The Ultimate Air rifle

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It's not hard. You rotate the spring loaded clear lexan cover and push pellets in. The plunger pushes a fresh pellet in to the chamber when you bring the cocking lever up. When you pull the cocking rod down, the plunger retracts from the magazine and the spring automatically rotates the next pellet into position and repeat.

It is an air ram rifle (Theoben invented the technology) and has no spring rattle/vibration, just a quick solid thump.

David
 
I have a Daisy 901, a Daisy 880, and 2 Daisy 1000 Break barrels. The 880 is a piece of junk compared to the 901, it's made of cheap plastic compared to the 901's composites and metal. The 901 has had 4 years of hard use and been shot tens of thousands of times, killed a rabbit and at least a dozen crows. It is still good as new. The 1000's are about the cheapest break barrel out there, and are pretty good, but the weight is very unbalanced. Killed a rabbit, a raccoon, and about a dozen crows with it.
 
And people say BB's are inaccurate. Tell that to the bird I pegged in the head from probably 30 feet away with a Red Ryder (that mockingbird on the chimney wouldn't shut the hell up and was squawking there every single morning). No, there's no technical reason why a BB gun can't be very accurate, but nobody makes high-end BB guns because it's not politically correct (or even legal) for children to use a BB gun unsupervised anymore. All of them nowadays are just weak spring-powered guns like my Red Ryder there. Accurate, but gutless.

Some people like the Blue Streak / Silver Streak. I'm not a fan. My father has one, and I've used it plenty of times. It's heavy, extremely hard to pump, iron sights suck, and the stock has absolutely the worst ergonomics I've ever experienced in a rifle-style weapon. No thanks.

I think a precharged pump is going to be your best bet. An inventor from the paintball world came up with something a while back you'll find interesting: it's a booster pump for a shop compressor that, in a few hours, can charge a 68 cubic inch or so 3000 or 4500 PSI air tank. It's relatively quiet, and costs $550. That could certainly solve your problem of relying on a SCUBA tank. Check it out here:

http://www.shoeboxcompressor.com/

Here's the fill times listed:

•3 minutes to fill a one cubic inch air tank to 4500 psi or 300 bar
•68 cubic inch paintball tank 4500 psi = 3.5 hours
•80 cubic foot scuba tank to 3000 psi or 200 bar = 24 hours
•Marauder air rifle 22 cal. 0-2800 psi = 18 minutes
•44 cubic foot SCBA tank from 3000-4500 psi = 3.5 hours

Note: I know enough about the person behind this product to know that he won't stamp his name on something that's junk or that won't live up to hype.
 
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The Theoben is AWESOME -- I knew you guys would find the ultimate repeater! Now to scrape up the $800... I guess I should have known that was coming. Maybe if I lived in the UK, but that kinda dough will get you into a really nice centerfire : )

I sent out some messages trying to score a Crosman 760 Limited edition, looks like they should be able to be had for around $100.
 
Does the Theoben have a floating compression chamber then? I'm having a hard time visualizing how the mag interacts with the compression chamber, plunger, etc. Does the compressed air run through the plunger? My only experience with an underlever is a B-3, so bear with me.

I have a NP gun, it always surprises me after shooting a couple mid-power springers how quiet and smooth the Nitro guns are.
 
I think a precharged pump is going to be your best bet. An inventor from the paintball world came up with something a while back you'll find interesting: it's a booster pump for a shop compressor that, in a few hours, can charge a 68 cubic inch or so 3000 or 4500 PSI air tank. It's relatively quiet, and costs $550. That could certainly solve your problem of relying on a SCUBA tank.
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I honestly think PCP are poor choices for beginning air gunners and are best left to people fairly dedicated to the sport. PCP guns tend to be expensive to begin with, if you add in the SCUBA tank and the pump system you suggested and you are talking well over $1000 before the first shot is fired.

For someone just getting into airgunning I really think a spring-piston, break barrel rifle is the best place to start. RWS/Diana for example has a couple nice models in the $200-300 range which are accurate, reliable and with a bit of care will last a lifetime. Beeman, Gamo, Air Arms, BSA, and other make some fine air rifles in the same price range.

