Shotshell reloading presses

[KansasSasquatch]

Well, I've never been too sure if I wanted to get into shotshell reloading. With the price of decent presses, the price for components, the data with little or no room for "playing around", and the readily available supply of decent price and quality shotgun ammo. But I've found what appears to be a very good deal on a Ponsness Warren 375C, somewhere between $150-200. I think it's missing a few small parts, like that stepped pin that allows you to empty the hoppers easily. So, my question is, should I spring for this seemingly good deal or just get a MEC 600 Jr? Which press is better? Obviously the 375C tends to go for a higher price, but is some of that price because of the name on it? Or is a properly working 375C that much better than a MEC 600 Jr?

 

[Rico567]

I don't know anything about the Ponsness-Warren, always been a MEC man myself. I've got a 600 jr. in 20 ga., they're simple, pretty much bulletproof, and I'd think they'd be available used at a reasonable price.

 

[ClarkEMyers]

The 375C is a great press for loading hunting loads. The 375 gives loads as good as any and better than most. The 375 is convenient for 12 and 20 gauge in both 2-3/4 and 3 inch length. The 375 is very slow. Time was I liked mine very much because I wanted a few of a particular load for a particular hunt - playing with choice of shot, load and pattern. BUT there is little or no overall savings and very slow production for very high quality loads. These days I buy my hunting loads.

For my money the only reason to have a shot shell press is for the trivial savings for high volume clay bird shooters. So I have an 800 series Ponsness but a Mec would do as well. And again I see no reason, none, in today's market for anything but a high volume press for a single clay bird load.

 

[Peter M. Eick]

I have looked at the PW375 a couple of times but keep coming back to my mec 600. I don't shoot enough shotgun to warrant that type of investment. I like the way I can crank out rounds on my 600 in short bursts and have plenty.

It all becomes a question of how much you shoot.

 

[fecmech]

The only place that I see it worthwhile for shotshell loading today is in the 28 and .410 ga. There the cost of new factory shells is high enough and your shot & powder use is low enough that there is significant savings. If you can tolerate the recoil from factory promotional 12 and 20 ga loads that's the way to go IMO.

 

[Armored farmer]

It all becomes a question of how much you shoot.

I'd say that is the question.
I have mec reloaders in 12, 20, 28, and.410. My 12 ga is a progressive. It would crank out about 800rds/wk back in the day when I was competing at trap.
The 600jr is plenty of reloader for the beginner or hunter or the occasional round of trap, skeet, or clays. If you're shooting 200rds/wk.....you probably will want a progressive. Either way I still like the MEC just fine.
BTW I found a heavy load that I liked. It patterned quite well, was within legal guidelines for ATA trap. I loaded that same load for hunting, trap, skeet, clays.....everything. I even switched to #5 shot and killed turkeys with it. I did have a lighter load that I used for 16yd trap, but for the most part, a hunter/shooter won't NEED to do a bunch of adjusting on the loader once it is set up.

 

[Armored farmer]

Whatever reloader you get...get yourself some good quality hulls. those crappy aforementioned factory promos arent designed to be reloaded. You CAN reload them, it's just not pleasant. It reminds me of crushing gravel with your reloader compared to running AAs or STSs or other quality target hulls. I always like Federal Champions too.

 

[gamestalker]

I've never used one of those before, so can't say, as to how they rate compared to a 600 Jr.. I've been loading on my Mec 600's for well over 30 yrs. and have yet to wear one out. I've replaced a few minor parts, start crimp and wad fingers, but they are inexpensive and easy to locate.

I've cranked out 4 boxes (100 rds.) per hour on my 600's without a whole lot of effort, and 5 boxes would be running things really fast. Back when lead was really inexpensive, I would load and shoot thousands per year, not so much any more with shot costing $35 for a 25 lb. sack.

