Smaller/Lighter/Flatter than a j frame

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defjon

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In the market for a gun that's flatter smaller and most importantly lighter than an airweight.

Looking for suggestions, will start some window shopping shortly!

I've been looking into loaded weights.

I've owned an lcp, lcp max, naa guardian, tcp, naa, 21a, taurus ply22, p938, hellcat, ec9, lcr 357 and 22, and 365.

The 938, hellcat and 365 are heavier than the j. The guardian might have been as well.

Anything else that should be on my radar?
 
You've got it pretty well covered. My Airweights with Speer Gold Dot +P 135 grain weigh 16.8 ounces. If you want flat the LCP models will shed 3 to 3.5 ounces off. To go even further the well regarded Keltec P32 runs just under 10 ounces loaded with 60 grain JHP. Never weighed my various 25 and 22 pistols because I don't carry them. The 32ACP guardian is slightly less than the airweight. The 380 model is larger and probably a lot heavier.
The LCR 38 +P (aluminum frame) is lighter than the airweight but of course is not flat, or smaller.

May I ask what brings you to the criteria of flat and lighter than an airweight? Concealment in a pocket, etc?
 
defjon said:
In the market for a gun that's flatter smaller and most importantly lighter than an airweight.

Looking for suggestions, will start some window shopping shortly!

I've been looking into loaded weights.

I've owned an lcp, lcp max, naa guardian, tcp, naa, 21a, taurus ply22, p938, hellcat, ec9, lcr 357 and 22, and 365.

The 938, hellcat and 365 are heavier than the j. The guardian might have been as well.

Anything else that should be on my radar?
Click to expand...

Have a look at the Diamondback DB9 gen 4
 
I'm actually a bit more friendly with the 380 than I used to be. I keep a stock of it, as my wife has a p238.

I like 380 fmj ball, repeated gel tests shows this has a chance to "tumble" and really make quite a mess of things, with decent penetration. 380 flat point will not tumble, but drive straight on through. 102 grain golden sabers and 90 grain critical defense seem to open up from short barrels pretty regularly, with decent penetration.

There's definitely some versatility, no lt near the 38 imo, but it's there.

For a small light flat pocket option, I think the round makes sense.

Db9 gen 4 looks good too..just missed out on a gen 1 for 135 otd...
 
unclenunzie said:
You've got it pretty well covered. My Airweights with Speer Gold Dot +P 135 grain weigh 16.8 ounces. If you want flat the LCP models will shed 3 to 3.5 ounces off. To go even further the well regarded Keltec P32 runs just under 10 ounces loaded with 60 grain JHP. Never weighed my various 25 and 22 pistols because I don't carry them. The 32ACP guardian is slightly less than the airweight. The 380 model is larger and probably a lot heavier.
The LCR 38 +P (aluminum frame) is lighter than the airweight but of course is not flat, or smaller.

May I ask what brings you to the criteria of flat and lighter than an airweight? Concealment in a pocket, etc?
Click to expand...

You're right on the money, concealment in a pocket and less weight there as well. The j has me tightening the belt sometimes, with some medical issues I probably need to skip belts and tighter fitting garments.

The p32 is interesting...like the capacity...I don't stock 32 acp at present and don't see it too often in the wild. About like 410 anymore! Like the weight savings too.

I was even thinking of some of the newer naa minis that allow for easier loading. 32 is a big step up from that.
 
defjon said:
I'm actually a bit more friendly with the 380 than I used to be. I keep a stock of it, as my wife has a p238.

I like 380 fmj ball, repeated gel tests shows this has a chance to "tumble" and really make quite a mess of things, with decent penetration. 380 flat point will not tumble, but drive straight on through. 102 grain golden sabers and 90 grain critical defense seem to open up from short barrels pretty regularly, with decent penetration.

There's definitely some versatility, no lt near the 38 imo, but it's there.

For a small light flat pocket option, I think the round makes sense.

Db9 gen 4 looks good too..just missed out on a gen 1 for 135 otd...
Click to expand...

You may be better off missing that deal. Quite a few improvements on the Diamondback gen 4s. They are even rated for +p so you have the options of Lite Loads, Standard, and the hotter stuff. I shot one a week or so ago. Recoil really isnt bad for a 9mm that small and light (not for me anyways). Felt about the same as my keltec p11s. Dont own one yet but Its at the top of my short list right now for pocket autos. Had zero problems with function but we were just running ball ammo standard loads (around 150 rounds).
 
defjon said:
You're right on the money, concealment in a pocket and less weight there as well. The j has me tightening the belt sometimes, with some medical issues I probably need to skip belts and tighter fitting garments.

The p32 is interesting...like the capacity...I don't stock 32 acp at present and don't see it too often in the wild. About like 410 anymore! Like the weight savings too.

I was even thinking of some of the newer naa minis that allow for easier loading. 32 is a big step up from that.
Click to expand...

If you need something that small and light the P32 is kinda tough to beat.
 
I had forgotten about the perry suspenders. Have a few myself, inexpensive and they work.
 
I like my LCPII a lot better than I liked my original LCP.

The P32 is extremely small and light. The recoil is mild.