Once a shooter becomes hooked on air rifles, there's plenty of time to get into nitrogen cylenders, PCP and high end CO2 guns. ;)
 
roadchoad said:
Does the Theoben have a floating compression chamber then? I'm having a hard time visualizing how the mag interacts with the compression chamber, plunger, etc. Does the compressed air run through the plunger? My only experience with an underlever is a B-3, so bear with me.

I have a NP gun, it always surprises me after shooting a couple mid-power springers how quiet and smooth the Nitro guns are.
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Not exactly - sorry I've never had it apart so I can't explain how the internals are activated or sealed. When you cock the rifle the push probe is retracted, the magazine can be inserted. When you close the cocking lever the push probe pushes the pellet forward thru the magazine and loads it into the barrel. When you fire the pulse of air passes through the hollow push probe to the pellet in the barrel.

The magazine is spring loaded - all of the pellets are trying to rotate around to the proper position to get loaded into the barrel. When the push probe pushes the pellet forward through the magazine, the push probe is now through the hole the pellet was in, still stopping the magazine from indexing forward. When you cock the rifle the push probe retracts from the magazine - there is nothing blocking the magazine from rotating to the next pellet now, so it clicks the next pellet into place. The magazine can be removed now or you can close the cocking lever pushing the probe back through the magazine, loading the next pellet into the barrel.

The push probe never floats - it is secure and mechanical, almost like the bolt on a bolt action rifle, except it is hollow and the air pulse to move the pellet comes through the push probe.

Sorry, I feel like I'm butchering this explanation - it's a very simple, very efficient, very clever system that works very well. My dad has had his rifle for about 10 years and has never had a problem with it.

HTH

David
 
Just wanted to thank you guys again - that Theo is some rifle! I am going to be on the lookout for a used one however unlikely that may be to find.
 
Although it doesn't fullfill all of the requirements that the original poster wanted, I was going to recommend a Benjamin Sheridan .177 pellet pump air rifle.
They've been around forever and are a good air rifle.
But he got me to thinking about using BB's in it, so I tried it and it works.
The only problem is keeping the BB in the chamber instead of rolling down the barrel and falling out.
Now in my some of my other BB guns they use a small magnet to hold the BB in place so I removed the bolt and magnetized it and now it holds the BB in the chamber. But it's still a single shot.
Had he not limited it to no CO2 airguns I would have recommend The Daisy model 008 dual ammo semi-auto air pistol. I have one and it's the best one I own.
I'm just not aware of any one air rifle that will fill all of his requirements but I would like one myself.
 
Flightsimmer, do you have a brass barrel? BBs are harder than the brass barrel that most Benjys have. The rifling will be gone quickly if you shoot BBs through it. Even steel barrels can't stand up to repeated BB use. I have a "ghost" rifled 760 barrel that shows that.
 
I am sorry, but multi-shot bb (steel) does not go with nicely built. However, I can get a quarter sized group at 40 yds with my Gamo pellet gun, I have hit squirrels at over 100 yds with it, and it is 1000 fps with one spring cock via break barrel. I have shot dozens of ground squirrels with it, it is not REALLY expensive, it has a lifetime warranty (at least mine did),and it is very will built. I have a Crosman multi-pump pneumatic air rifle, a 2100, the same one that is recommended on the second page, and it is a really nice bb gun, but the trajectory is absolutely horrible compared to the Gamo, as is the accuracy, and you can get shots off faster with the breakbarrel than you can with the pump up. When I got the Crosman, I thought of the same things that you did, with the bb magazine, and I thought that the possibility of having a shotgun effect might be useful. It isn't and I hardly use the Crosman at all anymore.

http://www.pyramydair.com/s/m/Gamo_Hornet_Air_Rifle_Combo/2559

or if you like Nitro springs:
http://www.pyramydair.com/s/m/Gamo_Big_Cat_1200_with_Nitro_Piston/1784

or if you want a PCP:

http://www.pyramydair.com/s/m/Gamo_DynaMax_3-9x50_RGB_Dot_Scope_Combo/2029

I would never get an air rifle that is not a Gamo anymore, I have experimented with other brands, and nothing even comes close to my Gamo. One other thing, Gamo's FPS claims are pretty close to exactly on the nose, but don't use their "Raptor" or "Platinum" or any other lightweight pellet. My best accuracy was with Crosman (yes I know I was kind of putting down their guns, but their pellets are among the best for my gun, and the best price) hollow point "Premier" pellets, 7.9 grains.
 
