State of the Union address...

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"The look on Hillary's face was priceless. "

Do you remember Richard Boone's line in "Big Jake". Something like "Mister, I saw something in your eyes....yada,yada...."

Well, I saw something that scared the Bajeezus out of me, it was like a fast forward to the future. I saw a future POTUS. She had a look of smugness mostly. How did she and Joe get such primo seats behind the Joint Chiefs? And why was she sitting beside Joe? Questions to ponder!
 
Here is a link between Iraq and Al Queda, that appeared in the news back in August, when the US decided not to attack northern Iraq so as not to cause problems for weapon inspections.
The original story about Ansar Al Islam and ties to Alqueda was on the washington post site but they want a password I dont have to see it. This group was experimenting with farm animals and even killed one Iraqi man.

Ricin suspects linked to Iraqi terror group

13:05 - 16 January 2003

The US has indications the men arrested in Britain with traces of the poison ricin are linked to a terrorist group in northern Iraq.

But an official has refused to elaborate on evidence linking the men to Ansar al-Islam, a group which other officials have said is linked both to al-Qaida and possibly to Saddam Hussein's government in Iraq.

The United States says the threat of Saddam delivering chemical or biological weapons to terrorists is the main reason for threatening war against Iraq if Saddam refused to give up weapons of mass destruction.

The official was travelling in Europe with Deputy Defence Secretary Paul Wolfowitz who has discussed with Nato how the alliance could contribute in any possible war with Iraq.

The administration official said the United States would like Nato to use naval forces to guard sea approaches to the eastern Mediterranean, as well as to use Awacs aerial surveillance aircraft to help co-ordinate a defence of Turkey, a Nato member.

The official also said the US would like Nato to provide Patriot anti-missile batteries to Turkey and to provide troops to defend US military installations, both in Europe and in the Persian Gulf.

Speaking in Stuttgart, he said several Nato counties have already agreed to individually provide such assistance, but a show of solidarity by the alliance itself could help convince Saddam to disarm peacefully.

The United States has given information to United Nations weapons inspectors about individual Iraqi scientists to question, as well as specific Iraqi activities and locations to inspect, the official said.

The official said the United States would make public more information about Iraq's weapons programs if President George Bush decides the UN inspections are not succeeding.


UN - fortunately there are folks who want to wait for a catastrophic attack on the United States before we ACT. I heard Nancy Pelosi and Turddy K. say last night that the evidence was not sufficient.
What do they expect?? and admission from Saddam?, a trip to Iraq to see the weapons that Saddam is hidding first hand, perhaps we should name our spies and explain exactly how we are getting our intelligence.

If July of 2001 Clinton had said that there was evidence that an attack was imminent in September and we need to invade afghanistan how many folks in congress would have supported him?????

It comes down to wether you Trust George W. or Saddam.

Well who do you trust more.??????

:fire:
 
You asked for someone's opinion on the speech. He gave it to you. Now you're mad? Why? 'Cause he didn't wave a pompom?
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Tamara is far too erudite to have made this error other than intentionally for humorous effect. The paper-strip thingie cheerleaders wave is a pompon. A pompom is the 37mm, water-cooled, belt-fed Maxim-Nordenfeldt (among others, with variants produced as Vickers-Maxim and Hotchkiss-Maxim). It featured a firing rate of 60 rounds per minute, utilising a belt of 25 one-pound shells, each shell with a maximum range of up to 3,000 yards. The nickname pompom (also spelled pom-pom) came from its distinctive sound when fired.
Since this is a gun board, and Tamara is Tamara, she obviously meant Zander is acting peevish because Seminole wasn't waving a small artillery piece in support of Bush Mk2.
However politically effective the speech might have been, Seminole has made an excellent point. For my part, I find it difficult to wave a pompon, or pompom, just because one group of stastist control freaks has scored a couple political points against the other group of statist control freaks.
 
I was suprised to see the call for Partial-Birth abortion and the 15 billion for AIDS treatments in Africa.

