Rimfire Accuracy Question Two

Status
Not open for further replies.

rskent

Member
Joined
May 28, 2006
Messages
2,747
Location
The land of blue sky and sunshine
What makes for an accurate 22lr rifle?

I have also enjoyed reading the “Rimfire Prove It” thread. While I was reading I was wondering “what makes for an accurate 22lr rifle”? Is it the barrel? The length? The chamber? The twist? I love shooting my little CMMG. But I don’t think I would call it accurate. What makes a truly accurate 22lr?
 
#1: A quality rifle.
#2: Quality ammunition.

I have a Sako P04 I use for small bore silhouette. It will shoot cheap Winchester or Remington ammo into about 3" at 50 yards. It will shoot Eley Target into less than 1/2" at 50 yards. As the Ram silhouette is about 6.5" wide x 5.5" high, it is easy to see accurate ammo is essential to a competitor's potential to score.

On the other hand, I use an old Remington 742 slide action for plinking and any ol' ammo is sufficient if it will go 'bang'.

It all depends on how much precision you desire. the Sako is not cheap, but it is not as expensive as, say, an Anschutz. Where I can routinely get better than 1" at 100 yards for a 5 round group on a windless day from a solid bench rest, my buddy's Anschutz will often do 1/2" with its favorite ammo.

I expect to pay $12 to $20 per box of 50 rounds for quality target ammo. My last brick of RWS R100 was just over $18 per box or $180 for the brick.
 
The only thing you listed that ISNT really a consideration (unless you count sight radius on iron sights rifles) is barrel length.

Generally any "accuracy" is based on consistency, tighter tolerances equals better inherent accuracy.
 
It is a package-lots of factors have bearing on the accuracy of the rifle and ammo combo. However, while even cheap barrels can be good barrels with modern manufacturing methods and the experts tell us that firing pin shape and size effects ignition consistency and group size.... the single biggest factor in . 22 LR accuracy outside of the ammunition is the CHAMBER in my opinion. Target chambers(and top performing sporters) are cut tighter and so that the bullet is already in the lands upon firing. Tight tolerances in the chamber start every round as consistently as possible.
 
All the replies above are absolutely accurate and noteworthy.
Once all the hardware tolerances are refined to the nth degree, the next thing is the ammo. I have been guilty of weighing the individual cartridges and grouping them by 10ths of a grain. (You might be surprised how much variation there can be.) In such a tiny cartridge, minute variations can show significant differences at 100 yards. What if that .2 grain is a void in the bullet? Is the void off center? Near the nose? And on, and on, and on, ad infinitum.

....And I have a shooting buddy that measures the thickness of the cartridge rims to insure the consistency of the headspace from round to round....

IMHO, how fine a hair is split is directly proportional to how anal the individual shooter strives to be. Precision in rimfire rifles is no accident.
 
It all depends on how much precision you desire. the Sako is not cheap, but it is not as expensive as, say, an Anschutz. Where I can routinely get better than 1" at 100 yards for a 5 round group on a windless day from a solid bench rest, my buddy's Anschutz will often do 1/2" with its favorite ammo.

OK, Let’s use an Anschutz as an example. What is different about your buddy’s rifle? Why does his shoot ½” and yours an inch. By the way, to me, an inch at a hundred is very impressive for a 22.
 
OK, Let’s use an Anschutz as an example. What is different about your buddy’s rifle? Why does his shoot ½” and yours an inch. By the way, to me, an inch at a hundred is very impressive for a 22.
Yes, 1" at 100 yards for a .22 is impressive. Yet it is not as uncommon as you might think, though, when a quality rifle is matched with its preferred ammunition. That takes a lot of experimentation to find a rifle's most preferred ammo.

First of all, I am not a gunsmith, nor do I aspire to be one. I am not an expert of any kind. I have gathered my meager knowledge over 50 years of competition shooting beginning with NRA 50ft indoor smallbore with a local rifle club when I was 11.
If you lay my Sako P04 next to my friend's Anschutz, there are a few things that immediately stand out. (Keep in mind the Sako P04 is a "Hunter" class rifle versus the "Standard" class Anschutz.) His Anschutz is a competition grade rifle that he paid in the neighborhood of $1,800 - $2,000 for several years ago. The barrel is heavier, his stock is heavier, the overall weight is more than 2x heavier. I know the chamber in his rifle is a match grade chamber and that his barrel is hand lapped and air gauged. The Anschutz trigger is adjusted to 10 oz. and is extremely smooth and consistent. His scope is an older Unertl, but is incredibly clear with a fine crosshair with target dot reticle and 1/8" per click adjustments at 100 meters. (My scope is a 6.5-20x50 side focus Vortex with a duplex reticle; 1/4" per click at 100 yards.)
The Sako P04 is a fine rifle in its own right, but does not have anywhere near the refinement as the Anschutz. But then, I paid less than 1/2 as much for the Sako as he did for the Anschutz. With all that said, a rifle is only as good as the ammunition and even with both of those, rifle and perfectly matched ammo, the combination can only be as good as the shooter.
When my friend's Anschutz is shooting 1/2" groups at 100 meters, it is with his competition ammo that has been culled specifically for his rifle under perfect conditions and he is having a 'best' range day.
When he tested match grade ammo and found the best shooting brand and lot number, he bought a case of that ammunition. It cost him a little over $1,900 for 5k rounds. He then culled them by weight and then again by rim thickness. He netted just under 2k rounds of what he considers match competition ammo he uses strictly for matches. The rest is practice. And he practices a heck of a lot! He says a case of ammo lasts him almost 2 years.

I hope this is helpful.
 
I hope this is helpful.

Very helpful and very interesting.

The rifle part: Makes sense, a good quality rifle with a match chamber. Good optic. Good trigger. Good trigger.

One question. It seems like most target 22’s are bolt actions, is it possible to have a match chamber in an autoloader?

The ammo part: Geeze, it seems like your friend fusses over his ammo. I do get it. Shooting good scores with a centerfire match rifle starts in the loading room. Loading ammunition to fit the gun is part of it.

One question. There are 223 loads that you can buy that almost always work well. Black Hills 69 SMK for example, will shoot good in almost any match rifle. Not all for sure, but most. Is there a 22lr that you can buy that will shoot well in most every gun. Or are there to many variables?
 
Another interesting comparison would be between two grades of Anschutz rifles.

Perhaps different "sporter(s)" built on their "Club" Match 64 action (1400/1500 series) and the other on their Match 54 action (1700 series)

It would be interesting. But I think most people like me would only know the difference if you showed us.
 
The 22 is a hard gun to shoot,even off the bench.The low velocity makes not letting the rifle move inconsistently during the bullet's time in the barrel so important,especially with a light rifle.My 541S is light,and I can watch the crosshairs move ever so slightly,and the bullet will hit in the direction the hairs move.That rifle will easily do 1/2" at 50,provided I am careful to keep it in the bags the same from shot to shot.Shooter input will make even the best rifles open up their groups.A good trigger,ammo,barrel and all the usual factors are also important if you want an accurate 22.
 
The crown is very important. I have touched up quite a few with a cordless drill, brass screw, and valve grinding compound.....I did the one on this gun.

IMAG2194~2.jpg

IMAG2191~2.jpg
 
Is there a 22lr that you can buy that will shoot well in most every gun. Or are there to many variables?
Most target grade ammunition will shoot well in most rifles, assuming of course, that the rifles are in such condition to do so. Each rimfire rifle is different and each will have its own preferences. To find the ultimate accuracy for a particular rifle will require experimentation with different ammunition. The best place to start, IMO, is with a good grade of match ammunition. Not necessarily the most expensive, though. My recommendation for a starting place for a target grade consistent ammunition would be something along the line of Eley Target, SK Rifle Match, RWS Rifle Match or Lapua Center-X. It's much more expensive than Remington Golden Bullet or Winchester White Box, but is relatively modestly priced compared to Lapua X-Act or RWS R100. Here (https://www.creedmoorsports.com/category/rimfire-ammunition) is a link to a variety of rimfire ammo that will give you an idea of the selection and price range available. I would venture that Lapua X-Act 22 or RWS R100 will shoot well in most .22's. But, do you want to spend $30 for 50 rounds of .22 lr?

For what it is worth, I use Eley Target for smallbore silhouette out to the Turkeys (75M) and either Ely Tenex or RWS R100 for the Rams (100m) just because the groups with Eley Target at 100m tend to open up at that distance and Tenex and R100 are considerably more consistent at 100m. Eley Target is the ammo for nearly all my practice. For plinking, I will shoot whatever goes 'bang'.

The reason I settled on Eley Target was because it shoots best in my particular rifle (Sako P04) out to 75 meters. My Browning Buckmark rifle has expensive taste and prefers the RWS R100 and Lapua Midas+ but is still edged out by the Sako by a smidgen in average accuracy.

