The CCW 'Pistol vs Revolver' Thing Revisited

[Shed]

I know this topic has been debated ad nauseum on just about every firearm forum, but I ran across the following video on YouTube when I was thinking about a Ruger LCR a few months ago:


I'm curious to see what everyone thinks about his argument. Personally, I think he goes a little far in critiquing malfunctions on revolvers; keeping them clean should significantly reduce any likelihood of extractor star problems, while 'tap stroke' and 'kick the door open' should take care of most else.

Considering the lower capacity of revolvers it is also important to be realistic: many people are carrying lower capacity single-stack 9s nowadays and an average of 2 shots are fired in defensive shootings (albeit this is not based on perfect data, see: http://gunssavelives.net/self-defense/analysis-of-five-years-of-armed-encounters-with-data-tables/). Revolvers also have some nice advantages, such as contact shots and dealing with dud cartridges.

I'm sure some or many people will disagree with my critique, which is ok. I'm not passionately for one or the other. I'm simply very interested in hearing what everyone has to say about the arguments in the video.

 

[RPRNY]

Opinions are like belly buttons. Happily, we still maintain enough freedom for most people to be able to express their opinions. The video guy has opinions.

 

[CDW4ME]

I've got a couple revolvers, never carry them; I carry a Glock as primary, Kahr PM9/PM40 as 2nd option in pocket.

 

[toivo]

Opinions are like belly buttons.

Everybody's got one, and they're all full of lint?

 

[Jim NE]

Reliability advantages aside (revolvers can be unreliable, too...until they're sorted out) I think I currently have a preference for revolvers over semi-autos.

I'm going to start training for more defensive real life situations, but I've noticed what my natural tendency is: When I get a light strike on a revolver, I keep on pulling the trigger until the subsequent rounds (and the round that didn't fire the first time) go off. When I get a light strike on a semi-auto, however, my impulse is to stop shooting to see what happened. Training will take care of that for sure, but when I fire a revolver, I can see the cylinder rotate, so I know it's a light strike. When I get a "click" on a semi-auto, I'm more curious as to what caused it. Might not be a light strike...that's happened with me in the past. I also have to remind myself whether the semi-auto I'm shooting has second strike capability or not - some do and some don't. (Not to mention that some have safeties and some don't.)

I'm saying that revolvers are more intuitive. And in a stress scenario, that could make a difference. There is no difference in the essential function of a revolver whether it's one of many models made by S&W or Taurus or Ruger or Rossi. Other than the Ruger release button, they work the same so my response to a potential malfunction is the same, regardless of the gun.

Bottom line: Nothing at all wrong with semi-autos for defense - the high capacity is a real advantage - but for people who can't train as much as they would like, the more intuitive revolver might be a better choice. Good Video.

 

[JohnBiltz]

I'm old, I started shooting handguns with a 4 inch S&W as was pretty common at the time in the USA. There are good reasons that is not so common anymore. I don't buy the "Intuitive" argument. If anything, there is nothing more intuitive than a modern striker gun.

 

[BobWright]

Ruger Blackhawk, .45 Colt, six rounds 250gr. JHP:




Bob Wright

 

[Jim NE]

I'm old, I started shooting handguns with a 4 inch S&W as was pretty common at the time in the USA. There are good reasons that is not so common anymore. I don't buy the "Intuitive" argument. If anything, there is nothing more intuitive than a modern striker gun.

I'm sure that's true...for you. I'm teaching my kids to shoot, though, and believe me, for the starting shooter, the revolver is much more easy to get your head around, in part because of it's standardized and visual mechanical function. I currently own more than 20 semi-auto pistols and love most of them, but when something goes wrong on a semi-auto, it throws the starting shooter in ways that the revolver doesn't. One of the big things is limp wristing...the shooter often thinks it's a gun problem when it isn't. CZ and Walther are good companies, but I have a CZ and a Walther that will only function with a narrow range of ammo types. Not really an issue with similar quality revolvers.

I do agree with the video, however, in that revolvers aren't more reliable out of the box. Once you have the good quality revolver sorted out, though, (with a shakedown cruise of a couple hundred rounds or more) it's usually a little bit more reliable than a similar quality semi-auto that's been also sorted out. To each their own.

 

[Tallball]

I feel that revolver malfunctions are overstated by those who prefer semiautomatics. I have owned... something like 30 revolvers in my life. Only one ever broke or malfunctioned while I was shooting it.

I have owned about the same number of semiautomatic pistols. Almost all of them malfunctioned at one time or another. It was mostly operator error, and occasionally ammo - these were quickly cleared. (A few were just defective.)

I carry semiautomatic pistols sometimes, but I feel more comfortable with revolvers. Sure, tap rack bang is an easy drill, but I am concerned that I might not have enough time.

 

[Varminterror]

Above all other firearms types, I'm a "revolver guy," but 99% of the time, I carry a semi-auto pistol, for real-world applicable reasons.

