked in a rural area and we were dispatched to the cell tower several times on a 911 hang up. The system gave the 911 tele communicator the cell tower address. They soon figured out the addresses of the cell towers and stopped dispatching us to them. But for awhile if someone butt dialed 911 and disconnected the police were on their way to the cell tower that picked up the call. It was a huge waste of resources to drive down country roads looking for a residence that didn't exist.

I haven't done any e911 testing in the last year, but last time I did it, that's how it was. You'll get the lat/long for the site and a description. The last system I tested was small cells in a police station and city hall, and those would come up with the coordinates and address for the building. Since it was multiple cells, they were broken down by location inside, like reception, training room, gym, etc. If it were one cell in the building, it would just be the one address.

But any macro tower/rooftop site, it's the address and coordinates of the site, along with which sector. For example, "Jones Road - W sector", but there's no standard naming convention for that, so you can't guarantee the dispatcher sees something that makes sense.

 

[Kleanbore]

I have my opinions on this occurrence but will keep them under wraps. I do think the city of Farmington, NM is on the hook for a large pay out. Will be interested to see how that plays out.

Errors made by police officers, possible liability, and so forth are beyond the scope of ST&T.

Our interest is in helping people avoid harm.

 

[JERRY]

The simple fix is don't open your door. Call 911 tell them your address tell them your name and tell them people are banging on your front door claiming to be the police. Follow dispatch lead from there.

 

[JERRY]

The next bit that people need to realize is that Supreme Court has already ruled that the police don't have to be right, they only have to be reasonable. The reasonable standard is based on reasonable police officers not reasonable private citizens.

Private citizens don't respond to domestic violence calls in the middle of the night. Private citizens don't get dispatched to people's houses where there is a suspected crime of violence occurring.
Private citizens don't get dispatched to and met at the door of suspected domestic violence persons holding a gun... and so on...