41magsnub
Member
Err... no it doesn't.
Punk uses potato as silencer...
- Thread starter Warren
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Err... no it doesn't.
I think he was being sarcastic. By some definitions of "cop bashing" tossed around here, Oleg definitely violated the policy. Of course, some accuse those who questions police conduct of any kind as being cop bashers.
Let's not let the thread get dragged into this. There is a long history of crooks posing as police. How to deal with that is a common (and unfortunately contentious) area that is worth discussing.
Let's not let the thread get dragged into this. There is a long history of crooks posing as police. How to deal with that is a common (and unfortunately contentious) area that is worth discussing.
The Deer Hunter
Member
Must have been some sort of .45 set on stun...
Guess the punks got what they had coming to them.
Strings
Member
Sorry, but Oleg's pic is right on. Popping over to Evilbay, I did a search for "police + windbreaker", and came up with 13 listings. If it's available on Ebay, I'm pretty sure a thug on the street can find a way of getting it...
It IS getting to the point that you just don't know if it's a cop or not, and that's a life-or-death decision.
It IS getting to the point that you just don't know if it's a cop or not, and that's a life-or-death decision.
RKBABob
Member
Enough with the accusations of cop bashing already! 
Sheesh! Some of the coppers (and their supporters) are very thin skinned.
Criminals imitate police tactics in order to get the upper hand against their victims. A no knock raid, by its nature, takes out the part of the policemen introducing themselves, and showing their credentials. Such a raid is, in essence, a legally-sanctioned home invasion by the authorities, and a perfect tactic for he criminal element to follow.
Can we expect criminals to obey the law, and NOT imitate or impersonate the police? Or would it be more reasonable to ask the police to change their tactics to ones that are not so easily adapted by criminals?
While an inconvenience to the officers, many citizens would prefer police work to be carried out in daylight, and by uniformed officers. For example, conducting surveilance on a property, and taking a suspect into custody when he leaves. I don't see how this could be more dangerous to the officers. It would, however, take up police resources and time... but I, as a taxpayer, would gladly pay police overtime for any change in tactics that increases safety for the officers, citizens, and suspects' families, while at the same time taking away a scenario that criminals can exploit to their benefit.
This is a similar issue to the rash of "blue light rapists" that struck a few years ago. Men in unmarked cars impersonating police officers during bogus traffic stops. Police in many areas changed their tactics, and began conducting traffic stops for minor offences ONLY in marked police cars, to make it harder for criminals to impersonate traffic officers.
Sheesh! Some of the coppers (and their supporters) are very thin skinned.Criminals imitate police tactics in order to get the upper hand against their victims. A no knock raid, by its nature, takes out the part of the policemen introducing themselves, and showing their credentials. Such a raid is, in essence, a legally-sanctioned home invasion by the authorities, and a perfect tactic for he criminal element to follow.
Can we expect criminals to obey the law, and NOT imitate or impersonate the police? Or would it be more reasonable to ask the police to change their tactics to ones that are not so easily adapted by criminals?
While an inconvenience to the officers, many citizens would prefer police work to be carried out in daylight, and by uniformed officers. For example, conducting surveilance on a property, and taking a suspect into custody when he leaves. I don't see how this could be more dangerous to the officers. It would, however, take up police resources and time... but I, as a taxpayer, would gladly pay police overtime for any change in tactics that increases safety for the officers, citizens, and suspects' families, while at the same time taking away a scenario that criminals can exploit to their benefit.
This is a similar issue to the rash of "blue light rapists" that struck a few years ago. Men in unmarked cars impersonating police officers during bogus traffic stops. Police in many areas changed their tactics, and began conducting traffic stops for minor offences ONLY in marked police cars, to make it harder for criminals to impersonate traffic officers.
how about a law that police have to wait at least 5 minutes after annoucing themselves before smashing in your door? and the announcement has to be loud enough to wake up someone inside?
thats about the length of time it might take someone to wake up, figure out what is going on, get dressed, and answer the door.
i am guessing the average length of time between knock and battering ram is a few seconds, even if its not a no-knock raid.
thats about the length of time it might take someone to wake up, figure out what is going on, get dressed, and answer the door.
i am guessing the average length of time between knock and battering ram is a few seconds, even if its not a no-knock raid.
I was.
They are. Sort of understandable though. Its not an easy job when you are often hated, distrusted, and/or disliked by all sides. You might think that would lead them to consider changing their enforcement tactics, and the way they deal with the public at large.
One would think the failure of LE to have any significant effect on crime control in most areas of the country might lead to changes as well, but it hasn't. Increasing the level of force used has not worked. Increasing it even more won't work either. But upping the force level seems to be the preferred tactic these days.
hyphen
Member
ilbob:
From what I know, battering rams are generally used when capturing fugitives or acting on warrants and similar high risk captures (special units, FBI, SWAT, DEA, etc.). I doubt your average LEO on the beat is going to smash your door down because he wants to ask you a few questions.
I've had several police officers and deputies visit my residence to ask questions and none of there harsh, offensive, aggressive or intrusive. I also live in Los Angeles and not in the prettiest area.
From what I know, battering rams are generally used when capturing fugitives or acting on warrants and similar high risk captures (special units, FBI, SWAT, DEA, etc.). I doubt your average LEO on the beat is going to smash your door down because he wants to ask you a few questions.
