tacticooled shotguns

[SuperNaut]

I took the Crusader tactical shotgun course last fall and I discovered a couple things about some of the accessories that I always thought were stupid: Much to my surprise, some actually make a lot of sense.

I found out why you have to change the foregrip; the stock ones cover the chamber and interfere with tactical reloads.

Shooting one 3" magnum slug doesn't really require any recoil pads or compensating stocks. Shooting 20+ 3" magnum slugs makes you want something cushy really, really, bad.

A heat shield isn't at all necessary, but it sure does a good job of protecting the barrel when you are smacking against target stands.

Pistol grips allow for excellent one-handed control of the shotgun when performing tactical reloads.

When the instructor tells you to put 2 in each target and there are four targets, you suddenly wish you had an extended tube and side-saddle.

Around hour three of the course you realize that a sling would have been a really good purchase.



Tacticool or training tool?

 

[inSight-NEO]

...as long as nobody claims that tritium sights on a shotgun are "tacticool" nonsense, I will be silent. Ditto for full length stocks with a pistol grip (such as the Benelli "SteadyGrip" stock)...great for slug use.

 

[psyopspec]

This is one of the most amusing threads I've seen in a while; a series of folks talking about their shotguns and how they've accessorized them, then following up their descriptions of the guns with "but at least I'm not going overboard to the point of tacticool." What's hilarious is the different liberties everyone takes with the term, then the distance they try to put between it and their gun, all in the name of not being made fun of on the internet.

You are (I assume) all adults. Who gives a crap what someone on the internet thinks of your gun? Why the desire to dodge being categorized "tacticool" by some random folks on the web? Just trying to understand, is all.

I have an 870 Marine Magnum. It's stock, but when I get home I may add a light or an adjustable stock to it. An optic may follow, because when I tried one, I found that it worked for me. It's already "tacticool" as is around the parts where I grew up. However, I plan defense of self and home based on training what works for me. What "gunboifan69" on the interwebs thinks of that, I could give a damn.

 

[yongxingfreesty]

dont need sights on a shotgun lol. like mine plain and simple. kinda like an ak47/74.

 

[psyopspec]

dont need sights on a shotgun lol. like mine plain and simple. kinda like an ak47/74.

Both variations of the Klashnikov have sights...

 

[ultradoc]

I saw a pic of a single shot .410 with by pod,sling and scope. It was advertised as being a tactical shotgun by the owner. Not sure if he was serious or not.

 

[dom1104]

You would be surprised how precise a bead is at the end of a long barrel.

I have killed several deer at long ranges for a slug with just a bead, every time right where the bead was, is now a bloody hole.

Beads look bad to internet commandoes, but work just fine at shotgun ranges in real life.

 

[Dimis]

haha i guess i really started something here lol

to clarify i guess i fall into a tactical shotgun just so everyone knows

i own a mossberg 590 with bead front sight speedfeed stock (that i dont use) and nothing extra on the gun at all

if what you use works for you thats what you need to use but what i was getting at was being overdone

btw tritium sights and full leanth stocks with pistol grips especialy the "steadygrip" are just too tacticool (just kidding insight lol)

 

[Youngster]

Assuming a factory setup riot gun, I'll add a sling {outdoors}, and maybe an aftermarket magazine follower and recoil pad if warranted, but that's about tacticool as I get.

 

[OregonJohnny]

I own an 870 Marine. I guess the only things "tacticool" about it are it's extended mag tube and nickel finish. You know, for those salt-water zombies.

I have added the old worn-out Uncle Mikes butt sleeve shell holder that I used to have on my standard 870 Express.

I considered things like ghost ring sights, single-point slings, side saddles, etc. But I realized those things would only disrupt my years and years of familiarity with the standard no-nonsense 870 platform. Why mess with a good thing?

 

[Nick5182]

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=115231&d=1265776617 Here's a pic of my two 870's. My computer won't let me right click on them to copy them to the post. The one with the pistol grip has the red/ green dot now.

 

[ForumSurfer]

I have an 870 Marine Magnum. It's stock, but when I get home I may add a light or an adjustable stock to it. An optic may follow, because when I tried one, I found that it worked for me. It's already "tacticool" as is around the parts where I grew up.

Same here.

