S.C. Sheriff's Department Armored Vehicle with Belt-Fed Machine Gun

[JDoe]

The Sheriff's announcement doesn't say anything about mounting a .50 cal MG on anything...

Is anyone aware of law enforcement actually firing a belt fed .50 cal MG in this country (except perhaps in training)?

 

[mbt2001]

When the Governor controls the National Guard and they are literaly a phone call away with all of their military equipment, why does the Sheriff need these things? I would prefer that Soldiers get left with Soldiers duties and they stay as far away from us as possible.

Go read your state consititution:

The Texas Constitution
Article 1 - BILL OF RIGHTS
Section 24 - MILITARY SUBORDINATE TO CIVIL AUTHORITY
The military shall at all times be subordinate to the civil authority.

Does that include Police Departments and organizations?

 

[Double Naught Spy]

but why would ANYWHERE in South Carolina need a vehicle mounted .50 cal for Law Enforcement duties!?!?!?!

I am good with them having it and not needing it right now versus needing it and not having it at some point in the future.

A .50 is a good way to keep bandits in check who are firing at you from their stolen armored car.

A lot of police departments have wrestled with a similar query of what legitimate need would patrol officers have for a patrol rifle...and as it has turned out, the needs are becoming more common.

Personally, I think they should put them on helicopters for immediate interdictions of vehicles. I always thought it was unfortunately that police choppers always seem to have the high ground and usually can't do anything other than provide information to folks on the ground, often becoming birdseye witnesses to events they could have been stopped from the air, but since they are not allowed to shoot from the air, they just watch and talk.

 

[Emfuser]

As a resident of Richland county in SC, I must say I wonder what in the world has possessed them to believe this is a good idea?

 

[Geno]

Sheriff Leon Lott told the Columbia State newspaper that he hoped the vehicle, named "The Peacemaker," would let the bad guys know that his officers are serious.

What's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander. I want to see turret-mounted .50 BMGs mounted on school buses. That'll tell 'em kids by gosh...we're serious!

 

[Caliban]

Hey look its FCFC reincarnated!

...?

my own admittedly ill-informed ideas about how to properly take down a drug lab notwithstanding, i'm not the only person here who's defending the purchase.

 

[woodybrighton]

The only legit use I could think of is intimidation criminals tend not to fight to the death turn with with half a dozen deputies they might think they can win the fight.
Turn up with that beast I'll come quietly
The RUC had its .30 brownings taken off it the 1970s as they were too much gun for urban use and caused casualties through over penetration.
can't think of a scenario where you use .50 machine gun in an leo operation

 

[Treo]

When the Governor controls the National Guard and they are literaly a phone call away

The National Guard isn't anything like a phone call away

First the somebody has to call the Govenor, who has consider the ramifications to his political career.

The Govenor calls his State N.G. Commander ( if said commander's not in Iraq)

State commander calls his Battalion Commander who call the Company Commander.

We're at least 3 or for hours into this by now so we'll skip the discription of the hassel involved in finding the troops ( not all of whom even live in the same county or in some cases state as the armoury) and getting them to the armoury.

Then the Unit Armourer has to go to Police Headquarters to get the bolts for every weapon the unit has then they have to transport the unit and give them a briefing on the situation.

I'd guess you wouldn't see the Guard till the next day.

I can however think of a perfectly legitimate police use for this vehicle, give about a hundred of them to the Border Patrol and tell them to take out anything they see in a Mexican uniform north of the Rio Grandé

 

[macadore]

I am good with them having it and not needing it right now versus needing it and not having it at some point in the future.

If they have it, they will find a reason to need it. As far as the war on drugs goes, we should handle it the way we handled the war on alcohol.

 

[OOOXOOO]

Don't tell Maricopa County Sherrif Joe Arpiao, he will go out and pick up an M-1 Abrams or a Stryker. I just don't see what a police department is going to use that for. Wouldn't it be smarter to use that kind of money on more training or equipment that will get used everyday.

 

[mbt2001]

First the somebody has to call the Govenor, who has consider the ramifications to his political career.

The Govenor calls his State N.G. Commander ( if said commander's not in Iraq)

State commander calls his Battalion Commander who call the Company Commander.

We're at least 3 or for hours into this by now so we'll skip the discription of the hassel involved in finding the troops ( not all of whom even live in the same county or in some cases state as the armoury) and getting them to the armoury.

Then the Unit Armourer has to go to Police Headquarters to get the bolts for every weapon the unit has then they have to transport the unit and give them a briefing on the situation.

I'd guess you wouldn't see the Guard till the next day.

I think that you proved my point. This isn't the Battle of the Marne, any thing that needs an APC can wait either for the release of the equipment or for the NG personnel to arrive.

Driving over citizens with a tank is best done on a slower timetable and not right away.

Issuing Border Patrol APC's isn't the same as driving them through suburbia eh?

 

[feedthehogs]

It's going to keep the peace

The old belief of "peace thru superior firepower"

Worked in Georgia didn't it?

To bad it hasn't worked in Iraq or Afganistan for us or the former USSR.

What ever happened to the nice pressed police uniforms that were supposed to portray a nice helpful image?

