Quick Crimp Question

[Stew0576]

I use crimp die that comes with the dies, some are tapper and some are collet, I personally crimp all rounds including rifle, my personal choice

 

[Mark_Mark]

I use crimp die that comes with the dies, some are tapper and some are collet, I personally crimp all rounds including rifle, my personal choice

I’m just really starting to understand headspace, my heavy crimping days are gone… Not to say that I will stop, but will think now

 

[joneb]

I use roll dies for my .460 & .454. I do have a .357 but it’s on the back burner until I get a matching 1873 SAA

For .357 and .44 Mag I was having trouble with bullets jumping the crimp, what I mean by that is the rounds in the cylinder were growing in COL with each shot. The Lee collet crimp will fix this, where the Lee fcd will not.
JMHO

 

[Mark_Mark]

For .357 and .44 Mag I was having trouble with bullets jumping the crimp, what I mean by that is the rounds in the cylinder were growing in COL with each shot. The Lee collet crimp will fix this, where the Lee fcd will not.
JMHO

thanks man! I use RCBS set for my .460. Not sure what crimp style it is.

 

[AJC1]

thanks man! I use RCBS set for my .460. Not sure what crimp style it is.

It's a roll crimp no question

 

[Mark_Mark]

It's a roll crimp no question

that round is no joke! one of my funnest gun

 

[lordpaxman]

I use Lee FCD for .40 and 9mm. So I think I’m ok. the .45ACP is Dillon, and it was already factory setup, So I might be good there.

I just had a panic attack thinking I had to pull all those bullets, But I should be good!

anybody want to shoot my handloads???

I used to use an FCD for those but only dialed it down to where it passed a gauge. I don’t know how far you can dial down that taper crimp but measure a few at the case mouth, that should tell you if you need to pull them or not, but probably not.

thanks man! I use RCBS set for my .460. Not sure what crimp style it is.

Roll, definitely roll. I have the same dies. Good luck.

 

[Show Me]

Dang I feel dumb now! all these years.

I use Lee FCD for almost all my pistol stuff. And that’s taper, I hope.

I might have 900 9mm and 500 .40 to pull.

No one is dumb if they ask questions or know where to look it up. If your ever too old to learn something new you might as well be dead,an old mechanic once told me. You struck up a good conversation.

 

[Soonerpesek]

Name that crimp

Taper
Taper
Taper
Roll
Roll
Roll
None
None
Roll

........

 

[Mark_Mark]

No one is dumb if they ask questions or know where to look it up. If your ever too old to learn something new you might as well be dead,an old mechanic once told me. You struck up a good conversation.

I really didn’t know, I’m glade those die sets fo all the work

 

[deadeye dick]

The Lee Factory Crimp die is also frequently used for cannelured rifle bullets, like .223 and .308 in gas guns, but the question of whether to crimp or not to crimp such rounds is frequently debated. Taper crimping your autoloading pistols is primarily to remove the case mouth flare that you created to seat your bullet. Magnum revolvers get a firm roll crimp in the cannelure to prevent bullets from jumping forward in the cylinder and locking up the gun and because H110 and W296 are known to prefer it.

From what i can see on .223 the Lee FCD squeezes the neck not roll crimp like .38, 357, revolvers.

 

[Show Me]

From what i can see on .223 the Lee FCD squeezes the neck not roll crimp like .38, 357, revolvers.

Yes and you can get a crimp without pinching the day lights out of your brass. Years ago I used to crimp the heck out of the 30-30 I started out with. Your brass suffers. I had to learn as I went and had no one to ask.

 

[redcon1]

From what i can see on .223 the Lee FCD squeezes the neck not roll crimp like .38, 357, revolvers.

The rifle FCD uses a collet but the pistol caliber Carbide FCDs apply either a taper or roll crimp, whichever is appropriate for the cartridge. It also, apparently, "post-sizes" the loaded cartridge to some extent which I understand to be some kind of a "bulge buster" feature. That's an interesting feature to me and I'm researching it now actually. I have only ever used the Lee FCD for .223 in AR15s with cannelured bullets and that was years ago when I was being taught to reload .223 for AR15s. These days, I almost always use non-cannelured match bullets without a crimp in .308 and .223; although, I have a ton of SS109s and M80 projectiles so this is a good refresher for me. I have always used RCBS dies for all of my pistols.