He certainly set the tone for a showdown with Iraq. I look forward to hearing Powell present the evidence to the UN next week.

MJ
 
don't really agree with him sending billions of dollars in AIDS help to Africa when there are people here who can't afford the treatments. The same goes for food aid to other countries.
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Hopefully, this new govt envolvement will lower the cost of these drugs at home, and save millions of lives here and abroad (look at what we were able to do with small pox). I don't recall the last time I heard of an American starving to death.

My tax money for "mentors" for at risk children...nope, not good in my opinion
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Catch them young and they will need fewer services later. It will save money in the long haul. Of course, we can continue to spend the medicaid and other Federal dollars now since it seems to work so well:confused: And trust me, that money you save on your taxes these coming years is not from the defence budget, I'm certain Human Services will take deep cuts, and the mentor program is the band-aid.

I say give it a try. It is not as if I'm being taxed more, they are just spending it different. I agree with this plan.

From a broader perspective the U.S. does need to expand its reach throughout the world. The stronger the U.S. gets, the more enemies it will have (look at history), the more enemies we have the more allies we need. As the Earth continues to move towards a world economy the Earth needs a leader, who better than us, right?
 
He made a good point about the weapons inspectors. Their job isn't to go on a scavenger hunt looking for weapons, their job is to ensure that the weapons we know they have are destroyed.

As far as government investment in hydrogen fuel goes, when has the government ever invented anything worthwhile? All I can think of is the atomic bomb and the ability to send men to the moon. These two balance each other out nicely.

Thank you government, now stop wasting my money on pipe dreams and get out of the way to let free enterprise invent stuff. Hopefully he was talking about tax incentives to encourage actual production and not just research. The thing is...if anyone could make hydrogen power work economically, he or she would be rich with or without the government's "help".
 
I watched about 20 minutes of it. Blech. Count me with Seminole - who cares if it was politically effective? It was a sad commentary on the state of the Federal government. It has occured to me that if the inevitable (and virtually already existing) war against Iraq goes sour, I'm the exact right age to get drafted. Ain't no [insert expletive here] way Bush and Co are going to drag me off to Iraq to get shot.
 
"I was suprised to see the call for Partial-Birth abortion and the 15 billion for AIDS treatments in Africa."


Just (PC) cover all bases. Nothing new
in the world of politics. Words mean nothing, action is what we need.:banghead:
 
"Ain't no [insert expletive here] way Bush and Co are going to drag me off to Iraq to get shot."

Don't worry, they won't introduce a draft. If it comes to it, our military will get the job done. That's what they train for, it's what they do.
 
Ian,

I don't think you need to worry about being drafted; even in its current, downsized state, our military is more than capable of handing Iraq a stompin' with one hand tied behind its back.

Should we? A couple months back, I was in the "Hell, no!" camp, now I'm in the "Well, maybe..." camp. Regardless, it's pretty much a fait accompli now...
 
"Howard J. Turkster: I joined the army 'cause my father and brother were in the army. I though I'd better join before I got drafted.

Sgt. Hulka: Son, uh, there ain't no draft no more.

Howard J. Turkster: There was one? ".:D

I mean no offense Ian, but those who will invade Iraq joined the armed forces by their own choice. There better be a lot more than this going on to reinstate the draft.
 
Ahenry:

I'm not saying that its impossible for a smoking gun to exist, I'm just doubtful that it does. Basically what our homies at the UN want to see is a cannister full of nerve gas, with Saddam Hussein's fingerprints (and probably DNA) on it, postage paid in Iraqi currency, addressed to "Empire State Building, New York, New York, USA" with a return address of "O. Bin Laden, 123 Main Street, Anytown, Afghanistan."

And even then, France would probably still say we faked it.

This farce has reached the point of high comedy. Blix is willfully blind, the UN has decided that they'd reaaaaallly rather not address this issue, and Saddam sees light at the end of the tunnel by just...dragging.... this.... out.... as.... long... as.... he.... .... .... possibly.... .... .... .... .... ... can. Becuase the UN will eventaully get tired and go away. Again.