I have a lot of trouble handling my NAA mini revolver quickly and I'm extremely inaccurate with it.

I don't like the Pico trigger.

Kahr makes nice handguns. Their polymer 380's and 9mm might be smaller and lighter than a j-frame.

KelTec P32

KelTec P32

 
You mention you owned the LCP and I don't know why that's not a consideration but I'll give my story:

My first carry gun was an LCP in 2010. It was wildly inaccurate, I struggled to even hit an 8x10 piece of paper at 5 yards. Reviews at the time told me that was par for the course for that gun. So I switched to a 337 j-frame, which was very accurate, and then to a 442 because I wanted a snag-free profile and didn't find the extra weight over the AirLite noticeable. I only carried the lcp when I wanted to be really discreet because that j-frame did leave a very noticeable bulge in my pocket. Eventually, around the 1200th round I put through it, the lcp locked up with a spent casing in the chamber. This was 2019 but I called Ruger just on the off chance they'd help and they said if I paid to ship my lcp in they'd look at it. Well, they mailed me back a brand new LCP at no cost.

I don't know what changed in 9 years, but the second gun is very accurate for such a small pocket pistol. My range has steel at 17 yards and I can hit the 5" plates 6 out of 7 shots, every time. Larger plates I can hit pretty much 100% of the time. Now my airweight j-frame sits in the safe because I like this second LCP so much better than the first. So something to consider if accuracy is the reason you no longer have an LCP. I've heard the LCP II is nicer as well, but I prefer a hammer fired DAO pocket gun.
 
If you didn't like the LCP-MAX, I don't know what to tell you (especially since you didn't say why you didn't like it.)

Anything in .380 and above that's compact and lighter than an Airweight is going to be a bit rude in hand. Are you trying to reduce that, too, or just overall carry weight?

My pocket-carries (that are lighter than the Airweight) have been the Kel-Tec P32, Kel-Tec PF9, Ruger LCP-MAX, and Taurus TCP.
 
defjon said:
In the market for a gun that's flatter smaller and most importantly lighter than an airweight.

Looking for suggestions, will start some window shopping shortly!

I've been looking into loaded weights.

I've owned an lcp, lcp max, naa guardian, tcp, naa, 21a, taurus ply22, p938, hellcat, ec9, lcr 357 and 22, and 365.

The 938, hellcat and 365 are heavier than the j. The guardian might have been as well.

Anything else that should be on my radar?
Click to expand...

I would definitely put a Diamondback DB9 on your list to check out. The Kahr CM9 is a nicer pistol than a DB9 but bigger enough that it might be bigger than what you are looking for.

My Diamondback DB9 is my most carried pistol but I still carry a LCP, P32, XDS .45 somewhat frequently. It is nice to have choices.

index.php
 
3" NAA Earl with plow handle grips loaded with magnum Gold Dots weighs 9.1 ounces. The 4" weighs 9.6 ounces. I just put Revision CV grips on the missus' 2" NAA Black Widow. Don't know the weight but the Revision grips are great and the BW sights are better than the Earls'. Wife loves the combo--maybe even more than her Bearcat.

I've attached homemade "holsters" (actually minimalist leather strips) to side-attach suspenders. The little NAAs disappear under a shirt, plus I don't have to keep hiking up my pants. Pancake holsters for the shorter barrels also hide easily.

I'm okay with .22 magnums because we can practice a lot with LR and WRF ammo. Anything rougher would beat up my joints and put off the missus.
 
Without reducing to the novelty micro revolvers from NAA, nothing is going to get smaller and lighter than the micro 380’s. LCP, LCP II, Kel-Tec P3AT… 8-9oz and smaller than a wallet. Even the little 22/25/32 pistols typically aren’t as light, and certainly not as reliable, let alone as powerful.

This discussion does however sound like an alternative solution for support is more appropriate than trying to find a 3”x2” 6oz firearm solution.
 
bassjam said:
You mention you owned the LCP and I don't know why that's not a consideration but I'll give my story:

My first carry gun was an LCP in 2010. It was wildly inaccurate, I struggled to even hit an 8x10 piece of paper at 5 yards. Reviews at the time told me that was par for the course for that gun. So I switched to a 337 j-frame, which was very accurate, and then to a 442 because I wanted a snag-free profile and didn't find the extra weight over the AirLite noticeable.
Click to expand...

Pretty much the route I took. Got an LCP, found it was not a fun or rewarding experience to shoot. Impossible to plink with. Bought a snubby, found it not difficult to shoot and shoot well. I decided I'd rather have 5 of .38 thank 6 of .380. That snubby's in my pocket as I write.
 
keltec p32 is reliable, small, flat, comfortable with hogue grips. 32acp ammo is perfectly viable for close-up, last-ditch defense, reasonably comfortable to shoot accurately, but pricey when it can be found.
 
Last edited:
If the size isn't an issue, a 340SC (it's a 340PD nowdays), weighs 11oz; depending on the weight of the individual rounds, it comes out very light.
Understand about keeping your britches up; the suspenders sound like a good idea. How wide/stiff is your belt?
A buddy put me on to really stiff belts for holding up your pants, regardless of what is hauling them down.
Moon
 
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