GS

 

[ClarkEMyers]

Good hulls are always better. Part of the point of the Ponsness system with a full length resizing die and a good crimping system is that the Ponsness will give good loads with hulls that will be spewing shot loaded out of a Mec or many others. The Ponsness will never dent your barrel as shot dribbles past the crimp to be pushed into the barrel by the wad.

But again there's no reason to use dubious hulls when you're a single load high volume reloader. We're long past the days of heating and rewaxing paper hulls to save trivial amounts of money.

To repeat myself for the benefit of folks who might be handloaders for metallic ammunition (and so used to loading mixed case range scrap with home cast bullets, any primer and whatever powder is on hand) - shotshell reloading means picking a recipe and following it exactly - one particular hull, one particular wad, one particular primer, one particular weight of powder, in the old days one particular compression on the wad column to get one particular height on the wad column and one particular weight of shot.

In today's world that means short runs with different recipes such as I once loaded are silly. Once upon a time there were no choke tubes and folks thought Polychokes were ugly so given load might pattern a little looser or a little tighter and Lubaloy shot was preferred and so on and so forth. There were reasons to load a number of different recipes for different results on clays and turkey and quail and ...... These days waiting around for components for a particular duck load or a particular woodcock load or what have you is a fool's game - buy the loaded ammunition. If you are loading something you can't buy 14 gauge or 2-1/2" twelve gauge then by all means handload shotshells otherwise don't bother. Don't even handload for clays. Buy 12 gauge target loads by the pallet - with friends - and sell the hulls.

When I was doing short runs of a variety of loads for hunting in both 12 and 20 gauge the Ponsness 375 was clearly superior to anything else on the market and still is for short runs - sort of like the range from say a Dillon Square Deal B to the 550 to the Super 1050. A 550 makes great sense for a multigun metallic reloader. For high handicap trap shooters only the equivalent of a Super 1050 makes sense - look at the Dillon shotshell loader and notice there is only one model in the line. For the serious trap, skeet or sporting clays shooter who wants high production the 375 is ridiculously slow - but it can be done.

To repeat myself if slow production of the highest quality is the idea the 375 will do that.
But for most purposes a little faster production of adequate quality - using only good hulls instead of reconditioning hulls the 375 will disappoint.

 

[Muddydogs]

I would suggest you check out shotgun reloading forums one good place is Shotgun world. While some of the above information is correct there is some that is not.

What are you going to load for? If small quantity's then a single stage is fine, if you are going to load a little of this and a little of that then a single stage works well as its easy to adjust. For shotgun sports a progressive will probably be the way you want to go as a couple hundred rounds a day is easy to shoot.

Do not buy any hulls until you go to your trap range and see how they handle hulls. My club doesn't care about hulls and guys can pick up what ever they want. I come home with a couple hundred hulls every trip. Don't be afraid of the promo hulls, they load just fine and are good for at least one reload. I prefer Rem gun clubs for general shooting, load Fed Top Gun and Estate hulls for shoot and toss hulls and use Rem STS and Nitro's for Annies and other club games. Anymore the new Win AA HS hull is the last thing I will pick up as they are a dismal second to the old Win AA CF hulls.

I'm not going to say deviate from published recipes but once you get involved in shotgun reloading and do a little research you will find that there are places you can substitute this or that. You will also find that if you look hard enough there is probably a recipe out there for what you want to do. A lot of shotgun reloading has to do with hull design and pressures, your two basic hull designs are straight wall (Euro trash, Feds, Estate) and tapered wall (Win's, Rem's). Study up on shotgun pressure and use the pressures as a guide to danger, low pressure loads have some wiggle room high pressure loads don't.

 

[Arkansas Paul]

I would load and shoot thousands per year, not so much any more with shot costing $35 for a 25 lb. sack.

Wow.
Where in the world are you getting shot for $35 a bag. I just paid $44 at Powder Valley and that's the cheapest I've been able to find.

 

[John3921]

Ponsness loaders are built like tanks. If you take the time to dial one in correctly they will crank out thousands of loads without issue.

