standard pressure heavy 45 colt load

[murf]

well, i finally got out to the range to shoot the heavy/slow 45 colt load that i loaded up way back in june. i shoot in the prescott national forest and it has been closed to shooting since june. so the bullet is a lyman 325gn swc gc dc from montana bullet works. powder is w231 @ 5.0 grains, cci 300 primer, winchester cases and a 1.570" c.o.l..

results:

i was shaking too much to get good accuracy here, but i quit the coffee for the near future and should be steadier tomorrow. this is probably why my dart throwing has gone south. i'll check that out tomorrow, too.

next load i'm going to go with a light crimp and all else the same. the testing i did back in may 2020 was done with a different 325 grain bullet, same powder and with a longer c.o.l. that load was very accurate and the only real difference was the light crimp applied. i'm hoping the lighter crimp will tighten things up a bit.

murf

p.s. here is the old thread: https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/standard-pressure-heavy-45-colt-question.868804/

 

[Walkalong]

I found that adventure to be a challenge, the heavies just acted different than I am used to.

 

[DocRock]

Have you slugged the bore and gauged throats? I’m not overjoyed with MBW having moved to really hard alloy (they are 22BHN), and .452” is the minimal diameter for most revolvers. Was the 325 grs bullet from the Spring that you found more accurate a different diameter or hardness?

 

[Project355]

What sort of velocity?

 

[Charlie98]

Have you slugged the bore and gauged throats?

With any Ruger revolver this needs to be addressed... seriously.

 

[Charlie98]

I’m not overjoyed with MBW having moved to really hard alloy (they are 22BHN),

Only for the bullets likely destined for the 454 Casull, and other higher velocity cartridges. The 270's, for example, are still 15BHN.

 

[DocRock]

Only for the bullets likely destined for the 454 Casull, and other higher velocity cartridges. The 270's, for example, are still 15BHN.

Got it. That makes sense of course.

 

[murf]

What sort of velocity?

640 fps average, it's on the target.

murf

 

[murf]

Have you slugged the bore and gauged throats? I’m not overjoyed with MBW having moved to really hard alloy (they are 22BHN), and .452” is the minimal diameter for most revolvers. Was the 325 grs bullet from the Spring that you found more accurate a different diameter or hardness?

the bore is .451" if i recall, the throats are all reamed to .4525". the bullets from last time are from cast performance, are the same diameter and are hard cast about 22 bhn and plain based. so far, the cast performance bullets are much more accurate. but i have just started working up the load so that's a bit unfair.

murf

 

[murf]

i decided to weigh test the mbw bullets last night while i had the powder scale out loading up another ten rounds. i am disappointed at the weight of 335 grains but pleased at the difference of only plus or minus one grain. i never had luck with getting 335 grain bullets to shoot accurate in the 45 colt cartridge. maybe these bullets will prove me wrong.

murf

 

[DocRock]

the bore is .451" if i recall, the throats are all reamed to .4525". the bullets from last time are from cast performance, are the same diameter and are hard cast about 22 bhn and plain based. so far, the cast performance bullets are much more accurate. but i have just started working up the load so that's a bit unfair.

murf

Size seems right. It seems unlikely, but at 640 fps, one wonders whether the 335 grs MBW bullet could be at the outer limits of stabilization? Pure speculation, of course. Do you have any of the CP bullets left? If the MBW bullet is longer, it may be a variable in play.

 

[murf]

Size seems right. It seems unlikely, but at 640 fps, one wonders whether the 335 grs MBW bullet could be at the outer limits of stabilization? Pure speculation, of course. Do you have any of the CP bullets left? If the MBW bullet is longer, it may be a variable in play.

just got back from shooting the next ten. a few things came to light. the cp bullets basically go into a 2x3 inch group at 28 yards. that is, for me, an accurate bullet and something to compare these mbw bullets.

murf

 

[murf]

here is the result of the next ten rounds. the only thing that changed regarding the rounds was the crimp from medium to light. the nut behind the trigger is slowly figuring out how to shoot again. i stopped holding the blackhawk like a glock and started holding it like a revolver. no index finger in front of the trigger guard to walk the groups from side-to-side.


the chronograph is done. it has served me well for over twenty years and is finally giving up the ghost. i know where this load is velocity-wise so, no big deal. i'm going to concentrate on comparing the two bullets, cp and mbw.

another big thing is i tested for bullet setback. i shot 4 and measured the col of the fifth. no change! nice pleasant recoil, too. i could shoot this load all day.

unless someone sees something wrong, i'm sticking with this load for the cp bullet comparison and may play with the crimp later on. i also have to do a powder forward/back test but it will have to wait for a new chronograph.

looking good so far,

murf

 

[murf]

Have you slugged the bore and gauged throats? I’m not overjoyed with MBW having moved to really hard alloy (they are 22BHN), and .452” is the minimal diameter for most revolvers. Was the 325 grs bullet from the Spring that you found more accurate a different diameter or hardness?