Mine was as tacticool as you could buy when I bought during the second year of production.

I've also enjoyed shooting it over the years more than any other firearm I own. It's very fun trying to shoot dual traps with that thing before you're out of reach. It's just all around fun because it seems so light and well balanced to me.

 

[DeepSouth]

Nevermind, the pic want show.

 

[essayons21]

Beads are great when you are shooting clays in a field or sitting in a duck blind.

When you are laying on your back at night trying to shoot around cover trying to expose minimal surface area, a good parallax free optic is a lot easier than trying to get a good stock weld on your bead.

Wood stocks are great too, but a pistol grip is handier, points more naturally, assists with one handed shooting and reloads, is easier to shoot around cover and from awkward positions, and is more comfortable to carry for long periods of time.

A side saddle sure comes in handy when shooting matches, or when you want to be able to alternate between buck, slugs, or less-lethal.

A flashlight is really handy when you want to distinguish between a home invader or a sleepwalking child at 2 AM.

The benefits of adjustable stocks are widely recognized in carbines, why should you buy separate length stocks or spacers just because it is a shotgun?

Really, why would anything that is considered practical on a fighting carbine be "tacticool garbage" on a fighting shotgun?

Different strokes for different folks, but combat, 3-gun matches, and tactical shotgun courses will show that many "tacticool" accessories are popular for good reason.

I'll post a picture of my "social" shotgun, a tacticool M500, just as soon as I find that darn camera.

 

[augustino]

OK so mabe I'm just plain old, OLD fashioned but the pic of the model 37 perched at the window with the fresh snow outside, is THE best looking SG pic I've seen in some time.
Hands down I prefer a stock SG, wooden furniture of course, well worn and well cared for. Loaded and seated comfortably in the ready position.
Never have been too crazy about all the "bells & whistles" they make for SGs. Never cared for the plastic stocks, special grips, supercallafragilistic STUFF that's a multi million dollar business yearly.
Give me a STOCK wooden furnished model 37; model 12; model 1300; or whatever model but give me wood and keep it stock!
Hard to say which is favorite cause I love almost every SG I've owned or own.

 

[oneounceload]

When you are laying on your back at night trying to shoot around cover trying to expose minimal surface area, a good parallax free optic is a lot easier than trying to get a good stock weld on your bead.

And that is a real-world everyday occurrence...........where? Or is that only in the video game world? How many folks would really be in that situation?

 

[essayons21]

And that is a real-world everyday occurrence...........where? Or is that only in the video game world? How many folks would really be in that situation?

When bullets start flying it is amazing what the human body can hide behind.

Smart money in any shooting is on the person who gets the lowest behind the thickest cover. If you are serious about defending against an armed and active shooter, shooting around cover should be practiced.

You are right, it all depends on your mindset, what you are preparing for, and how much you are willing to train. No amount of gadgetry will compensate for lack of training.

For HD, a flashlight and pistol grip are most likely sufficient. For those who go into harms way in nasty corners of the globe, different tactics make more sense. Its not all video games. Unfortunately, the military provides far too little practical training before sending soldiers into these situations, so proactive service members often take it upon themselves to equip and train themselves on their own dime.

And lets not forget those who choose to prepare and train for the original intent of the 2nd Amendment.

 

[Girodin]

Tacticool shotguns disgust me. I play by the KISS principle. The only mod on my 870 is a vertical foregrip.

I'll be the one to say it. It looks like you made a SBR. I know its a goof but it could get a lot less funny.

 

[RevolvingGarbage]

I'll be the one to say it. It looks like you made a SBR. I know its a goof but it could get a lot less funny.

I believe it would only be a SBR if operable, which it clearly wouldn't be. As soon as you pulled either trigger, that duct tape is coming apart.

I have a shotgun, a snub revolver, and a roll of duct tape. Am I in constructive possession of a SBR?

 

[essayons21]

Yes.

Keep in mind we are dealing with an agency who determined airsoft rifles can be "readily converted" into machine guns.

