Reason's why not to buy a DPMS?

[theflatlander]

I am looking for factual information on why not to buy a DPMS .308. Not just "they are junk" "my friend had one and it was junk" or "all I have read or heard is people say they are junk" I would like to some actual evidence on what problems have occurred with the DPMS .308 line and if these problems still occur? The biggest thing I have heard was that the magazine on the DPMS style AR .308 were unreliable creating feeding issues and that problem has been solved since you can buy PMAG's for them now.

As stated by my other post's I am looking for a 7.62 nato platform rifle and I want something that is AR style. For the price range I was looking in (1500.00) the main three are DPMS, RRA, or Armalite. I narrowed it down between the Armalite and DPMS and the Armalite was coming out on top until I realized the 10A model is only offered in carbine or SSAS model I want something with a free float hand guard,bull barrel, and that takes PMAGS. At this point Armalite is out unless some one can sell me on the carbine model. I started to really look into the DPMS more. The warranty isn't as good as the Armalite DPMS is a 3 year and Armalite is lifetime. DPMS also doesn't have the accuracy guarantee as Armalite has. But everything I still have not heard any complaints in the DPMS department as far as accuracy go's either.

For the base price of the DPMS and what you can get in a factory built rifle its hard not to look at them. the plain Jane Armalite is 1500 bucks with out a free float tube or a two stage trigger. Where in compassion to the DPMS you can get the long range lite with a carbon fiber free float tube and two stage trigger for 1500.00 bucks.

I am really thinking hard about going the DPMS route.

1. I have never seen a Armalite on a shelf any where. Compared to any store that sells .308 AR's has at least one DPMS in the rack.

2. After market parts are more expensive for the Armalite

3. 90 percent I have the builds I read about have at least some type of DPMS brand part on them whether it a barrel, receiver, bcg, or trigger group.

This information alone makes me think DPMS cant be total junk and got a bad rap at first due to poor QC issues. I am looking at these models and I will list them in order which one I want most to least.

compact hunter.
http://www.dpmsinc.com/COMPACT-HUNTER_ep_151-1.html

lite hunter
http://www.dpmsinc.com/LITE-HUNTER_ep_154-1.html

24 special
http://www.dpmsinc.com/24-SPECIAL_ep_140-1.html

lr-308b
http://www.dpmsinc.com/LR-308B_ep_126-1.html

lr-308t
http://www.dpmsinc.com/LR-308T_p_54.html

The only thing I don't like about the lite models is that the gas block is railed. I like the weight of the rifle and the price of the options. If it was you what model would you chose and why? This is going to mainly be a bench rifle, and for coyotes now and then. Also are the two stage DPMS triggers any good?

I'm really having a hard time talking myself out of a DPMS right now for the price and and price of upgrades down the road.

 

[C-grunt]

Im not a fan of their AR15s but I have read many times and from my personal experience that their AR10s are build to a higher standard. Ive known several people with DPMS AR10s and they have all worked well and the owners are happy.

That being said my uncles Remington R25 was horrible. So bad that his dealer agreed to give him a full refund. Im not sure what the difference between the R25s and the DPMS models are.

If I were buying an AR10 I would look for an Armalite or a used LMT or GAP. Ive seen the later two sell for under 2k.

 

[henschman]

The Armalites have chrome lined barrels standard, whereas it's not even an available option on the DPMS. This is important if it is going to be used for battle rifle duties. Chrome lining makes the barrel last about 3x longer, and it helps with reliability, especially when the rifle is dirty. It prevents corrosion and makes it easier and quicker to clean.

Also Armalite uses a forged upper, while DPMS uses an extruded one. I haven't heard of any DPMS uppers breaking, but it is just indicative of a higher level of overall quality.

Also you can get 25 round mags for the Armalite, whereas the biggest you can get in the DPMS is 20 rounds.

DPMS only has the light profile barrels available for the carbine barrels. If you want a 20", your only option is a HBAR or bull barrel, so you are SOL if you want a battle rifle that you can actually carry around in the field. Armalite has the gov't profile 20" chrome lined barrels as well as other options.

 

[theflatlander]

C-grunt. Im not doubting what you are saying but what made the R25 so horrible?

 

[Warp]

The 5.56/AR DPMS rifles I have experience were not reliable.

I haven't yet had anybody give me a good reason to buy a DPMS. When I am spending hundreds and hundreds of dollars, I want a good reason to spend the money. DPMS doesn't seem to have a good reason to get my money.

 

[mr.scott]

Oh the battle rifle, lol.
The DPMS .308s are good to go. Sure you don't get the coolest hand guard or stock on it but you can change them.
The only reason not to get them is if you don't want to hear other people bash them so they can justify their more expensive gun.

 

[Corpral_Agarn]

I bought a DPMS AR15 upper (carbine) and built a Smith and Wesson lower filled with DPMS parts before I read that they were bad...
i haven't had a problem so far. and the trigger on the lower is actually pretty good.

