Training Gun Disarms With a Loaded Handgun (Video)

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Bartholomew Roberts

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Finger on the trigger. Pointed at "instructor's" face. Just an imminent disaster waiting to happen. As well as a reminder to vet and check up on the people you train with.

https://www.facebook.com/IdanTKM/videos/772394149547389/?fref=nf

Instructor's response to critics:

"Now about intelligent training like you say
I am Israeli serve many years in one of the top commando unit and
Done many task with the Israeli SHABACK UNIT
complete my GR COURSE. And serve in many tasks with the Israeli
Top gov unit
Now I leave in South Africa
I do this from 1994 serve in Lebanon
And gaze please I know what is real
Don't tell me what is intelligent training
I put this risk on my self
I like to test my moves I like to see the work
In reality is will be
Life load gun !!!!
I also do this drill with load rifle
And when is come to cold weapon
I do it with real knife
I train for real
I don't play around I be a fighter in my army time command on menu solider under my wings please with all the respect to you
I know it's look very "danger"
But reality is much more brutal
GOD BLESS"
 
met plenty of people who claim their gun disarming techniques are 100% effective, never met one willing to test them against a loaded gun.
 
One just has to ask what the purpose or benefit he believes he gets from doing this?
Even blanks a contact distance would be fatal.
It would be interesting to see if he would do the same drill with a single action pistol given the topic of a few other threads recently.
 
I was in charge of training for my outfit, a 100 man department, for around three years. This was early nineties.... We were fortunate enough to have some really skilled young firearms trainers who were skilled at disarms - either in a holster or when the weapon was in hand - they could do this from every angle -even when in service types were expecting it.... No matter how experienced, bored, un-motivated an officer was he/she really paid attention after losing their weapon once or twice.... All of this was focused towards learning weapons retention on the street, where it counts....

Our usual routine was to have everyone un-load their weapons then before each exercise -both trainer and officer would double check to make sure the weapon was un-loaded... Disarms from holsters were done at speed in real time.... disarms from weapon in hand were only done in slo-mo since these kind of maneuvers are meant to break fingers or wrists if necessary for that split second once in a lifetime moment...

If anyone, trainer or trainee, had suggested that we do this sort of stuff with a loaded weapon I'd have laughed at them. If they insisted they'd have been signed up for a psych eval - mandatory...
 
lemaymiami said:
I was in charge of training for my outfit, a 100 man department, for around three years. This was early nineties.... We were fortunate enough to have some really skilled young firearms trainers who were skilled at disarms - either in a holster or when the weapon was in hand - they could do this from every angle -even when in service types were expecting it.... No matter how experienced, bored, un-motivated an officer was he/she really paid attention after losing their weapon once or twice.... All of this was focused towards learning weapons retention on the street, where it counts....

Our usual routine was to have everyone un-load their weapons then before each exercise -both trainer and officer would double check to make sure the weapon was un-loaded... Disarms from holsters were done at speed in real time.... disarms from weapon in hand were only done in slo-mo since these kind of maneuvers are meant to break fingers or wrists if necessary for that split second once in a lifetime moment...

If anyone, trainer or trainee, had suggested that we do this sort of stuff with a loaded weapon I'd have laughed at them. If they insisted they'd have been signed up for a psych eval - mandatory...
Click to expand...
did you ever try using an item that actually fired something, you could know if the disarm worked? it's all well and good to take the gun, but if they already pulled the trigger and shot you.... http://www.rap4.com/paintball/rap17.html
 
Firing anything near your head is potentially very dangerous. Perhaps a SIRT pistol with adequate laser protective eye wear.
 
Well, yup... that's the stupidest thing I've seen all day.
Click to expand...

That may take the idiot of the year award.
The only logical next step is to train for fighting AFTER being shot, hopefully the geniuses want think of that.



I don't do Facebook, so I won't view the link here. But, I wonder if the guns are loaded to "Israeli-method" standards..?
Click to expand...

I don't have FB either but it still let me watch the video.
 
The only logical next step is to train for fighting AFTER being shot, hopefully the geniuses want think of that.
Click to expand...

Well, I have taken injured shooter classes that simulate some disabling incident. But not having your brain blown out. :D
 
The complete stupidity of what the video shows aside....