That said - if you are going to load a hodgepodge of stuff - different hulls, different wads, different primers. Don't. Find a set recipe and stick to it.

I load on 2 ponsness machines. An 800+, and an older 950. The 950 was given to me because a guy that shouldn't be allowed near a reloader got it so messed up, dirty, and out of adjustment it wouldn't load a shell. I took the better part of a day to strip it, clean it, and dial it back in. It loads great. I think I like it better than my 800+.

From a $ standpoint - it is very hard to save money on 20 gauge or 12 gauge target loads. Components are just too high right now. If you can find a source of shot other than the retail giants - then maybe. You still have to buy in bulk though. 5000 wads, 8lbs powder, 5000 primers - then you might save $1/box over promo loads. The argument is that your ammo is better than the promo stuff - more like AA or STS loads.

Shotgunworld is a very good shotgun reloading site. It is MEC central though. You almost can't talk about another reloader without lots of MEC input.

 

[RainDodger]

The last time I loaded shotgun, a 25# bag of shot was $18.99. I have a MEC 9000G and I cranked out enough trap loads to keep me in shells for a few years to come. I un-mounted the MEC and stored it.

The reputation of the Ponsness machines is good, as I've heard it. Loading shotshells is far different than metallic cartridges though. Different ballgame altogether. It's a lot of fun, but in the case of my MEC, it's a complicated maneuver. You really have to watch everything that's happening and woe be to the guy who has some kind of problem mid-stroke when loading. It can result in shot or powder or whatever, all over the place! Then getting everything back in place and in synch can be a pain. It's fun, but it takes max concentration.

If someone walked in and offered me $$ for the 9000G, I'd probably sell it just because I likely won't load shotshells again, despite the 3,000 or so empty 12 ga. hulls I've got sitting in a box. If you buy the Ponsness, be sure that's what you want to get into! It's a blast if you shoot trap, skeet or whatever though. I don't know that it saves you money today though. Prices are really high now and your time has to be worth something.

 

[KansasSasquatch]

Thanks for the suggestions everyone. I think I'm going to pass up the deal on that press even though it seemed like a pretty good deal. I did some math on what components would cost. From the prices I'm able to find even if I bought reasonably priced reclaimed shot, primers and powder in bulk to save on hazmat/shipping, and bought the cheapest suitable wads, I'd have been looking at $0.20/rnd. Seeing as I can buy factory 12ga loads for about $0.28-0.30/rnd it doesn't seem worth it. Now maybe that'd be comparing apples to oranges. Maybe I could produce better stuff than the factory, but my SBE runs Estate, Federal, and Remington "promo" stuff reliably, no such luck with cheap Winchester (and a few other brands). And honestly I have tried some of the higher grade trap loads and they really don't seem to shoot much better. Maybe if I were trying to compete on a high level in shotgun sports I'd reconsider but as it is now I don't have the time nor money for that. I think I could do fairly well in competition shooting, maybe not win any big competitions, but I just shoot clays for fun. Saving $1/box doesn't seem worth it, if I were lucky it'd probably save me $100/year and eat up a good bit of my time that I could spend on metallic reloading. Thanks for your knowledge, suggestions, and advice....it got my head out of the clouds on this one.

 

[hartcreek]

I just use a 30 plus year old Lee Load All for 12 gage shotgun reloading.

 

[Steve C]

The Ponsness Warren 375C is a single stage press just like the MEC 600 Jr. The Ponsness Warren 375C costs about $380 new while the MEC 600 runs about $250. For $150-$200 bucks I'd take the Ponsness Warren and I have owned a MEC 600 for over 30 years but if the price is equal the PW is the better machine IMO. Both machines will load ammo and neither will do it faster than the other. The PW is the Cadillac model a heavier and smoother operating machine and their progressives are hands down one of the best Shotgun loaders you can buy. Even if you have to buy a few missing parts your used PW should be less than a new MEC.