Safest way to seat primers?

[Doublehelix]

What say you?

I have heard lots of stories about primer tubes going Kaboom since they are all sitting on top of each other, which is one reason the Dillon encloses their primer tubes inside of another steel tube. If there is an issue seating a primer and it ignites, it can cause the rest of the tube to ignite as well.

On the Lee Safety Prime system on my Classic Turret Press, it separates the primer from the rest of the batch before loading, so if it happens to go off during a seating event, it shouldn't ignite the rest of the batch. I see this as a fairly safe way to seat primers.

But... I am looking for a way to seat primers when not using the Lee Classic Turret press, and I am having a hard time trusting the tube system on my new Dillon XL650.

Maybe paranoia, but I thought I would try to get some feedback from the brain trust on this site.

What are some other safe means of seating primers other than a tube system? I *might* consider seating the primers before loading the cases in the case feeder on my XL650 if there exists a relatively safe and efficient (fast?) way to seat primers away from the press.

I like the Primal Rights CPS series, but they are a tube system as well, and plus, they are pricey as heck.

Forester Co-Ax priming system looks good as well, but it is a tube system.

RCBS has some systems that use the plastic strips, but I am not sure this is any safer than a tube system, and it is certainly more work to load the strips.

Is there anything else? Maybe I just need to consider the Dillon steel tube protection as the best of the bunch, or just batch process on my LCT.

Thanks for any advice/opinions.

 

[Hokie_PhD]

I take it you mean on the press?

My view is priminig is one of the most dangerous parts of hand loading.

That said I use a Lee hand primer and do it when I'm relaxing.

No rush and I can inspect the brass and make sure everything feels and looks right.

I've thought about adding the Lee auto prime to my Classic Turret press but I'm fine with the hand priming right now.

If this way winds up being too slow I'll look into it further.

That said I'm not sure which is safer per say I guess it all depends on how careful you are

 

[Sunray]

"...heard lots of stories about primer tubes going Kaboom..." Don't listen to whoever told you those BS fairy tales.
A primer needs a very hard whack to crush it and set it off. There's no contact, of any kind, when a primer is being seated with those remaining in the tube. There's nothing in said tubes that could possibly cause a primer to go bang. There's no 'danger' whatsoever.
There are a bunch of 'off the press' style priming tools. None of 'em have any advantage over an 'on the press' type. The whole thing is a personal preference thing. Personally think it's too slow to prime that way.

 

[243winxb]

The operator causes most problems. Do clean primer tubes, as primer dust may build up.

Force a jammed primer, as its being picked up out of a tube, it can kaboom. And the pipe can not provide protection. One member on this forum found out the hard way, that some Federal primers have "nitro" in the priming mix. This may make them more sensitive.

 

[Hokie_PhD]

Btw funny you should mention primer safety

At the gun show today I bought some 9mm brass as the price was way too good to pass up.

Anyway as I sit here priming one wouldn't seat right and got stuck in my hand primer

It didn't feel right so I stopped
Used a small screwdriver to pull it back and see what was up as it felt like military brass that was decrimped or not swayed.

Well looking closer the primer pocket didn't look like it was right. The hole was blocked.

So even watching what we do things slip by. Had I tried to force this I'm sure it would have gone boom. So I'm bad for missing the initial problem but as I gain experience it saved me by knowing how things should feel and not to force thingS

 

[Blue68f100]

This has been a problem since Dillon released their AP. It was reported happening in the 70's when I first looked at them. Dillon still have not fixed the problem. The root of the problem seams to be some plastic parts getting worn. Then the press binds up and the operator forces it a little more. If he had stopped and checked it would not happen.

 

[Doublehelix]

I take it you mean on the press?

I am open to on the press or off the press ideas.

"...heard lots of stories about primer tubes going Kaboom..." Don't listen to whoever told you those BS fairy tales.

I hear some folks claiming BS, and others that have seen it in action. I am sure a lot of it is down to user error, but then we are all human. I find myself sometimes with primers that are harder to seat than others (no, not a military crimp issue), and I always wonder how hard I should press in order to try and seat the primer. I have also had two primers seated sideways in the last few months, so things can and DO happen.

I am not saying that the Dillon tube system is a disaster waiting to happen, nor am I saying it is perfect. I am just looking for some opinions on safe ways to prime.

 

[Damon555]

If you perform the priming operation as instructed in the manual you will not have a problem with the Dillon primer feeding system. Keep the components clean and in good working order and there's no reason to worry about it.....Proper PPE should also be worn while loading.

 

[243winxb]

The photo link has a Hornady that blew and set a pound of powder on fire. Operator error. http://s338.photobucket.com/user/joe1944usa/media/Firearms and Reloading/KABOOM/Hopper.jpg.html


Sorry, this is not helping the OP find a safe method.

 

[Jim Watson]

I popped one primer ever in my old CH AutoCHamp progressive. Its primer feed worked, its case advance did not and the primer sheared on the edge of the pocket. One primer, no gang fire.
I have crushed a number of primers in Dillon 550 and 1050 without firing them because there was no impact or shear.
The risk is not zero but it within my tolerance for the convenience and speed of progressive loading.

If you are afraid of your primer feed and start defeating that part of the progressive loader, when might you start doubting the volumetric powder measure?
I know people who do. Just as well load single stage so you can isolate the reactive materials as much as possible while still turning out ammunition.

 

[Hokie_PhD]

I am open to on the press or off the press ideas.



I find myself sometimes with primers that are harder to seat than others (no, not a military crimp issue), and I always wonder how hard I should press in order to try and seat the primer. I have also had two primers seated sideways in the last few months, so things can and DO happen.

.

