Questions Regarding 1911 barrel and the .45 Super

[meanmrmustard]

I have kind of a lengthy post, in light of needing a short answer.

I have a 6" ported barrel en route from Storm Lake in .45 ACP within the next few weeks. At least, that's what Chad at Storm Lake said. A few weeks.

I'm setting up a 1911 for using .45 Super. Why? Because I can. Seriously though, probably going to see very few rounds as a woods sidekick here in Norther Missouri. We have the very rare feral hog, coyotes by the truckload, and there's been two mountain lions killed here (Macon County) within the last few years. So, I'd like a .45 Super to ride my hip.

Yes, I realize I can take a 44 Magnum. However, I like the three more rounds AND there's no bears here.

So, I have installed a 22# Woolf recoil spring, Wilson Combat extra power firing pin spring, 26# Woolf mainspring, Wilson Combat shok buff, Ed Brown stainless steel firing pin, and EGW flat bottom firing pin stop. Whew...say thatten times fast.

.45 Super brass (cut down .451 Detonics) has a thick web forward of the flash hole for 1/4 inch to combat case bulge. Therein lies my actual question: Im seeing mixed answers regarding the supported barrel. The barrel I'll be using is a nonramped barrel with ramped frame. Im reading that Super brass is made this way to work in unramped barrels, like the .460 Rowland kit does. Will my Storm Lake ported barrel be fine due to the thick web, or am I inevitably headed towards case failure?

Any experienced answers are appreciated.

 

[meanmrmustard]

67 views, no takers?

I guess it is long winded. I'm just curious as to whether the Super will bulge and KB in a nominal 1911 chamber, or if it'll be alright due to the thick web.

 

[alexander45]

Not a lot of ppl have adopted the 45 super fewer still will know exactly what you need here. but it is interesting

 

[meanmrmustard]

Not a lot of ppl have adopted the 45 super fewer still will know exactly what you need here. but it is interesting

Tis true. Pin shooters use it on occasion, but mostly in G21s. I've read of several with photo proof of successful hog and deer kills, one shot DRTs and shoulder breaking hits.

I'm set with everything I need, but my only hesitation is bulging brass I can't reload. Well, that, and blowing up my hand.

Guess I'll be the proverbial guinea pig.

 

[rockhopper46038]

Short answer, it depends on who did the throating of your barrel. My 460 Rowland runs fine with an unramped barrel. It has substantially higher pressures that 45 Super. My 9x23 Win runs with an unramped barrel, and it's max pressure is more than double that of the 45 Super, but it also has exceedingly thick brass. I've never seen an unramped barrel in a ramp cut frame, so I can't comment on how well it may (or may not) feed, but with a proper, conservative throating, I would imagine it can be done.

 

[meanmrmustard]

Short answer, it depends on who did the throating of your barrel. My 460 Rowland runs fine with an unramped barrel. It has substantially higher pressures that 45 Super. My 9x23 Win runs with an unramped barrel, and it's max pressure is more than double that of the 45 Super, but it also has exceedingly thick brass. I've never seen an unramped barrel in a ramp cut frame, so I can't comment on how well it may (or may not) feed, but with a proper, conservative throating, I would imagine it can be done.

Its not ramp cut. I misspoke, its your run of the mill frame with the milled area that meets the barrel throat when unlocked.

Its cut down 308 winny brass, so I'm guessing it'll be ok. I found some cutaway shots of the brass. Its thick as heck for 1/4" forward of primer flash hole.

 

[Jim Watson]

I'm confused. Is it cut down .451 Detonics or cut down .308?
If .308, the thick brass reduces case capacity more than it increases strength.
Sneak up on full loads.

 

[meanmrmustard]

I'm confused. Is it cut down .451 Detonics or cut down .308?
If .308, the thick brass reduces case capacity more than it increases strength.
Sneak up on full loads.

451 Detonics is, in essence, .308 cut down a mite longer than 45 ACP. Super was made by trimming that down to ACP lengths. The extractor groove had to be modified for .451, so most who reload it are using .451 brass or the actual Super brass from Starline here in Missouri.

My plan was to start with factory loads from Underwood to begin harvesting brass.

 

[vba]

There are a couple of guy's that hang out at thefiringline and 1911forum that a very knowledgeable on 45 Super. They go by TSP45ACP and RickB among others.

Might want to do a search on their posts. Here is an example:

http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=448705

 

[meanmrmustard]

Thank you for that info. I'll check it out asap.

 

[meanmrmustard]

I'm beginning to wonder if I'm barking up the wrong tree.

According to that link, a guys handloading 230 gr jhp to 1000 fps. The 255 gr I'm looking at is 1050 fps. That's alot more pressure.

 

[hardluk1]

https://www.starlinebrass.com/brass-cases/45-Super-Brass/
I tried underwoods 230gr 1000fps and 185gr at 1200fps but carry there 200gr at 1100fps, Nothing special to be done except a 17.5lb recoil spring. 45super steps it up another hundred fps and a heavier spring that has to be changed for some range/plinker ammo
. My hands an RIA 5" and does meet advertised velocity. Brass looks just fine after shooter.

 

[meanmrmustard]

https://www.starlinebrass.com/brass-cases/45-Super-Brass/
I tried underwoods 230gr 1000fps and 185gr at 1200fps but carry there 200gr at 1100fps, Nothing special to be done except a 17.5lb recoil spring. 45super steps it up another hundred fps and a heavier spring that has to be changed for some range/plinker ammo
. My hands an RIA 5" and does meet advertised velocity. Brass looks just fine after shooter.

So, you're not seeing any bulging?

I'm curious if the 255 gr. that Underwood loads will be fine...

 

[vba]

Well, then try this link and look at tsp45acp's data. Of course use caution and work up loads. You'll note that some loads are 255 grain bullets at over 1100 fps and 230 grain at over 1200 fps. The load data is in order of velocity.

I have used some of the lower velocity loads (800 to 850 fps) with 255 grain cast LSWC bullets. They fed and fired fine in my unramped barrel Colt using regular non-super once fired brass. My Colt has an EGW flat firing pin stop, extra power firing pin spring, an 18# recoil spring and stock main spring.

http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=198668

 

[meanmrmustard]

I've gotten myself scared over pressure.

I like my hands.

I'm looking also at Underwoods +p 200 gr bjhp at 1100 fps. Looks interesting.

 

[hardluk1]

Mean, bulging case's has as much to do with the chamber of your barrel as the load ,,, with in reason. My 45 is a 1911 from RIA5"!! I have a new glock 41 that looks to have a fairly good chamber and I have run some of underwoods +P thru it and it re-size's very easily, but not is tight as the ria . There is nothing I want a 255gr hard caste for. I spent to much of my miss spent youth hunting hogs with 180gr at 1150fps from a 357 that was more than a match for any hog. A 230gr bonded speer or 200gr swc profile like from buyou bullet will do fine at P+ levels would be enough for anything a 45auto is good for. .

My carry pistol is a kahr tp40. Underwoods 155gr speer unicorn bonded 40 ammo chrony's at 1302fps . We both know that's not a load for stock glocks but in the kahrs chamber and with starline brass there is really no bulge at all. Push's thru a Rx die with one finger on the handle. Glocks fire brass take a forcefull push.

 

[meanmrmustard]

That's what makes me think, for now, Underwood +p 200 grain at 1100 fps is plenty.

I'll need to mike the Storm Lake chamber to compare against the stock chamber.