And people say BB's are inaccurate. Tell that to the bird I pegged in the head from probably 30 feet away with a Red Ryder...
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It's possible to get that kind of accuracy out to about that distance (10yds), but that's about the limit of steel BBs, even from a good quality smoothbore. I've done a lot of shooting with airguns using steel BBs from smooth & rifled bores, pellets from rifled bores and even some lead BBs from rifled bores. Steel BBs, in my experience, seem to be less accurate from rifled bores than from smoothbores, probably because they're significantly undersize for the rifled bores. Pellets from rifled bores are more accurate than steel BBs from any bore size. Lead BBs from a rifled bore can be very accurate, but they shouldn't be used in smoothbores as they will be oversize.

The comments about wearing out rifled bores with steel BBs are also correct in my experience. I shot out the steel barrel of my first pellet gun using steel BBs. It would have likely lasted literally forever had I used only lead pellets. I wouldn't consider using anything other than lead pellets or lead BBs in a rifled airgun barrel unless I considered the airgun (or at least the barrel) disposable.
 
If lead contamination is a concern, I would get a pellet trap. Many people make them with duct putty. I've made my own with rubber mulch. The putty is probably a nicer option but the rubber mulch can stop quite a bit. I've seen people fill a 5 gallon bucket with it and stop a .44 mag. That being said, it doesn't take but a few inches of the mulch to stop a ton of pellets. I've been using a 4" thick cardboard shipping box to shoot at targets of late. It's easy to move, easy to mount a target, and stops anything you can launch at it out of a standard pellet rifle.

If you are willing to use lead into a pellet trap, your options open greatly. I have an old FWB 601. It's an Olympic style air rifle. It is a single stroke pneumatic which gives you the benefit of a pneumatic rifle without the hassle of precharging. Now, you do have to put a little effort in to cock the rifle, but it isn't as much as a standard springer. It has the single best trigger I've ever felt, even better than the BR Anschutz triggers. Just amazing and certainly something that jades you when you go back to firearm shooting. It's not a common rifle, and it's a bit difficult to scope, but it's a lot of fun, amazingly accurate (one hole group the size of a single pellet at 10m) and an amazing trigger. I wish I could find one of the scope adapter kits for mine. It's the perfect backyard/winter training tool.
 
The only semi-auto BB repeaters available are Co2 powered. Most of them are crappy big-boy toys...

But there are a few worth mentioning, such as the IZH 'Drodz', which has somewhat respectable power, and the ability to fire in bursts, as well as the Walther / Umarex version of the same thing. Either of those will kill pests (rats, ground squirrels, pigeons, ect) at reasonable distances, and have a high hit probability when firing in burst modes.

If you want the capability take an animal of any size, then you NEED a magnum break barrel or PCP (scuba) gun. You can count the number of Co2 rifles on one hand which are powerful enough to take something the size of a raccoon, and still have fingers left over.

If you don't want to fool with scuba tanks then your only REAL option for taking pests at long range, or taking bigger critters at closer range, is to get a magnum break barrel. I would get something with a gas ram or 'Nitro Piston'. Benjamin, Gamo, and Walther all offer excellent options for high velocity .22 and .25 caliber guns with the Nitro Piston.
 
roadchoad said:
Flightsimmer, do you have a brass barrel? BBs are harder than the brass barrel that most Benjys have. The rifling will be gone quickly if you shoot BBs through it. Even steel barrels can't stand up to repeated BB use. I have a "ghost" rifled 760 barrel that shows that.
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Yes! Your right, it does have a brass barrel. So I guess steel BB's are out but I could try lead BB's although I don't see what the advantage would be in doing so.

There is one big disadvantage to the benjamin sheridan, there isn't a really good, sturdy scope mount for it.

10mm, when you care enough to send the very best.
 
I have a Crosman AIR 17 (AR15 clone from the mid 80s) that is a single pump. Fires either BB's from the hopper in the stock, or pellets from a 4 round clip. The sinlge pump is actually pretty good for target shooting, sights aren't bad, and a few pumps with a pellet is more than enough for small game.

A single pump with a .177 BB hit a stop sign across the road from the middle of the yard (50 yards, give or take a few)
 
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