Reliability:
It is unknown at this point. I had 2 failure to chamber, 1 failure of slide to return to full forward position, and 1 failure to slide lock on empty magazine. I am not concerned about the slide failing to lock, because it seems like I blocked the slide lock from moving by accident. I consciously positioned my thumb down for the rest of the shooting, just for the purpose of testing, and it did not occur again. Failure for the slide returning to full forward position, although it should not happen, also does not concern me that much because it often happens on a new guns with tight parts, and it did not occur again. The failure to return to battery, I belive, is also related to the super high tension extractor making it hard for the round to slide up the extractor which needs to occur for the slide to go full forward position. I don't know why, but M&P has the highest extractor tension of any pistol with an external extractor that I have ever experienced. I guess these people are firm believers in high extractor tension. Their M&P-15T comes with the semi-rigid insert in the extractor spring and the O-ring surrounding it.
The two incidents of failure to chamber were a concern. But, there is nothing obviously wrong with the gun. The problem is harder to diagnose because the two malfunctions were more than 200 rounds apart. I believe the cause was a compound effect of super high tension extractor that was not cleaned so well after taking it out of the box making it hard for the rim of the round to slide in, chamber likely with test firing and packing oil residue not suited for lubrication that was not cleaned, and gun not gripped in a secure manner, with the lower frame abruptly shifting around in my hand during recoil (I believe this is what people often misdiagnose as “limp-wristing.” I believe a light weight frame pistol can malfunction this way without no problem in the wrist itself. Also, note that these “limp wristing” reported mostly involves kids or not so strong people.) .
I changed the grip panel to medium size, and that made the grip more secure. The gun did not abruptly shift in my grip any more. After the grip panel change and cleaning, I fired 200 additional rounds with no malfunctions. All malfunctions were with Winchester USA 165 gr. There was no malfunction with 2 full magazine of Speer GDHP 165 gr. I have fired.
I do not expect to see any more malfunctions, since I did not see any cause of concern during the last 200 rounds, and all possible causes of the problem are believed to be removed. But, how it will do in the future is still an unknown.
Trigger:
At first, I did not like the trigger so much. However, after about 1200~1400 pulls with the striker engaged, it turned in to probably the best striker trigger I've experienced so far.
Out of the box, it was lot heavier than another M&P 40 I have purchased earlier, and the final stage of the pull where the sear slides off the striker was very abrasive. Think Glock trigger, but only marginally lighter. Lyman trigger gauge indicated about 7~ 7 lb 4 oz.
After two range trips, firing over 700 rounds, and some dry firing, the trigger pull smoothed up and also got lighter. I also moved the trigger through the final stage of the pull, pulling it near the verge of striker release point, then releasing it. The combined number of pull with the striker engaged would be about 1200~1400 pulls. The pull became a very cleaner feel compared to when I got it out of the box. The Lyman gauge now indicates approximately 6lb 12oz ~ 7 lb, averaging about 6 lb 15 oz. Not significantly lighter than before, but lot easier to control the trigger because the trigger pull is not as abrasive.
The trigger reset is audible and reset has an affirmative feel. However, it is not as hard as that of a Glock that feels like it slaps my finger forward.
I do not use terms like “best” lightly. Let me explain why I believe this is the best trigger configuration for me. But, keep in mind that I do believe it can be improved, and I am not completely satisfied with it. The reasoning that follows may or may not apply to you.
The way I operate the trigger on these type of pistols is to pull the trigger until it meets the point there the trigger resistance increases at the point where it would start the sear movement to release the striker, pulling out the “slack,” while I bring the gun to aiming position. I would then pull the trigger though the final stage when the aim is good enough. This is the reason why the final stage of the pull has to be free from excessive abrasiveness or excessive resistance. I will have to quickly increase the pressure on the trigger, and it should start moving with minimum disruption to the aim. This stage must not be abrasive in feel. Optimum resistance range would be about 2.5 ~ 3 kg (around 5 lb 8 oz ~ 6 lb 10 oz). The current average on this M&P is about 5 oz heavier, but I can live with that. When the slack is pulled, the pressure exerted at that point is around 3~4 lb or so. I would “pull out the slack” and sort of work the rest of the way like I am pulling a DAO revolver. So, if the trigger is abrasive in release or have to high of a resistance, it would take a lot longer for me to get the shot off or suffer reduced accuracy.