I think Bush II is better off sticking to the simple facts of the matter and not trying to find a smoking gun...because even if it is found, people will say "thats not a gun...and its not smoking."

Mike
 
"There better be a lot more than this going on to reinstate the draft."


I'm sure it would take more however
on the bright side we could downsize
our population because if i am correct
when reading this board they would
go to Canada.:rolleyes:
 
"That's fine. My daughter and I will go and fight for your freedom in your absence. Just keep things in order here for us till we get back. Thanks." No, ehenz! Thank YOU!
 
Yeah, I know we can handle Iraq with the forces at hand. By 'goes sour', I'm considering possibilities like follow-up invasions or Iran and/or North Korea. Very low probability of it happening, but the risk involved (my life) is serious enough to catch my attention.

ehenz - My freedom is in way, waaay more danger from politicians here than from some dictator in Iraq, even if he does have some neat toys Bush doesn't like. If you and your daughter would like to participate in some war over there, that's peachy. But don't make the assumption that your doing so somehow makes me freer; it doesn't.
 
I'm the exact right age to get drafted. Ain't no [insert expletive here] way Bush and Co are going to drag me off to Iraq to get shot.
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don’t worry your precious mind a bit. There are enough other people with a sense of responsibility that you wont have to risk anything for your freedom. Where is that barf smilie...



I think Bush II is better off sticking to the simple facts of the matter and not trying to find a smoking gun...because even if it is found, people will say "thats not a gun...and its not smoking."
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Fair enough. I think many “on the edge†people will be surprised at what we actually know, but like you I don’t think a thing more than what has already been said, needs to be said. Time will tell...
 
But don't make the assumption that your doing so somehow makes me freer; it doesn't.
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Ian,

That's fine too, but then don't do the same and assume it won't. (I'm not trying to "flame")

You are free not to serve and I have no ill will towards your decision, and provided there is a draft you can go to Canada, prison, or whatever option is available. Still no ill will.

In situations such as these, it is sometimes best to keep quite until one knows the facts before you start minimizing another's "peachy" ideals, ...and perhaps on Feb 5th we will know a lot more than we would like.

Yet for now, Saddam is a tyrant, a constant threat to your freedoms, and he needs to go regardless if we are called up to serve.

It is hard to exercize your freedoms with coninued theats from terrorism, when you are in bed waiting to die from anthrax or smallpox, radiation poisoning, or the countless other means for inturupting our free way of life.

Do you really think the war over Saddams "toys" is that unimportant to our American way of life?
 
It is hard to exercize your freedoms with coninued theats from terrorism, when you are in bed waiting to die from anthrax or smallpox, radiation poisoning, or the countless other means for inturupting our free way of life.
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Were we not free, then, during the Cold War when the Sovs demonstrably had enormous numbers of nukes and other weapons of mass destruction aimed at us? Are we not free because the Chinese still do? Are we not free because the North Koreans are joining the nuclear club?

Sorry. You'll be fighting for the national interest, or at least Bush Mk2's idea of the national interest, not freedom for the American people. Thank you for volunteering to do so.
 
"Connect the dots, my fellow Americans" ....

....is the only thing I wish the President would have added, after reciting the list of violations/issues, and looking towards the right at all the hand-wringers crying that no one could connect the dots a year after 9/11.
 
Were we not free, then, during the Cold War when the Sovs demonstrably had enormous numbers of nukes and other weapons of mass destruction aimed at us? Are we not free because the Chinese still do? Are we not free because the North Koreans are joining the nuclear club?
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Lets try some apples to apples comparisons please. There is not a one answer fits all in foriegn policy. All the above mentioned nations have demonstrated the ability to exersize restraint with these weapons, Saddam has not, nor has N. Korea.

Our national interest is the protection of our freedom, isn't it?

I quess we should wait until we are attack by our enemies. Then we will have the smoking gun so many are looking for, again :rolleyes:

Better yet, maybe if we do nothing the problem will go away on its own.
 
