Remington 1858, Navy, stainless, target, anyone wants it?

Mike B., aka Duelist1954, did a series of videos on Remington's which include descriptions of frame sizes. It's about an hour and a half but if you just want a quick pic there is a good side by side comparison about 20 seconds into part 3.


part 1 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-hWZAonvrA&t=19s

part 2 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DorPo01Mt2o

part 3 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GZZqSD8R58&t=11s

As for a target sighted repro, that's not something I'd be very interested in. A period style dovetail is about as far as I can go. If I need adjustable sights I'd rather get a Ruger Old Army. Now there's an idea, a .36 caliber, smaller framed Ruger Old Army.
 
AlexanderA said:
If you want to shoot modern targets, get a modern gun.
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Too bad that Bill Ruger, who conceived Ruger Old Army, isn't' with us. I guess he will have something to say. Never mind thousands, if not tens of thousands, of us, owners of Ruger Old Army. And those shooting 1858 Target Model, they should have also something to say.
 
Several days ago I had a word with a nice lady from one of firearms manufacturers, and mentioned possible production of 1858, Navy (cal. 36), target, 6.5" barrel. From what I understood (and expected), everything boils down to what will sell on the market.

In that respect, all of you who would like to have such revolver, please post here. Later on I will forward link to her so she could see what is interest for 1858, Navy (cal. 36), target, 6.5".

My guess that they should manufacture some, and see what would be reaction on the market. I would say that crucial issue for success on the market and to continue with production would be quality of those revolvers, read accuracy. Considering what I learned about revolvers, apart from cylinder chambers to barrel lineup, another big one are cylinder chambers' dias and barrel groove dia, and their relationship. Here are dimensions I would like to see:

1. Bullet dia for cal. 36 is .375" (standard bullet size for 36 revolver)
2. Cylinder chambers' dias .372"
3. Barrel groove dia .370"

Last, but not the least, I would like to have an option of second, spare cylinder, fitted to the frame.

With this dimensions we will have a nice tight fit of the ball in cylinder chambers, and that "famous" lead ring when ball is pushed in the chamber.

Regarding .002" larger cylinder chamber dia than barrel groove dia, this will insure that bullet is not undersized when entering the barrel. We all know very well for the problem Ruger had at one time with .450" dia (or even less) cylinder chambers on their 45 Colt Blackhawk revolvers resulting in poor accuracy and severe leading. I had seen a number of reports mentioning significant improvement in accuracy when chambers were open to .452"-.453".

I would appreciate any comment or correction!

Anyhow, potential buyers of Remington 1858, Navy (cal. 36), Target Model, barrel 6.5":

1. Onty, stainless, plus spare cylinder

P.S. Many thanks to 4v50 Gary, our moderator here! I asked him to reopen this thread so we can continue with discussion, and he had done that in no time.
 
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I have an Uberti 1863 New Model Army in Navy caliber (it is not an "1858") that I'm quite fond of. I don't really regret that it's not on a smaller frame. Holds plenty of powder, I can get 30 grains of 4fg under a ball, so it's no "pop gun". Or 24 grains of the same under a 140 grain slug. That's no pop gun either. !!! It has a shorter barrel than the ones in .44, which gives it the feel of a smaller pistol, although it's not.
remnvyotft.jpg
This was owned by Maria Uberti, and was in the 1986 Shot-Show. I've owned it for well over 20 years, it has never cap jammed or failed to fire. I have carried it many a mile, and it's fed me a grouse dinner or two.
 
Onty said:
In that respect, all of you who would like to have such revolver, please post here. Later on I will forward link to her so she could see what is interest for 1858, Navy (cal. 36), target, 6.5".
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Well, if going this far I think it would be important to call it by it's proper designation, which is NOT "1858", no matter how many are stuck on, and using that term. Perhaps it would even sell better, or be more in demand, if properly designated the 1863 Remington Navy. Bad enough that the New Model Army has been labeled as a "1858", but really wrong to introduce a Navy model as such. Seriously, I just can't buy into this "well every one calls it an "1858". !!! One would not refer to an antique car or truck with a model year that was five years off. ??
 
Ugly Sauce said:
Well, if going this far I think it would be important to call it by it's proper designation, which is NOT "1858", no matter how many are stuck on, and using that term. Perhaps it would even sell better, or be more in demand, if properly designated the 1863 Remington Navy. Bad enough that the New Model Army has been labeled as a "1858", but really wrong to introduce a Navy model as such. Seriously, I just can't buy into this "well every one calls it an "1858". !!! One would not refer to an antique car or truck with a model year that was five years off. ??
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How about a ‘53 DuoGlide?
 
