Request for open carry in Texas

[DKSuddeth]

I just sent off a couple of letters to my representative and Dr. Suzanna Hupp requesting open carry. below is the letter. All Texans should start doing this. It's time to restore our second amendment rights and put us closer to the free states of AK and VT.

Mr. *****, It's been over 10 years now since the state of Texas restored part of americans second amendment rights by licensing for carrying a concealed weapon. I think it is time to further restore the right of all texans second amendment rights after the 5th circuit court of appeals ruling declaring the second amendment as an individual right. I would like to see our texas legislature repeal Texas state code § 46.02 and allow for the open carrying of a firearm for all law abiding texas citizens. Currently, 11 states of the union have no laws against their citizens openly carrying a firearm and have experienced no major problems, similar to the non-eventful years after Texas legalized licensed conceal carry. Nine states have Licensed open carry with full state wide pre-emption against municipalities making more restrictive carry laws and have similar results as well. Nineteen states have open carry generally permitted but have no statewide pre-emption which allows for municipalities to enact their own carry legislation which makes it extremely difficult to exercise your second amendment right. There have even been instances where citizens have been arrested for breaking no law simply because they were carrying, within the law, and causes major problems for that individual. Texas is one of eleven states that have no open carry allowances. That puts us in a group with extremely liberal states like New York, Illinois, New Jersey, and Maryland. United states citizens, and Texas citizens, are becoming more aware of their second amendment rights and I feel that it is now time to remove the restrictions of our constitutional rights. Please submit and enact legislation to allow unlicensed open carry for all law abiding citizens who are legally allowed to own firearms.
Thank you.

 

[LawDog]

Done.

LawDog

 

[ball3006]

Why do you want.....

open carry? It just draws attention to yourself........When I hose a bad guy, I want it to be a BIG SURPRISE.......chris3

 

[DKSuddeth]

If you don't like open carry, that is your choice, but others do so theres no need to turn this thread in to the advantages/disadvantages of concealed over open etc.

 

[phoglund]

If you want to be able to suprise the BG, carry open and concealed!

 

[Henry Bowman]

If you don't like open carry, that is your choice, but others do so theres no need to turn this thread in to the advantages/disadvantages of concealed over open etc.

Exactly. Allowing open carry does not require you to do so.

Please keep this thread on track.

 

[Art Eatman]

If such legislation gets introduced, it would sure be a hoot to attend the sub-committee hearings. The antis and the editorials would be absolutely berzerkoid!

Just because their last "There will be blood in the streets!!!" was wrong won't affect them any...

, Art

 

[Charles S]

"An armed society is a polite society" Robert A. Heinlein

Charles

 

[LawDog]

Why do you want.....open carry?

So that when Joe Citizen gets caught by a breeze that blows his jacket open showing his M1911 clone in a snazzy OWB holster to a busload of soccermommies, the local DA (Harris County, *cough, cough*) can't jack him up for failing to carry concealed.

LawDog

 

[Ivy Mike]

Suzanna Hupp was the Texas rep that had her parents executed right in front of her over dinner one night.
http://www.gunownersalliance.com/hupp-10.htm

Perhaps an appeal mentioning that would help.

 

[AndyC]

So that when Joe Citizen gets caught by a breeze that blows his jacket open showing his M1911 clone in a snazzy OWB holster to a busload of soccermommies, the local DA (Harris County, *cough, cough*) can't jack him up for failing to carry concealed.

What, you mean that has actually happened?

 

[Standing Wolf]

I carry openly about a third of the time in Colorado. I don't understand why Texans can't do likewise.