Para military garb only serves to frighten and intimidate.
Not what you would think a free society was all about.

I feel sorry for these cops that think the bogey man is around every corner ready to pounce and eat their hearts.

Must be hell being so insecure.

 

[Eric F]

Which all this brings up a good point, I have heard from many people here in Va, too many for this to be from 1 person, that Alexandria Va has a Helicopter gun ship. I fail to beleive they actually have one but I have also not looked around to see if they really do have one...................any one hear this before?

 

[Eric F]

The Sheriff's announcement doesn't say anything about mounting a .50 cal MG on anything...

Huh, they sure enough have it pictured, but often times for the "drama" these kind of things find their way into the world.........

 

[woad_yurt]

I hope that the sheriff there doesn't have any typing errors in the address section of his warrants.

 

[JKimball]

Please, anyone give me one legitimate law enforcement application.

How about the governor using it to squash unconstitutional BATFE raids?

I can however think of a perfectly legitimate police use for this vehicle, give about a hundred of them to the Border Patrol and tell them to take out anything they see in a Mexican uniform north of the Rio Grandé

+1 on that, Treo.

 

[Elza]

macadore: Who polices the police?

They themselves do. After all, they are the only ones qualified……..

 

[wyocarp]

The Government should be afraid of the people....."NOT" the people should be afraid of the Government.....

I second this.

 

[deaconkharma]

saw this a few days ago

made me want to puke. But then again the paramilitary police have been making their appearance around SC for some time now. Not only do the Swatties dress up in black bdu's average patrolmen are starting run around in them at night on traffic duty now. Lexington City, last I checked, had P90's issued in the trunks of some.

Andy Griffith... Who is that? Looks like we've traded Andy griffith for Judge Dredd. We really have to admit it. They want to be like the military.
Leon Lott by the way used to be known as "Miami Vice" by his peers in his last position before becoming sherriff. In reference to his persona and bling attitude. Looks like they weren't far off. This looks like a TV Show cast picture. Wonder if they were humming the swat tune while taking this picture?
Da da daaaa da da daaa ....:banghead:

PS:
Watch for more felony tag light violations and other such mandatory tickets for everything. they gotta pay for this somehow.

 

[Drgong]

I can understand a APC might be needed in a few situations, the .50 cal machine gun is overkill for a LEO operation due to overpentration.

 

[Gibbles]

That's interesting...
I guess I could argue that I would like a tank.. does not mean I need it, but I would sure enjoy having it.

I wonder if my neighbors would feel safer with that tank on my front lawn?

We could use it for the neighborhood watch program!

 

[cerberus65]

Hmm. You would think something like that would be all over the papers here. I know ol' Leon has been sheriff a long, long time but I would still expect the State (newspaper) to rip him a new one for something like that.

Makes me glad I'm in Lexington Co.! I'll just have to be careful not to give the authorities in Richland Co. any excuse to make me help pay for that thing.

 

[deaconkharma]

cerb


exactly! I try and stay out of Richland myself.
Now most definitely for sure. I don't want to give them the old 25$-for-the-cause-seatbelt-violation they'll be looking for now. (since seatbelts are primary stopping offenses here now) Come to think of it, I knew safety wasn't the reason they did this seatbelt thing! It was revenue generation for things like this! It's all very clear now...

http://www.rcsd.net/media/mar08/03-05-peacemaker.html

I'll just try to keep my little self at home in lexington county too. (Airport Side)

 

[siglite]

I read quite often on this and similar firearm boards about folks complaining about the restrictions placed upon them in their desire for the biggest, most powerful, silent, automatic, sniper scope equipped, ... firearm they can imagine.

Well I figure a police force is but a collection of folks. Those folks might have the same imaginations as other folks. Unfortunately the police force collective has deep pockets compared to the average folks that post here and can sometimes justify to the budget authority such a purchase. I chuckle when I read on these boards how some guy concealed, or justified, or deceived his wife in the acquisition of some sought after firearm.

I figure folks is folks and the police folks just have a bigger financial base to please their "I wants".

You confuse financial barriers for legal barriers. You and I cannot go out and purchase a belt-fed M2 and mount it on a vehicle. You can't buy a belt-fed M2 manufactured after 1986 at all, and In my state, no loaded longarms in vehicles period. This is not a budgetary discrepancy. This is a liberty discrepancy. Them: Tanks. Us: rifles..... Them. Us. ....... Us. Them. Hmmmm....

 

[JohnnyOrygun]

I can see a need for an APC, there could be a situation where they need it to provide cover while rescuing civilians or injured officers. But I agree with everyone else, a local police force has no need for a 50 BMG. They are not shooting at armed helicopters or bad guys driving armored vehicles. As several have pointed out, the penetration of the .50 is too much for a police force to safely use... I can just see it being used and how many injured civilians sue for excessive force and all. I think the sheriff in the story sold the County commissioners a bill of goods about how great the thing would be for use against terrorist or something along those lines. The taxpayers of that county need to let their commissioners know how they feel about the Sheriffs department wasting their money. If they have too much money, send some out west where half of the property is owned by the feds and the feds pay no property taxes.:banghead: