Time to Bust Some Panic Myths
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Owen Sparks
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Sure guns will remain legal after the Obama administration. There will just be some reasonable restrictions. You will still be able to buy a 1911, just like you can still buy a Thompson gun. The legal hassel and prohibitive cost put them out of reach the vast majority.
I do believe that there will be a reintroduction and passing of an AWB.
The timing of such an event is what is in question in my mind. Will it be just before 2010 to boost election wins for the majority party? Will it be kept quiet until after 2010 to keep opposition from interfering with that election? Will it wait until the 2012 elections to help carry a second term win or will the ax fall after the second term is secured?
It is all about political capital and how to gain or spend it. Be certain that Heller only "prevents" outright bans and leaves the door open for "reasonable regulation" (unfortunately crafted by unreasonable politicians).
So, prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
The timing of such an event is what is in question in my mind. Will it be just before 2010 to boost election wins for the majority party? Will it be kept quiet until after 2010 to keep opposition from interfering with that election? Will it wait until the 2012 elections to help carry a second term win or will the ax fall after the second term is secured?
It is all about political capital and how to gain or spend it. Be certain that Heller only "prevents" outright bans and leaves the door open for "reasonable regulation" (unfortunately crafted by unreasonable politicians).
So, prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
What if every gun owner in America puts a sign in their yard that says "The Right To Bear Arms Shall Not Be Infringed"? i'm just trying to think of something that EVERY gun owner can do so that people will notice how many people feel this strongly about these issues
Owen Sparks
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Oughtright confiscation will not happen. They will chip away at the 2A with various small incursions designed to make firearm ownership prohibitivly expensive. Also a host of new regulations will make it too much trouble for most people. You can expect any major new technical innovations in firearms will be illegal for commonors to own.
Gun Slinger
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I agree with hso. Immediately after BHO was inagurated, www.whitehouse.gov was updated under the "Agenda" section, "Urban Policy" with the following:
Address Gun Violence in Cities: Obama and Biden would repeal the Tiahrt Amendment, which restricts the ability of local law enforcement to access important gun trace information, and give police officers across the nation the tools they need to solve gun crimes and fight the illegal arms trade. Obama and Biden also favor commonsense measures that respect the Second Amendment rights of gun owners, while keeping guns away from children and from criminals. They support closing the gun show loophole and making guns in this country childproof. They also support making the expired federal Assault Weapons Ban permanent.
That pretty much tells you what BHO has in mind. The only questions that remain are:
1. Timing (I think that it'll happen between the next 12 and 24 months)
2. Passage (Hopefully, the Dems haven't forgotten the losses that they suffered after the passage of the AWB #1)
I doubt that BHO will wait until hid second term only because that is not a guaranteed occurence.
If it comes to pass, we will look back at this time as the "good ole days".
Heaven help us.
Address Gun Violence in Cities: Obama and Biden would repeal the Tiahrt Amendment, which restricts the ability of local law enforcement to access important gun trace information, and give police officers across the nation the tools they need to solve gun crimes and fight the illegal arms trade. Obama and Biden also favor commonsense measures that respect the Second Amendment rights of gun owners, while keeping guns away from children and from criminals. They support closing the gun show loophole and making guns in this country childproof. They also support making the expired federal Assault Weapons Ban permanent.
That pretty much tells you what BHO has in mind. The only questions that remain are:
1. Timing (I think that it'll happen between the next 12 and 24 months)
2. Passage (Hopefully, the Dems haven't forgotten the losses that they suffered after the passage of the AWB #1)
I doubt that BHO will wait until hid second term only because that is not a guaranteed occurence.
If it comes to pass, we will look back at this time as the "good ole days".
Heaven help us.
ChromeLibrarian
Member
Until someone else makes it not permanent. Nothing is permanent when there exists a procedure for changing it. Even the constitution is not permanent when there exists a procedure for amending it.
Truthseeker
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Panic
ChromeLibrarian,
Absolutely spot on. The Democrats do not have a decree from Heaven. And what they DO install, enact, prohibit, etc., can also be undone. Ladies and gentlemen, believe this, they won't ignore us. They know we are here. This will be a fight, but it won't be a disaster. Stay in the game.
ChromeLibrarian,
Absolutely spot on. The Democrats do not have a decree from Heaven. And what they DO install, enact, prohibit, etc., can also be undone. Ladies and gentlemen, believe this, they won't ignore us. They know we are here. This will be a fight, but it won't be a disaster. Stay in the game.
withdrawn34
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Apathy is a dangerous game. You may not have to freak out, but to assure yourself with a false sense of security is no better than the mentality of the antis.