 

[DKSuddeth]

Suzanna Hupp was the Texas rep that had her parents executed right in front of her over dinner one night.
http://www.gunownersalliance.com/hupp-10.htm

Perhaps an appeal mentioning that would help.

she got one as well

 

[Spreadfire Arms]

im not certain, from a pragmatic aspect, that open carry will pass in Texas. Texas is trying to maintain their position as a progressive, cutting-edge state. displaying guns on people's hips in plain view, while seemingly okay to pro-2A people, may make others uncomfortable.

to us, having a gun displayed isn't a big deal. to others, the sheer presence of a gun on someone's hip may make them squeamish.

for example, you are in a public place and you see a transvestite (cross-dresser) in the same place. you may not feel comfortable seeing a cross-dresser standing so close to you and your kids.

the same feeling can be derived from a person who has a phobia of guns. their phobia of guns really isn't any different than a phobia of cross-dressers.

im not saying that i am anti open-carry or pro-open carry, but my feeling is that this will not be adopted by the Texas goverment.

 

[Maxwell]

displaying guns on people's hips in plain view, while seemingly okay to pro-2A people, may make others uncomfortable.

The world was pleanty uncomfortable with what they saw as a bunch of gun toting cowboys when CCW passed. They were wrong then, so dont worry about what they have to say now.

Open carry removes the main penalty of ccw, trying to keep it hidden. Open carry is simply a convienience issue for the good guys, but thats what we're shooting for in the long run. To make buying, keeping and carrying guns easier for everyone.

If nothing else you can carry without the anti-guns having legal ground to bitch about it every time the wind blows.

 

[Spreadfire Arms]

Open carry is simply a convienience issue for the good guys, but thats what we're shooting for in the long run.

yes but the anti's, and the big Texas cities are run by anti's, will argue that it will arm gang bangers.

there are plenty of gang members in Texas that do not have a felony on their record to prevent them from possessing a firearm. so, while they may have a misdemeanor that would deny them on a brady check, they can still purchase a gun from another private party which is legal in Texas, so long as the firearm isn't stolen, the buyer is at least 21 years of age, and is a Texas resident.

the anti's in the big cities will probably argue that this law would allow gang members that have not yet been convicted of a felony to legally carry a handgun.

while it is a good idea for the good guys, it would need to be written in a way to curb the idiots (bad guys who are not yet convicted felons) from carrying handguns, in order for it to pass as a law.

i am not for or against open carry, i am just analyzing the potential arguments the anti open-carry crowd will have.

personally because of big cities like Dallas and Houston, and political clout their governments have (who all happen to be anti-gun), i don't see open carry happening in Texas.

at best the CHL could be modified to be for either open or concealed carry, but "Concealed Handgun License" means concealed....so....i don't think it will happen either.

 

[richyoung]

there are plenty of gang members in Texas that do not have a felony on their record to prevent them from possessing a firearm. so, while they may have a misdemeanor that would deny them on a brady check, they can still purchase a gun from another private party which is legal in Texas, so long as the firearm isn't stolen, the buyer is at least 21 years of age, and is a Texas resident.

the anti's in the big cities will probably argue that this law would allow gang members that have not yet been convicted of a felony to legally carry a handgun.

Don't care. If they can legally carry, and want to carry, more power to them. Never seen a "gang banger" yet that didn't carry concealed, DESPITE not having a CCW permit. Besides, the people living in those blighted areas are the ones most in need of protection - so just how do you determine "banger" status? Baggy jeans? Music taste? Neighborhood? Income? SKIN COLOR, maybe? Besides if this law was passed, maybe DAs would be less likely to plead those felonies down to MDs...

 

[Spreadfire Arms]

If they can legally carry, and want to carry, more power to them.

and that is exactly the image that big city governments would not want. gang bangers (or ones that look like gang bangers) wearing gold grilles, jerseys, flying colors, and packing handguns in plain view.

also this will probably not win the support of law enforcement who would have to go and approach legally armed gang bangers.

 

[Al Norris]

the anti's in the big cities will probably argue that this law would allow gang members that have not yet been convicted of a felony to legally carry a handgun.

Over here in Idaho, we had a bill that would have allowed for concealed carry without a permit, anywhere in the State. That was pretty much the argument used to kill that bill.