I guess, though, that i am just breaking the 1,000 round mark. For the price it seemed a good idea. I do like the idea of a chrome lined barrel, but it works just fine for now.

 

[Caliper_Mi]

I've handled a DPMS 308 and a RRA LAR8. The DPMS just wasn't made as well, the action felt cheap and it sounded like there was sand in the receiver when you pulled on the charging handle. I handled their basic model so the trigger was typical of any stock AR trigger. It works, could be worse but nothing to write home about. I also don't like how the upper receiver is so bulky on DPMS and the forward assist looks like a glued-on afterthought.

The LAR8 impressed me, felt very good and looks great as well. Ambi bolt release (that isn't an ugly tacked on lever) and ambi mag release. Free float tube available. They all come with RRA's two stage trigger which feels very good. The mags and lack of aftermarket barrel suppliers turns me off a bit to the RRA however.

I've got an Armalite "M15" and if they do the same work on the AR10's as this rifle has, you won't be disappointed. Very good fit and finish, bolt carrier moves so smoothly. I hear very good things about the Armalite pattern mags for the AR10B's.

 

[adelbridge]

I have a Remington R-25 that is nothing more than a camo dipped rebranded DPMS.
DPMS AR-10 clones are built to a much higher standard than their AR-15 lineup. I enjoy my R-25 and it shoots about 1.5 moa with off the shelf ammo. My barrel is 20" chrome lined. I would like 1" groups but I have killed lots of hogs and that is what I bought the gun for. My only real complaint is that the stock trigger had a ton of creep, I couldnt stand it and put in a G-Trigg. The gun is also a little heavy but that is an AR-10 trait. I am probably going to put in a new 22" or 24" threaded stainless barrel one of these days and see if I can get it under 1"

 

[mr.trooper]

I understand. Its tough to cut the BS.

Fact is, the lower of an AR is the lowest stress part on the gun. You can make functioning lowers by sandwiching two pieces of derlin, or even out of a block of wood. It has been done. Total fact... Yet people will tell you an expensive forged lower is a wothwhile upgrade. I cant see how - especially when you consider how few manufacturors of lowers are out there; half a dozen maybe. Most brands of AR are just rifle assemblers, who outsource the actual production to a small handfull of foundrys.

Uppers are even more of a joke. There are even fewer makers of uppers than lowers. I cant help but laugh at the ranking lists for ARs because of this. They are all purchased from the same few foundrys as the next guys.

The only major difference is the internals - and thent its mostly in QC testing. More expensive parts undergo a regiment of magnetic testing. Having this done for you turns a $700 rifle into a $1000 rifle ... even though a spare parts kit is only $75. Talk about getting taken.

DPMS is just fine.

 

[henschman]

I have a Remington R-25 that is nothing more than a camo dipped rebranded DPMS.
DPMS AR-10 clones are built to a much higher standard than their AR-15 lineup. I enjoy my R-25 and it shoots about 1.5 moa with off the shelf ammo. My barrel is 20" chrome lined.

It's chrome moly, not chrome lined. There is a big difference. Chrome moly is just a fancy term for regular steel. Chrome lined means it's a chrome moly barrel with a chromium lining, which is a totally different animal. In any case the Remington R-25 does not have chrome lining as an option, nor does the DPMS LR-308.

 

[taliv]

for the money, the DPMS 308 is a great value. it's a good platform to build on because it's one of the cheapest, and the parts are more compatible than some other brands.

DPMS makes great competition rifles, like their AR15 national match service rifles.

their reputation is only sullied by their "m4" clones which fall far short of the standard. and even that's actually ok, as they are far cheaper than the standard, and thus a reasonable value.

regular steel

uhh? which steel is "regular steel"?

 

[theflatlander]

Basically besides the magazine issue all I have heard said bad about the dpms is the fit and finish is nothing to write home about. Other then that they seem to be a reliable rifle

 

[jrdolall]

I can't speak to the .308 but my .223 DPMS has been completely reliable through maybe 3,000 rounds. I don't crawl through the mud or swim with it but generally stand, kneel or lie prone and shoot at paper inside 200 yards. Very few FTFs and more accurate than I am.

 

[snake_plisskin]

I've had a similar experience as jrdolall. I bought a plain jane dpms ar-15 about 4 years ago and I haven't had any issues at all and its still my go-to-gun. A month or so ago I shot my friends DPMS LR-308 and it was very accurate. Personally I think some people like to "hate" on dpms because they feel the need to justify the fact that they spent more money on their guns.

 

[Txhillbilly]

It always kills me (LOL),when you guy's start talking "Battle Rifle" crap.
The Armalite is a great rifle,as is the RRA,and the DPMS.
A chrome lined barrel in an AR10 platform is really a waste unless you plan on putting a "Legal" Auto sear in it,and then you really don't have to worry about the cost of ammo,because if you can afford the auto sear group your pockets are pretty deep.