You will always get a few that require a bit more force and some that are easier. I don't claim to be an expert but I say there's a range and you learn from experience. That said I believe the safest thing is when in doubt stop and check. Better to be cautious than hurt or killed. Or even just mess up your gear.

In my case above it didn't feel right so I stopped and checked. In the bag of 250 pieces of brass that I bought it had 260! 257 we perfect. One had damage to the neck, and two had the problem I described above.

The damaged neck I saw as I inspected the brass. The one I described above I missed on the first inspection but found on feel. The third I found on a visual as I was watching closer.

So be safe, don't be overly paranoid but be careful. I agree we all make mistakes but if you follow safe practices you should catch things before a big error. I think my case today shows it!

 

[thomas15]

WARNING: Only CCI or Remington brand primers are safe use with this press. If you plan on using any brand besides CCI and Remington, you must purchase the (LEE Loadmaster) explosion shield.

 

[wally]

"...heard lots of stories about primer tubes going Kaboom..." Don't listen to whoever told you those BS fairy tales.

It most definitely is not a "BS fairy tale", especially if you have a Lee Loadmaster and prime on the press. Its design is fundamentally flawed and when in feeds in a primer sideways, or in too far so it "shears" when attempting to seat it, a detonation is indeed possible. I experienced it first hand. Didn't get a chain-fire mass detonation, but it was just mostly luck. Lee is aware of the problem and recommends not using certain brands of primers and sells a "blast shield" to install over the primer tray to protect the operator should a mass detonation occur and has a huge warning label about not storing "flammables" near the primer tray.

Any well designed primmer system is safe when used as directed. Lee makes some good ones, but IMHO, they screwed the pooch with the Loadmaster priming system. I've half filled up my second 5 gallon bucket with spent primers in my reloading career and never had an issue with Lee hand tools, Hornady Progressives, Dillon XL650, Lee Classic turret, or when priming on a single stage press -- only the Loadmaster gave me a problem.

 

[243winxb]

 

[X-Ring]

I don’t see how you could design a system safer than the XL 650. Each primer is separated by a steel disk and individually advanced into the priming station. If something should go wrong the steel tube surrounding the primer stack would direct the blast upward away from the operator. Nobody gets hurt and Dillon will replace all damaged parts. I have been loading on a XL 650 for 25 years and never had a problem or concern.

 

[Bart B.]

One member on this forum found out the hard way, that some Federal primers have "nitro" in the priming mix. This may make them more sensitive.

Nitroglycerin or nitrocellulose?

 

[Fine Figure of a Man]

The only progressive press I am familiar with is the LNL that I use. I always prime on the press and have never had one detonate even if it was upside down or sideways. I can see how it could happen to a single primer when seating.
Detonating the primers in the tube? I'm not sure I could make it happen if I tried.

 

[judgedelta]

I have an RCBS hand primer I used for years without any problem; but it's slow. Got a Lee Classic Turret with the primer; couldn't ever get it to work reliably, and really slow when it did work. I now use the Lee bench mounted primer. Mounted it on a board and clamp it to the bench. I took the decapper out of my sizing die and everything works for me. This thing does use different shell holders from the press, but they come a bunch in a set and aren't very expensive. The primer tray is plastic and can't be very expensive if you wanted to buy and fill several before starting. The primers will bridge in the tray occasionally, but a tap shakes them down. Priming by hand, one shell at a time, is slower than some methods, but I can inspect every one before putting the powder in.

 

[Bama Drifter]

"That said I use a Lee hand primer and do it when I'm relaxing.
No rush and I can inspect the brass and make sure everything feels and looks right."
+1

FWIW, I view priming as Case Prep. Very convenient having a big tub of prepped/primed brass to leisurely set in the block.

Off press hand-priming while listening to something soothing in the garage is very therapeutic...
or on the couch with a couple of Akro bins and a documentary playing on Netflix. There are lots of guys on here that like the speed of priming as a stage. But there is a huge number of guys like me, too. Whatever cranks your tractor. Just my $0.02

 

[243winxb]

Primal Rights CPS series

I watched the video. Not liking the primer tube movement.

 

[Shaq]

I've been using a Hornady Hand Priming tool for many years. Never had a problem.

 

[muncie21]

I don’t see how you could design a system safer than the XL 650. Each primer is separated by a steel disk and individually advanced into the priming station. If something should go wrong the steel tube surrounding the primer stack would direct the blast upward away from the operator. Nobody gets hurt and Dillon will replace all damaged parts. I have been loading on a XL 650 for 25 years and never had a problem or concern.

Amen to that brother!

 

[Cannibul]

The Hornady LnL AP only has a single primer in the priming station at a time.

 

[wally]

The Hornady LnL AP only has a single primer in the priming station at a time.

As far as my experience goes, they all do, the issue is how far away the reservoir is and what is in between. The Laodmaster is less than 1" with only soft plastic between the one on the ram and the rest of the primers in the hopper, its design pretty much insures you will eventually have primers in sideways or pushed in too far so they are sheared by the ram as you attempt to seat it. The detonation really soured me on my Loadmaster, I put in too much effort with "new" Gen3 primer systems only to discover the problems return in a few thousand rounds. Dumped it, and got a "fast change" conversion kit for my 9mm XL650, was only about $50 less than the Loadmaster which is what sucked me into thinking the Loadmaster would be good for my moderate volume .40S&W loading.

 

[Doublehelix]

I am cautious, and some may call it "paranoia", but I just think we all need to be aware of the dangers inherent in loading, and make sure we are taking the proper precautions such as PPE and common sense.

I think it is a good idea to keep reminding each other of the potential dangers. It is easy to get complacent after years and years without any issues.