By far, the most important factor is the shooter.
"Shooter input will make even the best rifles open up their groups."
No doubt.
A couple things I have noticed over the years that have an effect on group size: 1) ALWAYS hold the rifle exactly the same from shot to shot, and 2) ALWAYS place the rifle in the shooting rest exactly the same from shot to shot. Of course, the basics of natural point of aim, sight picture, trigger control, breathing and concentration always apply, too.
 
Last edited:
I shot Unlimited IR50/50 rimfire benchrest for about 15 years, getting better and better equipment and rifles as I could afford. My latest rifle shot as well as any I've shot against. On my best match day, I shot two perfect 250x250s and a 249 on the IR50/50 target. Had one bad round on the last shot on the third target, missing the 10 ring by about 1/16". I figured I'd never shoot as well again and was correct. Things were getting super-competitive (nasty) and I was tired of running matches, so gave it up, after finding a replacement match director. The rifle was a Rem 40x with custom Lilja barrel, Harrell tuner, 2 ounce trigger, and McMillan fiberglass stock. I shot only Lapua Gold Medal match ammo, (after a feud with an Eley supplier). Scope was a Weaver T-36x, boosted to 42X. Sold it to a buddy and he's doing quite well with it, even on the National "stage".

I never fired it at 100 yards because we didn't compete at that distance, so it seemed like a waste of very expensive ammo.


. Rem 40X.JPG
 
Got out this afternoon, but wind was still kind of tricky. Managed a couple of half-decent groups, one with CCI that measured 0.4" Vertical x 1.2" Horizontal. It intersected with another group made with my .22 LR with R50 Match ammo that measured 3/4" vert. x 1" Horiz. Even the .22 LR had some weirdly large groups, one being about 3" vertical, so these results are not typical. Hopefully, I'll be able to get some better conditions soon. I'm really quite impressed with the vertical dispersion of the WMR. It's about the best it's turned in to date! (It's a really messy 5-bull target that I'd rather not publish.) Hoping for better conditions soon!
 
Hmmmm. I have never thought of the Browning Buckmark as having a great deal of accuracy potential.

Which variety of Buckmark and why is it so accurate?
It is the heavy barreled Buckmark with walnut stock. I give the excellent accuracy (considering the price point of the model) to the ammunition more than the rifle itself. The quality of the ammunition and the contribution it makes to the accuracy potential of an individual rifle cannot be overstated. There is a reason why Olympic class shooters and serious competitors choose to use the ammo that they do.
 
What makes for an accurate 22lr rifle?

I have also enjoyed reading the “Rimfire Prove It” thread. While I was reading I was wondering “what makes for an accurate 22lr rifle”? Is it the barrel? The length? The chamber? The twist? I love shooting my little CMMG. But I don’t think I would call it accurate. What makes a truly accurate 22lr?
The barrel and its tight chamber with tight headspace, tight action with great firing pin impact and nose shape.
 
The best place to start, IMO, is with a good grade of match ammunition.
Seems like a good place to start. I have a fair baseline with CCI SV. I have some of the better rounds you mentioned on order. Just a box of each to check things out.
It should be interesting to see how much difference it will make with my CMMG.
 
Seems like a good place to start. I have a fair baseline with CCI SV. I have some of the better rounds you mentioned on order. Just a box of each to check things out.
It should be interesting to see how much difference it will make with my CMMG.
You have now started on a great adventure that never really ends! Just when you think you have it figured out, the next box you buy will be a different lot and may not shoot quite as well. Then again, it may shoot a smidgen better.

While you are at it, buy a couple boxes of inexpensive plinking ammo - Winchester, Federal, and Remington - and shoot five 5-round groups of each for comparison.

Note: It seems like most manufacurer's lube on their bullet varies a little bit an can affect the consistency of the first few shots. When I am testing ammo for my silhouette riffle, I start by shooting a ten round group before shooting for test accuracy, just to be sure the barrel is seasoned for the particular ammo I am going to test. I then shoot my five 5-round groups of that ammo paying particula attention to the basics. This is a procedure I do every time I change ammo while testing. Does it make a difference? I think so. I believe my test groups are a more accurate representation of that particular ammunition's accuracy/consistency potential in my rifle because of the methodology.

If your testing doesn't do anything else, it will give you excellent practice that will expose the elements of good shooting where your weaknesses are. That, too, is valuable data as you can then concentrate on those points, too, until they become perfectly natural to you.

Good luck with your testing and maybe we will see you on the competition target ranges one day! :thumbup:
And welcome to the Grand Obsession of Rimfires! :D:D
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top