I recently purchased a DPMS LR-260H. The fit and finish of the rifle was excellent. The only complaints that I have are (1) The stock trigger is really bad,very gritty,very heavy. (2) The buttstock has some very sharp edges on the butt plate. These are usual problems with a basic factory trigger and an A2 buttstock,and I'd planned on changing both before I bought the rifle.

I researched all of the AR10 platforms very well before I made my purchase,and DPMS seems to have the greatest amount of available accessories,and is a decently made product.
I have built several AR15's,and have used many different Mfg's parts over the years.DPMS products may not be the very best,but they function great and have always been reliable.



I'm waiting for my trigger to get back from Bill Springfield,and then it will get put to the test. I've also changed to an ACE stock and Hogue pistol grip.

 

[guzzi]

One reason to NOT get the DPMS is that your wife may take it away from you.

My wife has a LR-308 with a Leupold Mark 4 16x scope that she really likes. It's way to heavy for her, but she can carry it from the truck to the shooting benches at the range, and that's all that she requires.

The LR-308B you linked to has my attention.

Here is a video of my wife killing a water jug with her LR-308.

 

[jcredman]

I have a DPMS LR-308, it has been a very accurate trouble free rife, but as Txhillbilly said the stock trigger needed work, but other than that its great.

 

[madcratebuilder]

The DPMS LR-308 is a good shooting rifle, I have over 100 rounds through two different rifles that belongs to friends. I have close to 1K rounds through my ArmaLite AR-10.

The major differences are the material used for the receivers. DPMS uses extruded 6000 series aluminum and ArmaLite uses forged 7000 series aluminum. Obviously the 6000 seems to get the job done.

Other differences with the RE. If you have a collapsible stock with the DPMS it's a AR-15 RE with a cut down buffer to compensate for the longer BCG. ArmaLite uses a longer RE with the collapsible stocks.

Since ArmaLite has had the SR-25 magazine for the past year there seems to be more used M14 mag AR-10's on the used market. Some attractive prices on Gunbroker. The ArmaLite Gen II mags are only a few dollar more than Plastic P mags and less than metal mags from LMT and KAC.

The CMMG 7.62 AR looks interesting. Still waiting to get my hands on one to shoot.

ArmaLite gets my recommendation because of superior materials, fit and finish and warranty.

 

[theflatlander]

The thing that really turned me off buying the Armalite is the lack of options with the new model. Other then that it was at the top of my list. I just don't think I'm going to get the accuracy I want with the sixteen inch carbine barrel according to the guarantee. Maybe I will buy the older model and just stick with armalite mags. I'm sure I will just flip a coin when it comes down to it. I heard the armalite uppers and lowers are cut to only match each other. Is that true? also I read something about their being two different types of armalite mags besides the pmag. Is this true?

Unless I can get exactly what I want from armalite i will probably end up with a dpms. I can't see justifying the tool cost right now for one build also. Thanks for all the info guys as of right now I can't see a reason to start out with a dpms base model and then accessorize with the funds permit me too.

 

[Jdillon]

I have a DPMS Prairie Panther in .223 and two LR 308 uppers. Thousands of rounds through the 223 and hundreds through the 308's. Never had an issue and with either of them and accurate enough. I would recommend replacing the factory trigger with an aftermarket trigger such as the Geissele.

 

[Kachok]

I won't touch one because CCM bought them out, they have a well established track record of ruining good companies. Look what they did to Remington, how the heck can you manage to screw up a 1911? (R1 is a POS!) Not to mention the immortal Model 700!

 

[Zoogster]

Basically besides the magazine issue

There is no magazine issue. There is 5,10, 19, 20, 30, 40, and 50 round magazines I have seen for the LR308/R25.

308 weight adds up though in big magazines.

 

[Gunmaster]

There is no reason not to get them unless you want a chrome lined barrel. Now if you want a gun with a chrome lined barrel you pay for it and if you get a DPMS with a non chrome lined you will pay less. If someone has an actual factual proof that DPMS is bad than I would be dumbfounded.

I've had a similar experience as jrdolall. I bought a plain jane dpms ar-15 about 4 years ago and I haven't had any issues at all and its still my go-to-gun. A month or so ago I shot my friends DPMS LR-308 and it was very accurate. Personally I think some people like to "hate" on dpms because they feel the need to justify the fact that they spent more money on their guns.

This applies to 1911's as well.

 

[Warp]

There is no reason not to get them unless you want a chrome lined barrel. Now if you want a gun with a chrome lined barrel you pay for it and if you get a DPMS with a non chrome lined you will pay less. If someone has an actual factual proof that DPMS is bad than I would be dumbfounded.

You think the chrome lining on the barrel is the only material difference between DPMS and some of the other manufacturers??