I've had several police officers and deputies visit my residence to ask questions and none of there harsh, offensive, aggressive or intrusive. I also live in Los Angeles and not in the prettiest area.
dont think its pleasant to wake up in the middle of the night, and have to decide if those dudes with guns are police or not...i mean, how much time can you really allow yourself to wait before taking action?...
i also think alot of people, in that situation wouldnt even consider the possibility of it being police running up their stairs...
i also think alot of people, in that situation wouldnt even consider the possibility of it being police running up their stairs...
RKBABob
Member
If the suspect is a hardened criminal, bank robber, communist spy, and heartless puppy-killer who is currently holding a bus load of Catholic nuns hostage... then maybe his door needs to be broken down at 3AM.
If the police suspect the resident might be growing and smoking pot in his basement, waiting untill he makes a noon-time nacho run is a much more desireable tactic. No knock raids, even when done properly, have atendency of making the public feel unsafe.
If the sleeping residents are law abiding, they may assume its a criminal gang... even if nothing bad happens, the department is gonna get sued big time. It the suspects are criminals, they may assume its a rival gang, and things will turn out bad. Unless there's hard evidence that the suspect(s) will respond violently, there's gotta be a better way of serving a warrant.
hyphen
Member
I think a hardened criminal, bank robber or communist spy would be considered a high risk criminal/capture, like I mentioned.
Bazooka Joe71
Member
The way this case is going, the PD might say they crooks were using self defense...The home owner did shoot first ya know.
Can anyone elaborate as to why these scumbags aren't getting more harsh charges?
Lighten up.
It was pretty blatant that he was being sarcastic.
Especially since mod bashing is way worse than cop bashing around here.
David904
Member
Aha!!! I knew it MASTEROFMALICE... You cops are all just a bunch of bastard coated bastards with bastard filling!
I knew it all along!
/pats self on the back
I knew it all along!
/pats self on the back
BlindJustice
Member
Maybe one of the BGs saw the movie SHaft. In
the opening scene a sniper uses a potato to silence
his rifle as he whacks some victim - rest of the
movie is Richard Rountree as SHaft solving the murder.
the opening scene a sniper uses a potato to silence
his rifle as he whacks some victim - rest of the
movie is Richard Rountree as SHaft solving the murder.
biscuitninja
Member
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I've had police visit my apt at night too. It wasn't fun, and they were completely lawful. (My roommate had explosive bowel movements for over a day) For the most part they were polite and very respectful. Anyways a neighbor called the police to say a "woman was in distress". OMG, police, an ambulance and the firetruck all came rolling in at the same time. All this could have been avoided if she'd had just taken pepto and some immodium....
One week later all my stuff dissappeared as well as me....
But onto point, The only way I knew was there was a HUGE amount of lights outside and I could see everybody milling about. If there were just two guys I would have been very leary. Anyway good luck
-bix
One week later all my stuff dissappeared as well as me....
But onto point, The only way I knew was there was a HUGE amount of lights outside and I could see everybody milling about. If there were just two guys I would have been very leary. Anyway good luck
-bix
littlegator
Member
I knew Oleg wasn't cop bashing because the hat on the person in the poster says, "SVAT" and everyone knows that means Special Victims Alternative Thinktank. They usually start their seminars by showing you their flashlights. They discourage members from using their tac lights while still on the rail, but it happens. If one of them comes to your door in the middle of the night, they will most likely just talk to you about awareness and stuff. (Okay, I'm avoiding work)
Dorryn
Member
Way to go!
littlegator
Member
lol...or, is that custard filling? Usually, lawyers (like me) are on the arse end of statements like that.
.
They came to visit me one time late at night. I did not even hear the door bell. But it woke up the dogs, who woke me up.
Turned out the pole barn next door had been set on fire and they were looking for witnesses.
Guy was polite and professional, like every other time I have run into one of our county guys. Even the one that gave me a speeding ticket the day the bears won the super bowl. I didn't really mean to speed but I was listening to Dick Butkus on the radio on my way over to my folks to watch the game, and went past a county guy and never even noticed. A mile or so down the road the speed limit changes. Never noticed the sign. Did not notice the cop pulling up behind me with his lights on either. Eventually noticed when he gave me a couple blasts with his siren. Probably should have got an extra ticket for driving while oblivious.
mpmarty
Member
Where we live there are only two deputies on day and swing shift and one on graveyard. The county area they are responsible for is about sixty miles by fifty miles with one state highway and one US Interstate (I5) running east, west and north south through it. All the deputies who patrol our area are VERY polite and get one hell of a lot of citizen support, armed support.
Red Dragon
Member
If cops are at a criminal's door, announcing themselves and then waiting 5 minutes gives the bad guy ample time to flush/hide drugs (if a drug bust) or for the criminal to pick up a gun and find cover to shoot the police as they come through the door. It could also give them enough time to prepare for a fast getaway.
The idea is all fine and dandy if the cops are knocking on a citizen who has done nothing wrong but let's be real for a moment. If you are going to serve a high risk warrant or do a bust, every second counts and waiting 5 minutes after announcing your presence can get some good cops killed.
but its OK if they kill a LAC because they are at the wrong place?
we did not have to do this 40 years ago. what changed? criminals were every bit as dangerous back then.
you either are going to give the inhabitants a reasonable amount of time to respond to the knock or you don't. i am advocating that the default is to give the inhabitants enough time to open the door of their own accord.
there will always be special cases that have to be handled a little more aggressively.
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