i just measured both bullets this time: the first pic is the mbw: weight is 336 grains, bullet diameter is .451", gas check diameter is .453" (perfect!). the second pic is the cp: weight is 323 grains, the diameter is .452" (also perfect).

murf

 

[Charlie98]

It's interesting... I use 2 'quality' bullets, those from Cast Performance (only in the .41,) and those from Montana (in the .41, and a slew of rifle cartridges.) I've found the CP bullets to always produce the best accuracy. Part of that may be the bullet... I don't buy the same bullet from both places. In rifle loads, the Montana bullets are always better than any generic commercially cast bullet, very often the same or nearly the same bullet.

 

[black mamba]

From everything I've ever read or been told about reloading, and I've been doing it for 47 years, 231 is too fast a powder for shooting 325-335 gr. bullets in 45 Colt. Your particular load may work, but fast powders and heavy bullets can jump up the pressure very quickly with very small increases in charge weight. Unique is the fastest powder I would even consider for this application, and Herco or Blue Dot would be even better, safer.

 

[Charlie98]

From everything I've ever read or been told about reloading, and I've been doing it for 47 years, 231 is too fast a powder for shooting 325-335 gr. bullets in 45 Colt. Your particular load may work, but fast powders and heavy bullets can jump up the pressure very quickly with very small increases in charge weight. Unique is the fastest powder I would even consider for this application, and Herco or Blue Dot would be even better, safer.

I agree, but the OP had a velocity window he was working with, and I'm guessing W231 fit that window.

 

[murf]

i loaded and shot ten of each bullet: no shaking today, but still have to get my grip sorted out. hopefully a clean gun will help. the mbw bullets are still looking good. back at it tomorrow

murf

 

[Charlie98]

no shaking today, but still have to get my grip sorted out.

Shooting a single-action takes a little getting used to... at least for me. The slow lock time of the hammer doesn't contribute to good groups, in my experience.

 

[murf]

Shooting a single-action takes a little getting used to... at least for me. The slow lock time of the hammer doesn't contribute to good groups, in my experience.

my follow-through has gone. It is coming back slowly. It happens every time I go without shooting for a while. the gun is also quite dirty. am cleaning it now. the forcing cone and the first bit of barrel has lead. the cylinder throats look ok.

thanks for the tip,

murf

 

[murf]

well, i took some time off to evaluate this testing. first, i'm in denial about my degraded shooting skill, so i decided to shoot from the bench. second, i just got my follow through back so all subsequent targets (after the 12/25 targets) should mostly be the gun and not me (i put a few hundred rounds through my ruger mkII). third, i dropped the powder charge a half grain to 4.5 as i think 640 fps is still too fast to stay under the saami max pressure limit for the 45 colt. fourth, i ordered a new chronograph back on the sixteenth and decided to wait for it. it showed up xmas eve afternoon.

christmas eve:

this is a lot better than before, but still a bit wide. it has potential though.

christmas day:

this is my old reliable 325 grain bullet from cast performance. accuracy is good, but the round is too long for the saa cylinder. i did this to determine the stability of that bullet at that slow velocity. it works at 25 yards.



this is the same montana bullet works 335 grain swc load that i shot the day before. i don't know why this is a scatter pattern, but i'm going to load it up again and try to get the group size down. the good news is that the bullet is stable and @ 566 fps should be under the 14,000 psi max pressure of the 45 colt. i don't like the high es number (73), though.

if the load works, i'll check it @ 50 yards and then do a penetration test. i'm guessing eight jugs of water with this slow load.

the new chrony works great. no err1 on the display anymore!

murf

p.s. i have not done any powder forward/back testing yet. all this shooting has been done without regard for that.

 

[Blue68f100]

Have you checked you barrel for leading? That will kill the accuracy and would explain the scatter pattern.

 

[murf]

Have you checked you barrel for leading? That will kill the accuracy and would explain the scatter pattern.

funny you should ask. i just checked and recleaned the gun a bit ago. slight leading at the forcing cone is all. i removed that and will be putting another ten down range hopefully today.

murf

 

[Walkalong]

@murf helped me with advise in the thread when I was working up a load for 320 Gr bullets in .45 Colt. It was a very different animal reloading heavies, a real learning curve for me.

 

[murf]

ten more down range:

virtually no crimp: case o.d. is .473", crimp maybe .001" (i measured the case mouth @ .472"). i'm thinking a 3x3 inch group @ 25 yards isn't bad. i'm surprised the bullet is still accurate and stable @ 535 fps. recoil is pleasant, even from my 37 ounce blackhawk.

next up is 50 yard accuracy, powder forward/back test and water jug penetration test (walkalong got ten jugs with his load i'm betting i get eight).

murf