 

[AJC1]

The rifle FCD uses a collet but the pistol caliber Carbide FCDs apply either a taper or roll crimp, whichever is appropriate for the cartridge. It also, apparently, "post-sizes" the loaded cartridge to some extent which I understand to be some kind of a "bulge buster" feature. That's an interesting feature to me and I'm researching it now actually. I have only ever used the Lee FCD for .223 in AR15s with cannelured bullets and that was years ago when I was being taught to reload .223 for AR15s. These days, I almost always use non-cannelured match bullets without a crimp in .308 and .223; although, I have a ton of SS109s and M80 projectiles so this is a good refresher for me. I have always used RCBS dies for all of my pistols.
View attachment 1057312
View attachment 1057313

Seems like people love them or hate them. The only one I own is in 38/357 and I like that one just fine. I have the 308 collet one but have never used it and dont intend to. I have used 223 collet die and my buddy was impressed with the ammunition I loaded for him.

 

[LiveLife]

I use Lee FCD for almost all my pistol stuff. And that’s taper, I hope.

The rifle FCD uses a collet but the pistol caliber Carbide FCDs apply either a taper or roll crimp, whichever is appropriate for the cartridge.

• Straight walled semi-auto pistol calibers that headspace on the casemouth are taper crimped.
• Lee Factory Crimp Die for these calibers are essentially taper crimp die with carbide sizer ring to post-size the case neck to SAAMI specs but not as much as full-length resizing die carbide ring (taper crimp sizes case mouth and not case neck).
• FCD for rimmed revolver calibers apply roll crimp - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/how-much-crimp-lee-fcd-guidance-sought.469815/
• FCD for rifle calibers, as mentioned above, apply different crimp using a collet.

pistol caliber Carbide FCD ... apparently, "post-sizes" the loaded cartridge to some extent which I understand to be some kind of a "bulge buster" feature. That's an interesting feature to me and I'm researching it now actually.

"Bulge busting" is done with "bulge buster kit" and empty case push-through resized with FCD internals removed which reduces overly expanded/bulged case base where resizing die carbide ring cannot reach available for these calibers except 9mm due to tapered case design: 380 ACP, 40 S&W, 45 ACP, 45 Win Mag, 10 mm, 41 AE, 45 GAP

"Post sizing" is done with FCD used as crimp die or on loaded rounds as "finishing die" to correct out-of-round/spec case necks from out of round bullets, inconsistent case wall thickness, tilted bullets bulging one side of case and larger sized bullet/thicker case wall bulging case neck to rub with chamber wall.

I like Lee resizing dies that reduces OD of brass smaller and further down the case base (Lee makes undersized/"U" dies for other companies) and particularly 9mm carbide sizer ring that is tapered and radiused at opening to not leave resizing scrape mark on brass but do not regularly use FCD for my .380/9mm/40S&W/45ACP rounds. If you have chambering issue with your finished rounds, especially with tighter chamber match barrels, FCD is a good solution to have on hand to ensure your finished rounds are within SAAMI specs.

 

[redcon1]

"Bulge busting" is done with "bulge buster kit" and empty case push-through resized with FCD internals removed which reduces overly expanded/bulged case base where resizing die carbide ring cannot reach available for these calibers except 9mm due to tapered case design: 380 ACP, 40 S&W, 45 ACP, 45 Win Mag, 10 mm, 41 AE, 45 GAP

"Post sizing" is done with FCD used as crimp die or on loaded rounds as "finishing die" to correct out-of-round/spec case necks from out of round bullets, inconsistent case wall thickness, tilted bullets bulging one side of case and larger sized bullet/thicker case wall bulging case neck to rub with chamber wall.

Thanks for that info. It saves me some research. I knew the die was included in the "bulge buster" die set but wasn't sure what role this "post sizing" played in the process. It's seems like it's probably pretty important to understand exactly what these dies are doing to the cases. I'm currently researching the Lee Collet neck size die. I own a couple of them but haven't really used them. I have always been satisfied with my groups but I'm trying to "up my game" for this summer. I have a Forster Co-Ax on the way and I'm thinking about using the Lee Collet neck size die to get case neck thickness better controlled and the Forster press and dies to keep runout under control. I'm, of course, hoping this all adds up to tiny little groups.

 

[deadeye dick]

Yes and you can get a crimp without pinching the day lights out of your brass. Years ago I used to crimp the heck out of the 30-30 I started out with. Your brass suffers. I had to learn as I went and had no one to ask.