I WILL, however, echo his statement of "semi-autos are more tolerant of abuse, and revolvers are more tolerant of neglect," and also echo, in lock step with that sentiment, his experience with revolver malfunctions in high volume shooting. I picked up a trick from the only other revolver shooter in a defensive pistol class about 18yrs ago - on day one I noticed a toothbrush in his back pocket. On day 2, I realized why. Ever since then, my "revolver class" kit includes a toothbrush in my back pocket.

 

[Hanshi]

I'm not so sure. If one is in an extended fire fight or does the "spray & pray" thing, an auto-loader makes sense. And if one simply shoots an auto better than a wheel gun, that also makes sense. Most folks aren't particularly skilled with either one and the complexity of an auto can lead to accidents. I always recommend a 2" or 4" revolver to the uninitiated; or in the case of insufficient hand strength, an auto with a manual safety - maybe "double action" only is good - as the learning curve is not as great.

 

[Fiv3r]

I like both. If you twisted my arm and made me pick one firearm to pack around for the rest of my days both on the street and in the wilds, I would go with a 3" .357 revolver.

That said, since I am not limited to one gun, I generally pick a slim .380 as my defensive weapon of choice over a wheel gun. My lifestyle requires an invisible gun. It must be easy to carry around all day, not print in a tucked in tee shirt, and something that handles lots of bending, standing, walking, and sitting. Basically, it needs to go in jean pocket. That means even the LCR is out.

I would love to carry my big ol's GP 100 around. Heck, I wish my wok attire and type of work allowed for me to IWB my Glock 19. However, in the spring/summer months, a micro .380 gets the nod.

 

[Good Ol' Boy]

I like revolvers just as much as semi's in the general affinity for guns mindset.

But in a gun fight or SD I want a semi. My main reasons are capacity and reloading.


However I agree with most of what was said in the video. Nice find and thanks for sharing.

 

[jad0110]

I enjoy and carry both. Lately polymer 9s, easier on my bad back.

But I prefer carrying revolvers. In 10 plus years shooting 10s of thousands of rounds (countless really) through both platforms, I have personally experienced far more semi auto glitches (some intentionally induced via limp arming as I call it), and the most significant failure happened on a Taurus 9mm when the ejector broke off and jammed the slide to the frame - it may as well have been welded together (I've never had a revolver completely fail to function - granted, I'm sure the day is probably coming). So that definitely colors my perspective. And per what I've found in my own testing, revolvers are less sensitive to grip or arm strength (such as if you are injured) than some semi autos (not all, try as I might I can't get my 1911s or my S&W M&P9 Shield to choke).

Anyway, I always get a kick out of the crud under the extractor star bit. As I said, I enjoy them all, but some auto-only guys seem to think a revolver cylinder will cease functioning after 1 or 2 cylinders full. Well, maybe it really does for them because in my observations, this is usually due to operator error. Most people that experience this issue are dumping their empties with the barrel pointing at the ground, which allows crap to fall out of the case and get between the extractor and the back of the cylinder. Point that barrel straight up and pop the empties downward - much cleaner and you'll be working WITH gravity instead of against it. Never had such a problem in all my time shooting revolvers, up to 200 rounds before cleaning. No issues.

The other is the ejector rod backing out. This only happens on one of my 20 or so revolvers - my 1959 S&W K-22 / Model 17 no dash - these have the right hand threaded ejector rod. I have other Smiths with right hand thread rods, but I don't shoot them enough to run into this issue (not yet). Something to be aware of certainly, but I've never had an ejector rod back out on a S&W or other revolver that has a reverse threaded rod - or many Rugers that aren't threaded at all. I think Smith reversed the threads in 1961 or 62. One of the few "improvements" S&W made over the years that I think probably all would agree was actually an improvement and not a cost cutting measure.

Yeah, primers can back out. Have had that happen on both platforms - it can mess either one up.

As for going out of time, that usually happens a little at a time, if you are paying attention you will notice it before it becomes a show stopper. It should not be running fine and then go completely out of time during string of a dozen rounds, unless something breaks (and yes, that can happen).

Just my thoughts.

Semis definitely have their benefits - carrying an SD9VE right now - it's just that for me, there are tradeoffs.

 

[Tallball]

Jad said it well.

 

[huntsman]

To date I've owned 4 revolvers, two DA/SA and two SA and by far I'm a SA fan. I choose a semi-auto(even DA/SA) over a DA/SA revolver for SD. I guess I've been lucky in that I've never really experienced the dreaded semi-auto failures that worry folks.

I question the notion that a DA/SA revolver is ideal for the casual shooter if only because I really had to put quite a few rounds through the gun in order to get the hang of the DA trigger.

 

[FL-NC]

I'm all about autos, cause its 2017. I minimize the "less reliability" factor by using Glocks or my M&P shield. My most powerful is a 45 ACP. The only way I would switch to a wheelgun for any reason is if I determined the 45 ACP wasn't enough gun and I identified a need for a dirty harry magnum of some kind. Just can't see that happening in the CCW world or any other world I find myself in. But to each his own.

 

[Saddlebag Preacher]

It's really a matter of your preference and what you are comfortable with. Many things come into play. For me, although I carry a M&P Shield 90% of the time and a glock 23 the other 10%, I was trained in the late 1970's on a revolver and carried one on duty until the department went to semi autos. After, I carried a .38 snubbie as a BUG most of my carreer.