Your quotes are nice, but keep in mind that the second amendment clearly states "shall not be infringed," and yet look at where we are today.
And never lull yourself into some sense of "I'm safe" but saying "whatever can be done can be undone." Do you know how much harder it is to repeal laws that are already on the books? After a law has been around long enough, people forget why its even there and don't care to change it anymore.
Do not stop fighting simply because you ignore the battle and concentrate on the flowers because its nicer.
Your quotes are nice, but keep in mind that the second amendment clearly states "shall not be infringed," and yet look at where we are today.
And never lull yourself into some sense of "I'm safe" but saying "whatever can be done can be undone." Do you know how much harder it is to repeal laws that are already on the books? After a law has been around long enough, people forget why its even there and don't care to change it anymore.
Do not stop fighting simply because you ignore the battle and concentrate on the flowers because its nicer.
All we need is one irresponsible gun owner to do something bad enough and you'll wish it was just the old AWB again. We as responsible gun owners need to find ways to make guns look good and win the PR war to insure our right continues to stay that way.
eventer289
Member
Thanks for posting. I didn't realize those things. The question is, how it could/will could be spun to get around those rulings.
Judging by some of the posts in here, I can easily tell that a few of those who have written, voted for BO. Now they are trying to ease their worries with some belief that "Obama won't outlaw guns" or "The 2nd amendment makes it impossible to outlaw our guns" and other such drivel. Let's stop kidding ourselves about who BO is. He is anti-gun, period. The AWB is coming back, whether you believe it or not. The odds of BO not helping to reinstate the AWB are about as good as Ol' SLick Willy staying faithful to Hillary for longer than a week.
As far as I'm concerned, the notion that BO seeking to reinstate the AWB and further regulating munitions being a "myth" is either naive ubsurdity or plain old dishonest denial. Sorry guys, I'm not drinking the "BO is a friend to gun owners" koolaid. You guys who advocate this position had seriously better start looking at the myths you are currently believing.
As far as I'm concerned, the notion that BO seeking to reinstate the AWB and further regulating munitions being a "myth" is either naive ubsurdity or plain old dishonest denial. Sorry guys, I'm not drinking the "BO is a friend to gun owners" koolaid. You guys who advocate this position had seriously better start looking at the myths you are currently believing.
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Ah geez, not this again and again and again.
Folks, gun control is not a vote getter for pols. It is a vote loser. They can ask Tom Foley if they have doubts. No pol is going out for gun control on the national level. This was the deal the Dems made to get control and get winning candidates in the South. You won't see any action on abortion (at least legislatively) as well.
Really? Why don't you tell us which posters here voted for Obama?
ThrottleJockey
member
I agree, and make no mistake about it. BO IS ANTI GUN. Not only anti gun, but anti weapon period. Look at IL, not only are the gun laws horrendously unreasonable, but even a stungun, an electronic device, is classified as a "firearm" and requires a permit to posses.
moooose102
Member
heck, i dont trust our government. it is way to powerful, and no longer represents you and me. they are a group that basicly does what it wants, or is bribed into. not doing what is good for our country. if that is not true, how else can you explain "NAFTA". it singlehandedly, gave away our one real stronghold in our country. our manufacturing capability. do you have any idea what kind of shape we would be in if we went to war now. it would take us three years to be able to manufacture our own war supplies. until then, we would be dependant on foreign companies to manufacture our stuff. boy, that sounds like a way to end up loosing not only a war, but our entire way of life. i wonder how fast we as a nation could lear to speak chineese! i have said from the beginning, that the politicians that wrote, and passed this into law, should be tried for treason, and hung!
Sorry,
it didn't start off that way, but the nature of the OP was a political one. The gun buying frenzy is fueled in large part to BO. The OP wanted to dispel the "myth" that BO was going to help pass the AWB again. I guess the nature of any thread when it comes to politicians, will inevitably turn into a political thread as well. Nature of the beast I guess.
IBTL
it didn't start off that way, but the nature of the OP was a political one. The gun buying frenzy is fueled in large part to BO. The OP wanted to dispel the "myth" that BO was going to help pass the AWB again. I guess the nature of any thread when it comes to politicians, will inevitably turn into a political thread as well. Nature of the beast I guess.
IBTL
bikerdoc
Moderator In Memoriam
I am known to each of my senators and my rep in congress by my first name. They know because im old, and belong to a lot of organizations, and community groups, I can influence hundreds of votes (no bragging intended).
I challange each of you to achieve similar power.
No politician wants to be voted out, they might have to get a real job!
Write to them, meet them, be calm and reasonable, and let them know where you and your support groups stand.
They use the ratio 10 to one, i.e. for every letter or conversation, the figure 10 more people feel the same way. Act dont react.
I challange each of you to achieve similar power.
No politician wants to be voted out, they might have to get a real job!
Write to them, meet them, be calm and reasonable, and let them know where you and your support groups stand.
They use the ratio 10 to one, i.e. for every letter or conversation, the figure 10 more people feel the same way. Act dont react.
mgkdrgn
Member
Ummm, isn't there =already= a multitude of taxes on bullets/ammo? I don't recall there being a "right to bullets" anywhere in the constitution.
And just because "a state" can't do it, doesn't mean the federals can't.
winston smith
Member
Russ Feingold- of the infamous McCain-Feingold scam - wants a constitutional amendment to require all states to hold special elections for senatorial vacancies.
So how easy it would be to repeal the Second Amendment!
"The Right of the Democratic Party to an unlimited supply of
defenseless victims, being necessary for our egos,
there shall be no private ownership of Firearms,
or immigration restrictions."
So how easy it would be to repeal the Second Amendment!
"The Right of the Democratic Party to an unlimited supply of
defenseless victims, being necessary for our egos,
there shall be no private ownership of Firearms,
or immigration restrictions."
I smell thread lock all over this one......
************************RANT ON*******************
The reasons an AWB could be THEORETICALLY passed is obvious by reading the preceding threads.
There is mixed bag of rational, irrational and barking mad arguments roiling together.
If you disagree with about a third of the arguments on either side you are automatically labelled a "moonbat", "fellow traveler", "delusional", "paranoid freak" etc etc.
Hang together or hang individually it's that simple. Trouble is, the hanging together just ain't gonna happen there are too many fundamentalists out there who will never change their views.
************************RANT OFF*******************
To return to the actual topic of the OP......
Even assuming the current administration has the political will, desire and masochistic desire for public flaying to generate "Son of AWB" it still has to go through the whole process before it becomes law.
For those who have forgotten their basic civics 101, the link will take you through to a 5th graders guide on how a bill becomes law.
http://clerkkids.house.gov/laws/
At 9 places there can be a kill switch thrown and consign the bill to history....as happens at least once every year for this very type of bill.
This type of bill, since the sunset of AWB has happened at last once a year, almost always with the same characters and always with zero probability of success.
During this time, the political, legislative, state and constitutional landscape has changed dramatically and firmly away from enhanced gun control.
Hell, of the four main residual controllers states, NJ, NY, CA and IL the most "liberal", CA is quite likely to be driver to make 2A incorporated via the Nordyke case.
This is not the same place that AWB was.
People really have to read the dictionary and understand the difference between PROBABILITY and POSSIBILITY.
Yes, "Son of AWB" is POSSIBLE it has however little PROBABILITY of success.
Drop the Chicken Little/Don Quixote syndrome whenever you hear some piss ant, small time politician trolling for a sound bite and focus energies on real issues when they appear.
To end on a firearm related phrase
‘Put your trust in God; but mind to keep your powder dry’.”
************************RANT ON*******************
The reasons an AWB could be THEORETICALLY passed is obvious by reading the preceding threads.
There is mixed bag of rational, irrational and barking mad arguments roiling together.
If you disagree with about a third of the arguments on either side you are automatically labelled a "moonbat", "fellow traveler", "delusional", "paranoid freak" etc etc.
Hang together or hang individually it's that simple. Trouble is, the hanging together just ain't gonna happen there are too many fundamentalists out there who will never change their views.
************************RANT OFF*******************
To return to the actual topic of the OP......
Even assuming the current administration has the political will, desire and masochistic desire for public flaying to generate "Son of AWB" it still has to go through the whole process before it becomes law.
For those who have forgotten their basic civics 101, the link will take you through to a 5th graders guide on how a bill becomes law.
http://clerkkids.house.gov/laws/
At 9 places there can be a kill switch thrown and consign the bill to history....as happens at least once every year for this very type of bill.
This type of bill, since the sunset of AWB has happened at last once a year, almost always with the same characters and always with zero probability of success.
During this time, the political, legislative, state and constitutional landscape has changed dramatically and firmly away from enhanced gun control.
Hell, of the four main residual controllers states, NJ, NY, CA and IL the most "liberal", CA is quite likely to be driver to make 2A incorporated via the Nordyke case.
This is not the same place that AWB was.
People really have to read the dictionary and understand the difference between PROBABILITY and POSSIBILITY.
Yes, "Son of AWB" is POSSIBLE it has however little PROBABILITY of success.
Drop the Chicken Little/Don Quixote syndrome whenever you hear some piss ant, small time politician trolling for a sound bite and focus energies on real issues when they appear.
To end on a firearm related phrase
‘Put your trust in God; but mind to keep your powder dry’.”
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