Now, some would question, why not prep the trigger near the point of sear releasing the striker, like prepping it near 6 lb on a 7 lb trigger? I have tried it. It actually works good on a range. I had success with it with a Glock 22, allowing me to work it like a single action trigger. There is a reason why I stopped doing that. The primary reason is that I am not a human Lyman gauge. When I am aggressively prepping a 7 lb trigger, there is no way for me to know if my trigger finger is exerting 5 lb or 7 lb 1 oz. If I am just shooting for game score, my first shot going over the target while I am prepping the trigger because I exerted 7 lb 1 oz when I felt like my finger was exerting 6 lb, or my 2 shot controlled pair occasionally turning into a 2 round burst may not be a huge deal. But, when in public shooting for combat, it is not so acceptable.
“But, if you train enough, that won't be a problem.” I disagree. First, any control by “feel” alone is very unreliable. Even, a simple mood change can change perception on pressure, pain, etc. More training may reduce the probability of the error, but it does not get rid of it. Sure, if I fire hundreds of round daily, or weekly, then I probably might have a “muscle memory” of how exerting 6 lb and 6.5 lb feels different and retain that memory for a week or so, but I don't have enough resources to shoot on a daily or weekly basis. And, even highly skilled shooters confess they get messed up when they did not shoot for a certain period of time to keep that “muscle memory” alive. Another reason is that the trigger itself is not so consistent. If you put these striker fired pistol to the trigger gauge, you'll find that the pressure at exact release point is different with each pull. This will be further affected by lubrication and contamination of the trigger mechanism. So, even if you are consistent as a human trigger gauge, your gun won't be.
Trigger resistance being too low, below 2.5 kg, is also not good for me. That was the case with Walther PPQ. Glock advertises 5.5 lb trigger, but the actual resistance is lot higher. PPQ has an opposite problem. It is actually lower than the advertised 5.5 lb. And, when I don't take caution to not go beyond just pulling the slack, I get occasional firing too early or unintended 2 round bursts.
It seems like S&W took a long time slowly phasing out the old trigger on a part by part basis. I waited a long time for S&W to put the new trigger on the market. I dry fired an M&P 40 a few months ago, and that one had a very nice pull out of the box, but it did not have a reset with an affirmative feel. The M&P 40 I have purchased before that had neither a very nice pull or an affirmative feeling reset.
At this point, I do not feel the need for any after market trigger modification for this one.
Accuracy / Sights:
I did not bench shoot it for groups, so I don't have a definitive data. I had no problems hitting 6 inch circle plate at 35 yards. When I missed, it was mostly when I could tell that my aim or trigger pull was not so good. I could see the impact most of the time when I thought I should see an impact. Smallest target I've shot was a 4 inch square plate at 35 yards. I was hitting better than I was hitting those targets with a Glock 22. This is not to suggest Glock is less accurate. M&P ergonomically suits me a lot better, so probably that also affected the outcome. I would expect to hit a lot better than I did before, since the trigger is a whole lot better now. Anyway, there is nothing in the shooting results that suggested that this gun was suffering from the 9mm M&P accuracy problems reported by some people.
The pistol came with 3 dot night sights. The sights were zeroed well for hitting the above mentioned targets at 35 yards with the traditional sights zeroing method, with the top center of front sight as sight reference point on the point of aim. No adjustments were necessary.
Although it was not without some initial problems, I feel good about the purchase. If it does not show any problems in the future, and I don't expect any, it would fill its role well.
This is a version with no manual firing inhibitor device, no internal lock, as I do not want them on my pistols.