Ain't no [insert expletive here] way Bush and Co are going to drag me off to Iraq to get shot.
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This makes me sick. First off, as mentioned, there won't be a draft over Iraq. Nobody in the military is for a draft--it's a last resort option. More importantly, though, if you wouldn't stand up for your country if called upon why don't you just get to steppin' and move to Canada or, maybe better yet, France. I'm sure they'd love both you and your attitude over there.

Mark
 
ehenz - Sorry if I conveyed the wrong impression - I don't mean 'peachy' in a condesceding way. My attitude is that someone else deciding to go fight is entirely their prerogative, and none of my business.

..Saddam is a tyrant, a constant threat to your freedoms...
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Yeah, he's certainly a tyrant, but I don't see him doing anything to me (I'm not a Kurdish villager). I'm far more concerned about tyrants right here at home - they are doing things every day which directly erode my personal freedom. When the Iraqi Army airdrops into Indiana to enforce the law, then perhaps I'll change my mind about Saddam.

Do you really think the war over Saddams "toys" is that unimportant to our American way of life?
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Absolutely.

Ahenry - I'll risk my life and welfare for my freedom right here at home, thank you.
 
This week's Khornet editorial for America's Voices:

PRESIDENT HITS HOME RUN

George W. Bush stepped up to the plate last night and, with poise and confidence, knocked the ball out of the park.

It's irrelevant whether you agree with his policies or not, although the State of the Union speech was certainly more satisfying for those of us who agree. But the sweetest part of the speech was not the text or the policy details. No, its glory was elsewhere: it was in the solid character which it radiated.

This is a president whom the Wise Ones have pronounced stupid and inarticulate, warlike and simple minded, weak and a puppet of older and smarter advisers, and the tool of wealthy industrialists. But last night he showed us that what drives his decision-making is anything but what people think of him. Last night he told us flatly what he believes must be done, and he told us just as flatly that he intends to do it.

There were no weasel words and almost no euphemisms, except perhaps when he remarked that certain terrorists "are no longer a problem." He made no attempt to disguise the character of his policies. His position on taxes was not a policy wonk list of cleverly targeted rule changes, but a forthright declaration that high taxes cripple our economy and hurt everyone. No attempt to defend himself against charges of favoring the "rich"; high taxes are bad and must be ended.

Likewise with tort reform, abortion, and, especially, Iraq and North Korea. He completely ignored the many criticisms of his policies, and without even a nod to his opponents he charged ahead. When was the last time we had a president like this? And there were no poster children last night. Special guests there were, but no part of the speech was devoted to encomiums for any individual who was singled out, and there was none of that putting on of someone else's glory that we have seen in so many recent State of the Union addresses.

Not since the days of Ronald Reagan have we had a president who stuck to his guns like this. As the speech went on, I began to squirm because soon that dreaded word would come up: "nucular". And sure enough, it did, not just once, but over and over. The president made no attempt to correct his pronunciation. Can you imagine how either of the last two presidents would have handled a weakness like this? Their speechwriters would have worked overtime finding ways to make the point without using the problem word. Mr. Bush, in effect, told the world that he doesn't give a hoot whether we are bothered by the way he pronounces " nuclear"; those who define his presidency by his pronunciation are so far beneath his notice that he went ahead and mispronounced that word again and again.

And here is a President who isn't afraid to stay out loud that he believes in God.

The cynics and doubters will carefully parse every word and gesture as a political ploy, thus proving that they can't see the forest for the trees. What happened last night was completely obvious: Mr. Bush said what he said because of what he believes, and his opponents will now have to attack him on principles and not on slogans and minutiae. In this they will lose, because slogans and minutiae are the only weapons they have.

In the past I have endlessly corrected my children on the pronunciation of the "n-word". After last night, I don't think I'll bother anymore. I could not be more proud to have this man as president.

That wasn't just powerful speech.. It was downright nucular.



Michael R. Bowen M.D.
 
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