How often does the bad guy with the gun touch the gun to the good guy's forehead? That's the way they do it in hollywood, but I doubt it would go down like that on the street. All these youtube disarming heroes all presuppose the same thing, that the bad guy will be close enough for you to reach. If they're not, I suppose you could shuffle in closer....
 
Posted by Mainsail:
How often does the bad guy with the gun touch the gun to the good guy's forehead? That's the way they do it in hollywood, but...
Click to expand...
Good point.

For the defender who hopes to survive, it is a good idea to try to stay to arms lengths from the other guy, and when that is not practical, to hold the gun in a retention positon.
 
I love the "Israeli" angle.

My more right of the aisle friends would slobber over this tactical commando training.

"Well, if the Israelis are doing it, it must be the best and preffered method!"
 
for Teapot.... this kind of training is best done with your own sidearm and remember in real life taking someone's weapon while its in their hand ready to fire is an absolutely last ditch proposition. Many times, if done properly in real life you're going to injure your opponent (it's part of the proposition....) and yes, many times the weapon will fire as the disarm is done. Part of the techniques we taught included a side step away from the muzzle as it is simultaneously deflected away from where it's being pointed. Can't go much farther on this since we're on an open forum. One or two of the techniques involve turning the weapon back on the shooter so if it fires the shooter is on the receiving end...

None of this is stuff that would ever be taught at any basic police academy - it's advanced stuff and needs to be practiced over and over. Most of our young trainers were also SRT team members so they lived tactics and training daily. Having your weapon snatched repeatedly from a supposedly safe, secure, holster that was touted as being designed for weapons retention is a real eye opener for anyone that carries daily. It made our classes very interesting and no one slept through the retention techniques that were taught after everyone had their weapon taken by one trainer or other.... Remember we taught weapon snatches from holsters and weapon retention techniques (how to hang onto your gun in a struggle or just a quick grab by your opponent) in real time and we always needed a few band-aids afterwards. Disarming at close range we always taught in slo motion since many of the techniques were designed from the start to injure your opponent in the process....

Since I haven't carried a sidearm in almost 20 years now (I haven't carried a firearm once since I retired out in Oct 1995... although I've always kept my permit current and valid) it's been a long time since I practiced any of this. Weapons retention is something everyone that carries a gun should learn and practice... It might be important someday.
 
Airsoft with eye protection is the best balance of realism/safety/cost IMHO.

In the early days of one of the H2H systems I train, they posted video of clearing the FoF against a live gun, more power to them, they also were involved in training NSW so I guess they felt that kind of "stones" were needed to show the concepts work. I don't care if someone else is willing to risk their life to prove a concept...means I don't have to!
 
That goes in the memory bank right next to the guy on you tube who is "instructing" how to safely draw and shoot his pistol.

Only problem is he shoots himself in the thigh! safety off, and booger picker on the bang switch!

Please

be safe
 
Sure, it is "unsafe", but in the life he appears to live, safe will get you dead; live ammo made his point. The "attacker" made several mistakes and in the cruel world those shots might have gone into his body. First, he got too close to his "victim", just so he could have fun terrorizing him.

Second, he hesitated. If you ever have to kill someone, do it, don't stand around discussing world peace or the state of the current Broadway season. That nonsense is for the movies.

Jim
 
Um, okay.
I'd prefer not to have a loaded gun aimed at me when doing ninjanazirambomossadbillybadass training.
Then again, I wear ATGATT* when I ride my motorcycle, too.

Being shot AT is bad enough. I don't want to experience high speed body piercing.

*All The Gear. All The Time.
 
Louis Awerbuck used to use cut up bits from plastic coat hangers. He said it helped reduce the number of broken fingers in the training. I doubt take aways are even 50% effective.
 
Jaymo said:
Um, okay.
I'd prefer not to have a loaded gun aimed at me when doing ninjanazirambomossadbillybadass training.
Then again, I wear ATGATT* when I ride my motorcycle, too.

Being shot AT is bad enough. I don't want to experience high speed body piercing.

*All The Gear. All The Time.
Click to expand...
I go one step further and don't ride one. Don't get me wrong, I would love to but I know I will get crippled or killed.
 
"Okay, Bill you gonna show me your disarm technique?"
"thats right, Fred, but first [pause for effect] I want you to load your pistol."
"uh, okay, but couldn't you get shot?"
"Ha! you silly monkey! my techniques are 100% effective"
[Bill's eyes narrow.
Game.
Set.
Match.]
 
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