Ugly Sauce said:
Well, if going this far I think it would be important to call it by it's proper designation, which is NOT "1858", no matter how many are stuck on, and using that term. Perhaps it would even sell better, or be more in demand, if properly designated the 1863 Remington Navy. Bad enough that the New Model Army has been labeled as a "1858", but really wrong to introduce a Navy model as such. Seriously, I just can't buy into this "well every one calls it an "1858". !!! One would not refer to an antique car or truck with a model year that was five years off. ??
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Technically, you are right. However (and unfortunately):

"Pietta 1858 Remington New Model Navy Black Powder Revolver 36 Caliber 6.375" Barrel Steel Frame Blue" https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1002264016?pid=311355

"1858 Navy During the Civil War, the U.S. Navy purchased about 4,300 of the 28,000 Remington New Model Navy revolvers produced. Manufactured from 1863-1878 and now commonly known as the 1858 Navy, this medium-powered .36 caliber cap-and-ball sixgun was well liked by Union sailors and others who packed them." https://www.cimarron-firearms.com/cimarron-1858-remington-navy-36-cal-7-5-in.html

"Remington 1858 New Model, .36 Navy and .44 Army" https://www.dixiegunworks.com/index...ington+1858+New+Model,+.36+Navy+and+.44+Army/

"Hence the name 1858 NEW MODEL NAVY .36 cal., given to distinguish it from the .44 cal. version. Our range covers also customized versions, fully idenfical in the mechanism but with small cosmetic variations, such as the 1858 NEW MODEL ARMY TARGET .36/.44 cal.,with adjustable front and rear sights, or like the 1858 NEW MODEL ARMY NICKEL .36/.44 ca1., available with a brass frame or steel frame." https://www.pietta.us/products/Muzzleloadinguns/Remington/index.html

And so on https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&q=remington+1858+navy+36#ip=1
 
Ugly Sauce said:
Well, if going this far I think it would be important to call it by it's proper designation, which is NOT "1858", no matter how many are stuck on, and using that term. Perhaps it would even sell better, or be more in demand, if properly designated the 1863 Remington Navy. Bad enough that the New Model Army has been labeled as a "1858", but really wrong to introduce a Navy model as such. Seriously, I just can't buy into this "well every one calls it an "1858". !!! One would not refer to an antique car or truck with a model year that was five years off. ??
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It kinda bugs me but I say 58 just for simplicity's sake. If I say 63 so many people don't know what I'm talking about and I have to explain the whole thing. To be honest .45 Long Colt bugs me more even tho people have been calling it that for well over 100 years.
 
Ugly Sauce said:
Oh yeah, I realize that. But to stop perpetuating it we should start somewhere. I mean, all of the above is wrong, even though you are correctly pointing it out. :)
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To be frank, when talking about today's revolvers, both of us are correct. And wrong. None of those cal. .36 revolvers are Navy. However, from what I understand, all current production of "Navy" revolvers are actually made on large 44 frame. In that respect, I think that the most appropriate title should be "Remington 1858 pattern...". ;)

Just my .2 cents...
 
A like this .36 New Model Police Revolver https://www.littlegun.info/arme americaine/remington/a remington new model 1863 gb.htm :

remington%20new%20model%201863-01.JPG


The trigger is IMO much better design than on other similar revolvers
 
1KPerDay said:
I’d be very interested in a true accurate sized Remington belt model or navy replica.
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And trigger as on New Model Police Revolver!

As for "true accurate sized Remington...Navy", I agree with you. However, I am afraid we are not going to see it. Smaller size frame will require new tooling and another manufacturing process, because everything has to be scaled down.
 
AlexanderA said:
Those modern target sights on the Remington !858 look so anachronistic!

I can see the appeal in places like Europe where cartridge revolvers are so restricted. But in the U.S., we don't have that excuse. If you want to shoot modern targets, get a modern gun.
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Not for me. I mean, yeah, the full-on adjustable target sights might be a bit much, but the tiny little "V notch and brass pip" arrangement can be the limiting factor on a repro. Especially for folks who put hundreds of dollars into making one of these things reliable and accurate, why then handicap yourself with nearly useless sights that can't be adjusted and don't hit anywhere close to POA?
 
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