My wife just got her CCW a few months ago and she chose a .38 snubbie, and she can shoot it really well and enjoys it (not an airweight, but a Taurus SS 85).

After she got it, I shot it and really like the gun, and it was a natural for me after all these years. I would feel comfortable carrying one again, and may in the future. I do not feel undergunned with 5 shots or 13 shots.

 

[340PD]

As an instructor teaching a Basic pistol class, weak strength wise, or otherwise timid new shooters seem a lot more comfortable working with revolvers. Adding a Crimson Trace lasergrip to that gun multiples their confidence and subsequent success ten times over. I have heard hundreds of times, "I don't have the strength to rack the slide" yes, they can be taught how to do it but in a live or die situation and that first limp wristed shot creates a malfunction, only the most well trained will survive. I give the best odds to those people carrying a snubbie over a Glock.

 

[CraigC]

I hear a lot nonsense. As usual, those who prefer autos let their bias shine through. I started shooting revolvers with my very first handgun, 30yrs ago. To date, I have bought and sold over 70 of them and presently own 57. I also shoot them, buying rimfire ammo by the case and loading centerfires on three presses, to the tune of tens of thousands of rounds per year. I must lead a charmed life because I can't remember the last time I had one of the malfunctions noted in the video. Most of them, never. The idea that your typical revolver couldn't make it through a 1000rd class is simply absurd.

IMHO, the often touted advantages of the semi-auto are those that rarely come into play. Those related to reloading, whether it's speed, necessity, are so rare that I do not even carry a reload. The crap about reloading speed is a training issue. People are not born genetically predisposed with the ability to reload an auto quickly. Capacity is also highly overrated. We're not cops. We don't run TO gunfire but away from it. The vast, overwhelming majority of gunfights can be handled with a revolver. Some folks like the added insurance of higher capacity and/or easier reloads and that is perfectly fine but it doesn't change the odds that you'll ever need it.

All that said, I carry an auto more often than a revolver. Why? Strictly because autos come in more concealable packages. My Ruger LC9 covers the same footprint of a 2" J-frame but is considerably thinner. The two extra rounds are just a bonus, reloading irrelevant.

 

[kozak6]

I think the video might be a little dismissive of revolvers as beginner's guns, but that he isn't completely wrong. It's pretty funny that he shows a pro clearing malfunctions on a semiauto.

I picked up a trick from the only other revolver shooter in a defensive pistol class about 18yrs ago - on day one I noticed a toothbrush in his back pocket. On day 2, I realized why. Ever since then, my "revolver class" kit includes a toothbrush in my back pocket.

Dental hygiene is indeed paramount, but did he remember the floss? Seriously though, I'm not a wheelgunner yet. Is it for scrubbing the cylinder face and to serve as an emergency ejector?

 

[Jack B.]

Ever time I go to the range with one of my revolvers someone always comes up to me and asks me what I'm shooting and almost always ask if they can fire a round or two, especially if I am shooting one of my magnums. Never happens when I bring my semiauto's to the range. Seems there is still a lot of interest in revolvers. I guess more people don't own one is because they don't understand them (single vs. double action). People always question me about that. Shame they are missing a lot of fun.

 

[Alte Schule]

As someone who was also weened on 4" S&W's in .38 Special I prefer a revolver and usually carry a S&W 637 Lightweight or an LCR in .327. Although I'm a decent shot with both the main reason I CC those is the weight. Twenty ounces at four o'clock and a speed loader or strip in my left front pocket is a lot more comfortable for this old dude. The only non ammunition related issue I can remember having with a revolver was with a NIB Taurus I bought a few years ago. But that's another story unto itself that I have relayed on other threads here.
I do own several auto loaders though. Nothing over 9 mm. My recently acquired FN 5.7 is on the fast track to becoming one of my all time favorites.

 

[Mark 40]

It's really a matter of your preference and what you are comfortable with.

Great point especially relating to a new shooter. Your wife chose the revolver, as did mine. The worse thing you can do is push someone too hard to accept what you want vs what they are comfortable with. Even if you think the other platform is superior. You hear the sad stories of boyfriends/husbands forcing certain firearms on the ladies. The result turns them off/scares them off and sometimes they never give it another chance. Thats why Preacher's quote above rings true IMO

 

[Jack B.]

Great point especially relating to a new shooter. Your wife chose the revolver, as did mine. The worse thing you can do is push someone too hard to accept what you want vs what they are comfortable with. Even if you think the other platform is superior. You hear the sad stories of boyfriends/husbands forcing certain firearms on the ladies. The result turns them off/scares them off and sometimes they never give it another chance. Thats why Preacher's quote above rings true IMO

I agree with you. My wife has owned a Colt Trooper 357/38 for many years. I bought her a nice 9mm auto not to long ago, she went to the range and put two magazines through it and told me if I like it I could have it or I could sell it. She doesn't like my 45ACP either. The only thing she likes are revolvers and she prefers 357/38 revolvers.