Sizing Die - Forster or Mighty Armory

[Allen One1]

I'm having some case sizing issues that I haven't gotten figured out yet but have been looking around at new dies this afternoon.

Does anyone have any experience or opinions on Forster vs Mighty Armory sizing dies. Both look good for different reasons the Forster you can have honed to fit your specific needs and the Mighty Armory looks to have very exacting machining specs.

6.5 Creedmoor
Bolt Gun
Long Range Targets

 

[AJC1]

What problem are you having, is it die related?

 

[Allen One1]

At this point I don't know if it is die related or not. I have some brass out of the lot that is hard to close the bolt on so I started checking and I have "some" brass that is not dropping into the case gauge either.

Using a Hornady case gauge, Starline brass, Redding sizing die and a Proof barrel. Brass is annealed in a AMP, sized with the Redding FL die no expander, expanded with a Sinclair mandrel die, trimmed, deburred. The brass will not drop into the case gauge at this point, all the measurements taken with a digital caliper say it isn't any different than the ones that drop in. They lack any where from 1/16 - 3/8" of dropping in.

I have sorted some loaded rounds now by ones that case gauge and ones that don't and want to go to the range and confirm that this is the issue.

 

[AJC1]

Take some measurements along the body and see if you have swelling in the case base preventing it from slipping into the guage. A small base die may help in that case. I have also had burs on 223 cases that I had to file off from them going into the guage, which i would not expect in your bolt gun. If your giving it the gusto to maximize speed and reduce drift an expanded case head may make the cases trash. Only measurements will tell.

 

[Blue68f100]

See if the base will fit into the case gauge. May be a burr from a extractor.

When you go through the sizing exercise, test each step with the case gauge. This will help locate where the problem is. Make sure the brass is clean as well as the case gauge.

 

[forty_caliber]

I've got a similar problem with "some" .308 brass. Sometimes I just can't seem to get enough sizing. With that subset of cases, I use a Redding small base body only die along with a .002 Redding competition shell holder. I can get most of them this way but there are still a few problematic ones.

I recently picked up a 6.5CM. Keep us posted on your progress. I'll be interested to hear how you approach the problem.

.40

 

[Walkalong]

Assuming it is actually a die problem.....

Wilson bushing style FL sizer 6.5 Creedmoor

https://www.brunoshooters.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=FLD-6CRED

I have Wilson bushings in the right size, but I use RCBS coated bushings in mine for 6 Dasher & 6 Creed..

 

[AJC1]

When you take your measurements and if a small base is needed the wilson national match dies are small base. I dont load 6.5 creed I'm a 6.5 swedish guy. I have the national match for 308.

 

[Allen One1]

See if the base will fit into the case gauge. May be a burr from a extractor.

When you go through the sizing exercise, test each step with the case gauge. This will help locate where the problem is. Make sure the brass is clean as well as the case gauge.

If the case is reversed it will go into the gauge part way which I think tells me it's not the case head or extractor lip. The brass is cleaned and I have cleaned the case gauge a couple of times. I want to go to the range and make sure these cases that are not fitting into the case gauge are the same ones that are giving me a hard bolt close. Then I will be testing it every step of the way right now I don't have any fired but unsized.

 

[Allen One1]

Take some measurements along the body and see if you have swelling in the case base preventing it from slipping into the guage. A small base die may help in that case. I have also had burs on 223 cases that I had to file off from them going into the guage, which i would not expect in your bolt gun. If your giving it the gusto to maximize speed and reduce drift an expanded case head may make the cases trash. Only measurements will tell.

I have measured and it appears the cases that don't go fully into the case gauge are the same as the ones that do however since they are a tapered case I need to set up a jig so I can measure at exactly the same place on the case body.

 

[AJC1]

I have measured and it appears the cases that don't go fully into the case gauge are the same as the ones that do however since they are a tapered case I need to set up a jig so I can measure at exactly the same place on the case body.

The easiest way I could think of is to drop it in the guage and mark it with a sharpie. That point would be my area to begin the measurements. Because I'm curious is the shell holder touching the bottom of the die? The other thing to try that is free is to leave the case in the die for a longer dwell time. I normally use a 10 second count for consistency on my match ammunition. You may get a little less spring back.

 

[Ruger 15151]

If you are looking for .0005 - .001 run-out after FL sizing, I would recommend a Forster and have it honed to .004 smaller then your finished round so you are not overworking your brass. These dies are smooth as butter. I've tried just about every sizing die, including bushing dies, and the Forster dies are the best I've found if you are looking for precision. Wilson dies are a close second.

 

[Allen One1]

The easiest way I could think of is to drop it in the guage and mark it with a sharpie. That point would be my area to begin the measurements. Because I'm curious is the shell holder touching the bottom of the die? The other thing to try that is free is to leave the case in the die for a longer dwell time. I normally use a 10 second count for consistency on my match ammunition. You may get a little less spring back.

The die is touching the shell plate it is pushing the shoulder back about .003. I due dwell a little but not seconds closer to 3-4 I would guess. Even if I resize the problem brass it doesn't seem to change anything.

One note that I find very odd is that on some pieces if it won't drop into the gauge I can spin the brass a little and find a spot where it will fit. I don't think this will work every time but it does on some of them. I'm not yet getting a repeatable issue across all of the brass, it is very spotty with about 10-15% of the cases being affected.

 

[Blue68f100]

One note that I find very odd is that on some pieces if it won't drop into the gauge I can spin the brass a little and find a spot where it will fit. I don't think this will work every time but it does on some of them. I'm not yet getting a repeatable issue across all of the brass, it is very spotty with about 10-15% of the cases being affected.

If this is the case check for run out. It indicates that the bullet alignment is not straight, bent. May be able to see it rolling it on a flat surface if really bad. May want to rotate the brass 180 and size again. This helps some times.

Check the necks for burrs from trimming or even sizing. I've see the mouths flare open from sizing if your using bushing dies.

 

[Allen One1]

I have to verify this with some measurements but I think I may have this figured out. Basically I'm getting too smart for my own good.

I have been FL resizing with a Redding FL Die and using the expander ball to set the neck tension. Salt bath annealing my cases after each firing and prior to sizing of course.

I recently have started annealing with the AMP after each firing, FL resizing with the same Redding FL die with the expander ball removed. Neck tension is now set using a mandrel die in a lubed neck.

What I think I'm seeing now is excessive under sizing on the neck with the Redding FL die which means the mandrel has to expand the neck excessively which is taking more force than the shoulder can withstand. Need to measure this out to confirm.