It is unknown at this point. I had 2 failure to chamber, 1 failure of slide to return to full forward position, and 1 failure to slide lock on empty magazine. I am not concerned about the slide failing to lock, because it seems like I blocked the slide lock from moving by accident. I consciously positioned my thumb down for the rest of the shooting, just for the purpose of testing, and it did not occur again. Failure for the slide returning to full forward position, although it should not happen, also does not concern me that much because it often happens on a new guns with tight parts, and it did not occur again. The failure to return to battery, I belive, is also related to the super high tension extractor making it hard for the round to slide up the extractor which needs to occur for the slide to go full forward position. I don't know why, but M&P has the highest extractor tension of any pistol with an external extractor that I have ever experienced. I guess these people are firm believers in high extractor tension. Their M&P-15T comes with the semi-rigid insert in the extractor spring and the O-ring surrounding it.
The two incidents of failure to chamber were a concern. But, there is nothing obviously wrong with the gun. The problem is harder to diagnose because the two malfunctions were more than 200 rounds apart. I believe the cause was a compound effect of super high tension extractor that was not cleaned so well after taking it out of the box making it hard for the rim of the round to slide in, chamber likely with test firing and packing oil residue not suited for lubrication that was not cleaned, and gun not gripped in a secure manner, with the lower frame abruptly shifting around in my hand during recoil (I believe this is what people often misdiagnose as “limp-wristing.” I believe a light weight frame pistol can malfunction this way without no problem in the wrist itself. Also, note that these “limp wristing” reported mostly involves kids or not so strong people.) .
I changed the grip panel to medium size, and that made the grip more secure. The gun did not abruptly shift in my grip any more. After the grip panel change and cleaning, I fired 200 additional rounds with no malfunctions. All malfunctions were with Winchester USA 165 gr. There was no malfunction with 2 full magazine of Speer GDHP 165 gr. I have fired.
I do not expect to see any more malfunctions, since I did not see any cause of concern during the last 200 rounds, and all possible causes of the problem are believed to be removed. But, how it will do in the future is still an unknown.
Trigger:
At first, I did not like the trigger so much. However, after about 1200~1400 pulls with the striker engaged, it turned in to probably the best striker trigger I've experienced so far.
Out of the box, it was lot heavier than another M&P 40 I have purchased earlier, and the final stage of the pull where the sear slides off the striker was very abrasive. Think Glock trigger, but only marginally lighter. Lyman trigger gauge indicated about 7~ 7 lb 4 oz.
After two range trips, firing over 700 rounds, and some dry firing, the trigger pull smoothed up and also got lighter. I also moved the trigger through the final stage of the pull, pulling it near the verge of striker release point, then releasing it. The combined number of pull with the striker engaged would be about 1200~1400 pulls. The pull became a very cleaner feel compared to when I got it out of the box. The Lyman gauge now indicates approximately 6lb 12oz ~ 7 lb, averaging about 6 lb 15 oz. Not significantly lighter than before, but lot easier to control the trigger because the trigger pull is not as abrasive.
The trigger reset is audible and reset has an affirmative feel. However, it is not as hard as that of a Glock that feels like it slaps my finger forward.
I do not use terms like “best” lightly. Let me explain why I believe this is the best trigger configuration for me. But, keep in mind that I do believe it can be improved, and I am not completely satisfied with it. The reasoning that follows may or may not apply to you.
The way I operate the trigger on these type of pistols is to pull the trigger until it meets the point there the trigger resistance increases at the point where it would start the sear movement to release the striker, pulling out the “slack,” while I bring the gun to aiming position. I would then pull the trigger though the final stage when the aim is good enough. This is the reason why the final stage of the pull has to be free from excessive abrasiveness or excessive resistance. I will have to quickly increase the pressure on the trigger, and it should start moving with minimum disruption to the aim. This stage must not be abrasive in feel. Optimum resistance range would be about 2.5 ~ 3 kg (around 5 lb 8 oz ~ 6 lb 10 oz). The current average on this M&P is about 5 oz heavier, but I can live with that. When the slack is pulled, the pressure exerted at that point is around 3~4 lb or so. I would “pull out the slack” and sort of work the rest of the way like I am pulling a DAO revolver. So, if the trigger is abrasive in release or have to high of a resistance, it would take a lot longer for me to get the shot off or suffer reduced accuracy.