I can "feel" the crimp being applied on my .223's with the Lee Classic. I like a medium crimp

 

[redcon1]

Seems like people love them or hate them. The only one I own is in 38/357 and I like that one just fine. I have the 308 collet one but have never used it and dont intend to. I have used 223 collet die and my buddy was impressed with the ammunition I loaded for him.

I have been happy with using neck tension in my .308s too. If I was loading ammo to be carried on patrol, maybe I'd be more interested in crimping. I understand the theory is that it promotes a uniform start pressure but I haven't felt like that was a huge problem for me as of yet strictly based on my rifle's performance with my reloads. I have never done a thorough range test with FCD vs without FCD test though. I'm lucky to find time to get to the rifle range let alone do extensive load testing. Maybe I should find the time. maybe this summer.

 

[AJC1]

I have been happy with using neck tension in my .308s too. If I was loading ammo to be carried on patrol, maybe I'd be more interested in crimping. I understand the theory is that it promotes a uniform start pressure but I haven't felt like that was a huge problem for me as of yet strictly based on my rifle's performance with my reloads. I have never done a thorough range test with FCD vs without FCD test though. I'm lucky to find time to get to the rifle range let alone do extensive load testing. Maybe I should find the time. maybe this summer.

Consistant neck tension is hard enough to manage, crimp adds another element that further complicates that effort.

 

[Mark_Mark]

Consistant neck tension is hard enough to manage, crimp adds another element that further complicates that effort.

Crimp hater

 

[CQB45ACP]

In Lee’s own words (see image in post #38, above), “A perfect taper crimp is applied to auto-loader rounds. The crimper cannot be misadjusted to make a case mouth too small…”

So, there is no way one can over crimp a .45ACP round (for example) using a Lee FCD? Cranking down on the adjuster indiscriminately isn’t a problem? It’s just a matter of preference? Can this be true?

Similarly, one can’t screw up cast bullets, coated bullets, plated bullets, jacketed bullets even when they are sized differently (but @.451 or .452)? Can this be true?

I have used the FCD since I began reloading (and I only load 9mm & 45ACP). Etched in my memory is the foregoing “cannot be misadjusted” verbiage. I think I have just revealed to myself why I was having troubles using a Redding taper crimp die…it’s not an FCD, follow it’s specific instructions.

 

[Blue68f100]

The LFCD was designed for jacketed bullets. But when you start using lead bullets which generally run 0.001" + over jacketed it can post size the bullet down depending on brass thickness.

Personally, I think every one should be made to load ammo without one. This way they learn how to setup the dies properly, and trouble shoot the problem. Then they know how to correct the error in their setup. Too many people use it to correct a problem.

 

[CQB45ACP]

The LFCD was designed for jacketed bullets. But when you start using lead bullets which generally run 0.001" + over jacketed it can post size the bullet down depending on brass thickness.

Personally, I think every one should be made to load ammo without one. This way they learn how to setup the dies properly, and trouble shoot the problem. Then they know how to correct the error in their setup. Too many people use it to correct a problem.

I hear ya, and have heard others say essentially the same thing, but let me push back a little…if the FCD solves the problem, isn’t the problem solved just the same?

Or, are you like old Miss Racely, “Class, don’t forget to show your work. The answer is wrong if you don’t show your work.” (I just made that up, and mean it humorously, but it’s pretty good, no?)

Edit: that’s really,really, good!

edit, edit: similar to child prodigies solving complex math problems with an abacus but WITHOUT actually having an abacus. They simply recall the abacus in their mind and the problem is still solved correctly.

No, please! Keep your seats!

 

[Mark_Mark]

I hear ya, and have heard others say essentially the same thing, but let me push back a little…if the FCD solves the problem, isn’t the problem solved just the same?

Or, are you like old Miss Racely, “Class, don’t forget to show your work. The answer is wrong if you don’t show your work.” (I just made that up, and mean it humorously, but it’s pretty good, no?)

Edit: that’s really,really, good!

edit, edit: similar to child prodigies solving complex math problems with an abacus but WITHOUT actually having an abacus. They simply recall the abacus in their mind and the problem is still solved correctly.

No, please! Keep your seats!

Wow.. good analogy! and a crimp lover

 

[AJC1]

Wow.. good analogy! and a crimp lover

Your antics amuse me. There isnt really a crimp lover or hater, just those of us who use a crimp correctly in an application that suits it and those who crimp everything or nothing. Using a crimp properly in situations that call for it is the best answer.