 

[Gord]

Yeah, let's go with "no." By that logic, anyone with a handgun, a roll of duct tape and any of the following:

- A long gun of any sort, real, replica, airsoft or otherwise
- A crutch
- A 2x4
- A stout wire coat hanger
- A misshapen stick
- Any other object capable of having one end inserted into someone's shoulder pocket

...is in constructive possession of a SBR. If you want to get into the nuancies of ATF's megalomania and/or how they might conspire to throw me in the pokey, take it to PM rather than crapping this thread with it. Last I heard, ATF wasn't issuing forth in myriad black helicopters to arrest people who were wearing shoelaces while operating a firearm. That's illegal, dontcha know.

We now return to your scheduled thread...

 

[Girodin]

Yeah, let's go with "no." By that logic,

The little bit of experience I have in administrative law has taught me that logic doesn't count for much. When you want to know what the law is when dealing with executive agencies you do not ask what makes sense or what would be good policy. You A) Look up the statute. B) Look up the regs promulgated by the agency C) Look up cases interpreting them. Determining what surely must be the case because it only makes sense avails you nothing in these matters.

I believe it would only be a SBR if operable

I'm not sure about a SBRs but it has been held that the prosecution need not prove operability to support a conviction for possessing an unregistered silencer. The court stated that the "language of statutes focused on intended application of silencer, not its actual demonstrated operation." U.S. v. Carter 465 F.3d 658 (C.A.6 (Ohio),2006); See also U.S. v. Syverson, C.A.7 (Wis.) 1996, 90 F.3d 227. An interesting note about that case the prosecutions expert witness conceded that the “silencer” in question was not operable. He was still convicted and that conviction was upheld by the Sixth Circuit. How much sense does that make? Buy that logic any metal cylinder might be called a silencer, guess what that didn’t matter one bit.

Now if someone has some regs and/or cases that indicate contrary I'd love to hear it. If you just think that couldn't be the case because its too stupid, do some reading.

As with silencers, the statute regulating SBRs does not focus on their “actual demonstrated operation” (i.e the tape would tear apart). Nothing in the statutory definition indicates it cannot be a single shot SBR.

As a matter of statutory construction it is not too hard to make a strong argument that the weapon pictured falls within the plain meaning of the text defining a short barreled rifle. I suggest you go to the U.S.C. and read it. Conversely, and in support of such an argument, it also seems clear from a plain meaning reading of the text that the CZ in question is not a “handgun” as defined by the U.S.C. in the configuration it is shown.

Constructive possession isn’t at issue here. It is a matter of actual possession the thing is put together.

I’m not going to spend my Saturday reading statutes, regs, and cases for you. Odds of a picture on here leading to prosecution are probably pretty low. (Really I'd be more concerned about someone else thinking it is funny/cool and copying it going out and some how crossing paths with law enforcement) Without research I’m not sure if this is a settled area of law or a gray one. That said, I have seen some insane things when it comes to people being prosecuted. I’ve also seen what it does to someone’s life to be facing federal felony charges and have the weight of the US government come down on them. It’s not pretty, it’s not fun, it’s not cheap, and it rarely ends well for them. I've seen people who genuinely didn't realize they were doing anything wrong or thought that there was no way they could get in trouble suddenly find themselves staring down the possibility of a prison term. Thus for me when it comes to doing things that could be a very serious felony I play it safer. Why go to the edge of the cliff.

 

[mostholycerebus]

All I know is, if this has to be used in a HD scenario, when the jury looks at "the weapon in question" I want them to think i'm an anguished taxpayer and father pushed into a bad situation, NOT a psycho ninja looking for an excuse.

But its a free country.

 

[zombie1210]

As tacticool as I get

 

[Dookie]

Those $1,200 870's are not a factory stock 870 with a bunch of hardware attached. They are gone through and worked front to back. Everything is improved upon.

Seems a lot of people are willing to have a good trigger and perfect cycling in their rifles and pay to get them there. but their shotguns should be left stock. Weird

A home defense shotgun and a hunting shotgun are two separate entities. Just like a hunting 700 is very different than a sharp shooters/sniper 700.

Don't have a pic, but my 835 is coming around. Started as a wood stocked 28" standard shotgun. But I have since added a synthetic stock set, going to be a adjustable AR style soon. Added an extended safety. And it now has a 24" barrel with fiber optic sights on it, possibly a red dot in the future. Everything I did was to make it more comfortable to shoot, and it will end up looking tactical.