Now, some would question, why not prep the trigger near the point of sear releasing the striker, like prepping it near 6 lb on a 7 lb trigger? I have tried it. It actually works good on a range. I had success with it with a Glock 22, allowing me to work it like a single action trigger. There is a reason why I stopped doing that. The primary reason is that I am not a human Lyman gauge. When I am aggressively prepping a 7 lb trigger, there is no way for me to know if my trigger finger is exerting 5 lb or 7 lb 1 oz. If I am just shooting for game score, my first shot going over the target while I am prepping the trigger because I exerted 7 lb 1 oz when I felt like my finger was exerting 6 lb, or my 2 shot controlled pair occasionally turning into a 2 round burst may not be a huge deal. But, when in public shooting for combat, it is not so acceptable.
“But, if you train enough, that won't be a problem.” I disagree. First, any control by “feel” alone is very unreliable. Even, a simple mood change can change perception on pressure, pain, etc. More training may reduce the probability of the error, but it does not get rid of it. Sure, if I fire hundreds of round daily, or weekly, then I probably might have a “muscle memory” of how exerting 6 lb and 6.5 lb feels different and retain that memory for a week or so, but I don't have enough resources to shoot on a daily or weekly basis. And, even highly skilled shooters confess they get messed up when they did not shoot for a certain period of time to keep that “muscle memory” alive. Another reason is that the trigger itself is not so consistent. If you put these striker fired pistol to the trigger gauge, you'll find that the pressure at exact release point is different with each pull. This will be further affected by lubrication and contamination of the trigger mechanism. So, even if you are consistent as a human trigger gauge, your gun won't be.
Trigger resistance being too low, below 2.5 kg, is also not good for me. That was the case with Walther PPQ. Glock advertises 5.5 lb trigger, but the actual resistance is lot higher. PPQ has an opposite problem. It is actually lower than the advertised 5.5 lb. And, when I don't take caution to not go beyond just pulling the slack, I get occasional firing too early or unintended 2 round bursts.
It seems like S&W took a long time slowly phasing out the old trigger on a part by part basis. I waited a long time for S&W to put the new trigger on the market. I dry fired an M&P 40 a few months ago, and that one had a very nice pull out of the box, but it did not have a reset with an affirmative feel. The M&P 40 I have purchased before that had neither a very nice pull or an affirmative feeling reset.
At this point, I do not feel the need for any after market trigger modification for this one.
Accuracy / Sights:
I did not bench shoot it for groups, so I don't have a definitive data. I had no problems hitting 6 inch circle plate at 35 yards. When I missed, it was mostly when I could tell that my aim or trigger pull was not so good. I could see the impact most of the time when I thought I should see an impact. Smallest target I've shot was a 4 inch square plate at 35 yards. I was hitting better than I was hitting those targets with a Glock 22. This is not to suggest Glock is less accurate. M&P ergonomically suits me a lot better, so probably that also affected the outcome. I would expect to hit a lot better than I did before, since the trigger is a whole lot better now. Anyway, there is nothing in the shooting results that suggested that this gun was suffering from the 9mm M&P accuracy problems reported by some people.
The pistol came with 3 dot night sights. The sights were zeroed well for hitting the above mentioned targets at 35 yards with the traditional sights zeroing method, with the top center of front sight as sight reference point on the point of aim. No adjustments were necessary.
Although it was not without some initial problems, I feel good about the purchase. If it does not show any problems in the future, and I don't expect any, it would fill its role well.
This is a version with no manual firing inhibitor device, no internal lock, as I do not want them on my pistols.