My response was to the Idaho FOP: What makes you think they aren't carrying now?

IFOP: But this will make it worse. We want a mandatory law that would make it a misdemeanor if you failed to notify us if you were carrying. (very similar to the Texas law)

Me: What makes you think the gang bangers would obey this law?

IFOP: It would give us another tool to use in terry stops if they didn't.

Me: What good is the tool if it's not obeyed, and you have no reasonable suspicion for the terry stop?

IFOP: We want the tool or we are against the bill.

...the bill was held in committee.

 

[Ivy Mike]

Spreadfire, what you seem to be missing is that its not the style of carry you choose to employ.

Its whether or not you actually use your gun that truly matters. If a gang banger doesn't have a felony on his record, then he isn't really a criminal in the eyes of the law and shouldn't be prevented from owning or carrying a firearm.
Equal protection under the law.

Now, the second you go outside the law, then you lose your right to carry at all...but thats already on the books.

 

[Gray Peterson]

Btw, before anyone starts saying "gangbangers carrying"

I think the proposal here would be quite similar to TN, MN, IA, and IN where you need a permit to carry openly or concealed.

I agree with the idea of this. Gang bangers won't get permits. You have to spend how much money to get a Texas CHL? $140? The Course costs anywhere from $100 to $250, and a handgun costs even more if you're starting out fresh.

 

[Maxwell]

CCW is not a new thing, its a right criminals have enjoyed for the last few decades simply because they dont care about the law and work hard not to get caught.
What CCW legislation has done is to reduce the penalty to the point where normal citizens can carry their weapons after ample paperwork. Problem is now they must keep these weapons hidden at all times.

If a criminal is knowingly armed illegally, he's going to hide it. This does not change the behavior of gang bangers.
If you brandish your weapon or use the fact that your armed to push other citizens around, theres alot of laws against that already.

What it does is make it so legal gun owners are not forced to sneak around town as if their in violation of a law. Its their gun, they own it, they've done the paperwork, why force them to hide it?
Maybe from a tactical viewpoint its often smarter to carry it hidden than carry exposed, but thats a personal choice which should be based on your manner of dress and activity.
Not on the fears of some old lady with nothing to do but phone in suspected gun owners.

 

[Spreadfire Arms]

I think it is time to further restore the right of all texans second amendment rights after the 5th circuit court of appeals ruling declaring the second amendment as an individual right. I would like to see our texas legislature repeal Texas state code § 46.02 and allow for the open carrying of a firearm for all law abiding texas citizens.

Lonnie,

the letter in the original post above asks for 46.02 Penal Code to be repealed (unlawful carry of weapon) which would allow open carry without a permit.

i agree with you, it would be easier to pass if it were regulated via a permit.

Clean97GTI wrote:

Its whether or not you actually use your gun that truly matters. If a gang banger doesn't have a felony on his record, then he isn't really a criminal in the eyes of the law and shouldn't be prevented from owning or carrying a firearm.
Equal protection under the law.

actually, he can be a criminal, just not a felon in the eyes of the law, i think that is what you meant.

and you are 100% correct. and THAT is why this law will probably not ever get repealed, because they cannot exclude gang bangers.

 

[Ivy Mike]

You know, this whole thing strikes me as very odd.
Texas with its supposedly lax firearm laws forbids its people the right to carry a weapon openly.

I'm going to remember that next time I visit my mother in AZ and see guys walking around with 6" S&W on their hips in old leather holsters.

Its legal here in NV too although people seldom carry openly in Las Vegas.

 

[Desertdog]

IMHO there are several reasons it could be benificial to carry openly, provided you can open carry without a permit.

The main reason I can think of is, if no permits needed, you could protect yourself without all the hoops you have to jump through to get a CCW.

Some people just can't afford the cost of obtaining a CCW. If they just can't afford a CCW, they are prevented from legally protecting themselves with firearms, while away from home.

I am sure other people can think of other reasons for open carry.