Robinson Arms Sues Remington, Bushmaster, RRA, and Magpul

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http://soldiersystems.net/2010/01/15/robinson-arms-sues-remington-bushmaster-rra-and-magpul/

Robinson Arms Sues Remington, Bushmaster, RRA, and Magpul
Robinson Arms, manufacturers of the XCR have filed suit yesterday in US District Court for Utah against Remington, Bushmaster, Rock River Arms, and Magpul Industries based on alleged infingement of their patent (Multi-caliber ambidextrously controllable firearm #7,596,900) issued 6 October, 2009 and initially filed in August of 2003.

Specifically, the weapons alleged to have violated Robinson’s patent are the Remington/Bushmaster ACR, Magpul Masada/Massoud, and the RRA LAR-8. All of these weapons feature a magazine release that is manipulated by the trigger finger from within the trigger guard as well as a similar bot hold open device.

Both Bushmaster and Remington are part of the Freedom group, owned by Cerberus Capital Management. So for taking on Freedom Group I give them an “E” for Effort. Of note is the timing of the suit, just days before SHOT Show as well as Robinson’s announcement on their website that they would be exhibiting after all in a booth (#20034) shared with Serbu.
 
Please. friggin litigious society. Robinson has not invented the multi-caliber platform, nor the mag release that is accessible within the trigger gaurd.

Besides which, Cerberus has much deeper pockets than RAC. This is a stupid move on Robinsons part, I suspect.
 
patent infringement comes down to one decided factor.

whoever has the money for the most lawyers will win the fight.
 
The timing of such a suit would be meant to scare off potential buyers from the competition. Would like not result in any real legal action, but could impact sales.
 
The timing of such a suit would be meant to scare off potential buyers from the competition. Would like not result in any real legal action, but could impact sales.
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Cerberus Capital Management, a corporate giant, screws little guy, Robinson. To damn Robinson, seems to be the theme here already. And all they did was defend themselves. I accept their suit on it's face.

We have already been jerked around by Magpul/Bushmaster/Remington with and about the ACR already, and folks blame Robinson?

If I act against anyone here it will probably be Cerberus and their vast holdings.

Go figure.

Fred
 
Multicaliber firearms have been around for years. Modular designs allowing caliber switching in combat rifles is a new twist on this, but Robarm's lawsuit strikes me as idiotic. Everyone has known about these rifles for at least two years, and I find it highly strange that Robarm is just now getting around to filing a lawsuit.

FWIW, I'd never consider buying one of their products after Alex Robinson showed up on TFL a few years ago and proved himself to be an uncivil, childish jerk.

Read the archived thread here.
 
Great as if LAR-8 parts weren't hard to find as it is. Robinson just convinced me to scratch the XCR off the list of things to buy.
 
They didn't get their patent until October 2009. I have no legal experience, but it's not a stretch of the imagination to think that it might take a couple months to put a lawsuit together. Announcing the suit just before SHOT seems like strategery to me.

Don't let the title of the patent fool you, the bulk of it is about ambidextrous magazine and bolt releases.
 
FWIW, I'd never consider buying one of their products after Alex Robinson showed up on TFL a few years ago and proved himself to be an uncivil, childish jerk.
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After reading that, it seems that a lawsuit is just par for the course with Alex. What an arrogant, self-rightous prick.
 
The suit

Its about the ambi bolt hold that Alex designed for the M96 a decade or more ago, filed for a patent in 2003 and just got it approved by the Govt in Oct 2009. Magpul and now Remington have been designing a gun with the same ambi bolt hold that they knew another company had patent pending rights on. This has nothing to do with the multi caliber quick change barrels, thats just the name of the patent.
Its all about RobArms being screwed by Remington b/c Rem thinks they are too big to sue.
In this country even the little guy has the right to stand up for his intellectual property. If the courts say the patent should not have been given, I won't argue; but right now a patent has been given, and Remington is clearly infringing the hell out of it. Alex has a right to his day in court and anyone who believes in the sanctity of our Constitution should respect that.
 
If they feel they have been wronged and they have the money for court more power to them. period. If they are right I hope they win.
 
I find it ironic that all of the pictures of the XCR on robarm.com feature Magpul enhancements (grips, magazines etc).
 
Its all about RobArms being screwed by Remington b/c Rem thinks they are too big to sue
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Nay, it really seems to be about Alex's sophmoric attitude. Ambi controls are not new, and the various companies under Cerberus that are employing them only have to prove a 15% difference in the mechanism

On another note, for a man so seemingly PO'd about infringement, why does his XCR so closely resemble an HK 93? and the M96? Armalite could probably have sued him for infringment on the AR-180B. However, armalite prolly wasn't too worried, since of the two, their rifle actually worked and shot decent groups.

M-96:

M96.jpg


AR-180:

61269.jpg
 
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FWIW, I'd never consider buying one of their products after Alex Robinson showed up on TFL a few years ago and proved himself to be an uncivil, childish jerk.

Read the archived thread here.
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He should get along well with the lawyer types.
 
Plus you have people that just won't forget that Alex gave his support for Mitt Romney during the primary elections! Romeny wasn't exactly pro gun. That hasn't helped him. Some people will not buy his products for that reason. Shot show coming up and all the news about the ACR isn't exactly good timing. Or is it? Plus after reading this http://soldiersystems.net/2010/01/15...ra-and-magpul/ How come he re-applied the patent that was initially filed in August of 2003? Now 6 yrs later on Oct-6-09?
 
The cynical side of me wonders if this is not an effort by Robinson to chisel a little cash out of Remington et. al. The majority of suits are settled out of court, according to my lawyer friends, and the "big guys" will often hand the "little guy" some cash to shut up and go away. The cash amounts to less than what they would pay their high-powered and priced lawyers for a court case. Since gag-orders are typically part of such settlements, there is a minimum of bad publicity too.
Robinson Arms has had some interesting products and ideas over the years, but they've never been more than a boutique gun company. They were never,IMO, a serious contender in the competition that produced the Masada and similar designs. This strikes me as an effort to end up with a little cash anyway.
 
Wow from reading that old TFL thread Alex sounds a lot like the folks over at A.R.M.S. A little competition shows up and they get all bend out of shape and what to take their ball and go home. My 2 year old does that, but he has better manners. I will never buy a Rob Arms weapon. I will stick with my worthless FAL. I mean how many conflicts has his rifle been in? Other than court...
 
Plus you have people that just won't forget that Alex gave his support for Mitt Romney during the primary elections! Romeny wasn't exactly pro gun. That hasn't helped him.
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Romeny wasn't anti gun either and given Romeny's economic credentials and the state of the economy it was a very reasonable thing to do. That has to be the stupidest reason not to buy a Rob arms product I can think of.

I don't know anything about the owners personality. As a principle there is nothing wrong with enforcing one's patent rights. That is why they exist. Does his suit have merit. IDK and cannot form an opinion based on the info provided. Time will tell, that's why we have the courts.

We can theorize as to Rob arms motives, but it is pure speculation.
 
Mitt voiced support for the '94 AWB. He became a 'born again gun person' when he ran in '08. It was painful to listen to him talk about how he has a cabin in Park City, where his son keep s a Glock and he enjoys shooting it from time to time.
 
["patent infringement comes down to one decided factor.

whoever has the money for the most lawyers will win the fight. "]

Didn't work out like that for the poor guy whom invented the intermitten windshield wiper system. Yes, it took him years fighting on his own, but in the end he won and got millions from the auto giants.
 
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