UNIVERSAL difficult to meter?

[jski]

I’m having problems throwing consistent measures with Hodgdon’s Universal. I’m using the Redding powder measure.

When trying to consistently throw 6 grains of Universal, I get 5.8 gr, 5.9 gr , 6 gr, 6.1 gr, 6.2 gr randomly. This occurs without changing the setting on the meter. I’ve also noticed that I’m slicing thru Universal’s large flakes. I can feel the resistance when lowering the handle.

Am I alone with this problem?

 

[Docendo Discimus]

I’m having problems throwing consistent measures with Hodgdon’s Universal. I’m using the Redding powder measure.

When trying to consistently throw 6 grains of Universal, I get 5.8 gr, 5.9 gr , 6 gr, 6.1 gr, 6.2 gr randomly. This occurs without changing the setting on the meter. I’ve also noticed that I’m slicing thru the Universal’s large flakes. I can feel the resistance when lowering the handle.

Am I alone with this problem?

Is this a brand new powder measure?

 

[jski]

Is this a brand new powder measure?

Absolutely.

 

[Y-T71]

Ive only used Universal in some .40 S&W loads and I haven't had a .40 cal pistol in 10 years so my memory might be a little fuzzy but , I don't remember having any trouble in my Dillon PM.

I also don't remember Universal doing anything that my usual use of Unique wasn't doing already (and I have an 8lb keg of Unique) and, even with it's bigger flakes, I have never had a metering problem with it either so I just stayed with Unique.

ẞo you have trouble with any other propellants?

Universal, while not a itsy-bitsy ball powder, certainly isn't as large as some others.

 

[Docendo Discimus]

When I run into this I open up the measure amount as much as I can and run a whole pound of powder through it without measuring the charges. This puts a nice film on all the internal parts. When you reset the measure after this the charges will be very consistent.

 

[Y-T71]

When I run into this I open up the measure amount as much as I can and run a whole pound of powder through it without measuring the charges. This puts a nice film on all the internal parts. When you reset the measure after this the charges will be very consistent.

Not a bad idea.

Can't hurt

 

[Cheesemaker]

Which Redding powder measure are you using? My Redding measure cuts on the up stroke.

 

[BBarn]

My experience matches the OP'S, except I was using an older RCBS drum measure that throws many powders very well. So I don't bother with powders like Universal that don't throw well in my measure.

BTW, many powder measures can throw on the down stroke or the up stroke depending on how they are assembled..

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

Absolutely.

Did you thoroughly degrease it inside and out, completely disassembled to remove the packaging lube, before adding the first kernel of powder?

 

[Skgreen]

Neither my Hornady LNL or RCBS Uniflow are particularly fond of Universal.

Been tinkering with my Lee Perfect Powder measure. Added a little blue loc-tite to the threads of the 'handle retainer(?)" and carefully dialed in the tension* between the drum and body. Took quite a bit of fine-tuning, but it's my 'go-to' for Universal now.

* 'Lightly touching' seems to be the sweet-spot.

 

[higgite]

I had the same problem as OP with Universal in my RCBS Uniflow. No problems with 4.2-6.2 grains of W231, HP-39 or Ramshot Zip. All except Universal dropped charges within +/- 0.1gr of target amount. I hand measured the Universal until I used up the pound that I bought to try it out.

 

[Skgreen]

,,,,until I used up the pound that I bought to try it out.

Stumbled upon some 8lb'ers for $80.00 each a few years ago. It takes quite a while to burn through 32 lbs,,,

 

[jski]

Which Redding powder measure are you using? My Redding measure cuts on the up stroke.

Match Grade #3-BR

 

[Cheesemaker]

View attachment 1103037
Match Grade #3-BR

Which metering chamber do you have? there are 3 available for the 3BR measure. I believe the "default"/standard one is the "universal" metering chamber (name is of no bearing to the powder you are throwing) which has a range of 5 to 100 grains. You are very close to the low end of the scale if that is what you have.

Add: 03331 would be ideal for throwing 5 grains - or close to it

 

[jski]

Which metering chamber do you have? there are 3 available for the 3BR measure. I believe the "default"/standard one is the "universal" metering chamber (name is of no bearing to the powder you are throwing) which has a range of 5 to 100 grains. You are very close to the low end of the scale if that is what you have.

Add: 03331 would be ideal for throwing 5 grains - or close to it

The smaller meter. It came with 2 meters.

 

[Walkalong]

Meters ok, not great, not terrible.

 

[jski]

Meters ok, not great, not terrible.

Have you experienced the problem I mentioned above where I was throwing 6.0 ± 0.3 gr charges randomly?

 

[Walkalong]

It does +/- .2 fo me, with most being +/- .1

This is from a Redding 10X measure.

If you're not on the ragged edge of max you'll be ok, just factor in the max you know it will throw at a setting.

Your measure throws +/- .3?

Max is 7.2?

Set the measure to throw 6.9, knowing some will be 7.2.

That is of course if you didn't find a sweet spot lower than that while working up.

 

[jski]

It does +/- .2 fo me, with most being +/- .1

This is from a Redding 10X measure.

If you're not on the ragged edge of max you'll be ok, just factor in the max you know it will throw at a setting.

Your measure throws +/- .3?

Max is 7.2?

Set the measure to throw 6.9, knowing some will be 7.2.

That is of course if you didn't find a sweet spot lower than that while working up.

The problem is that small amounts of Universal can make a big difference.

 

[Bfh_auto]

Did you thoroughly degrease it inside and out, completely disassembled to remove the packaging lube, before adding the first kernel of powder?

Plus one on this. My Hornady was the same way till I followed the instructions.
It's been a while since I loaded universal though. I'm trying to burn up powder from cardboard cans right now.

 

[Walkalong]

The problem is that small amounts of Universal can make a big difference.

Then quit using it and find something else if you can't live with how it meters for you.

 

[wcwhitey]

The problem is that small amounts of Universal can make a big difference.

Proper neck tension, trim length resulting in consistent crimp, primer uniformity will all be bigger factors in a rounds accuracy than a few tenths here and there. This is as @Walkalong stated you are not at max already. Most loaders who use Unique have had the exact same experience. What I have done if it is a problem is throw low and trickle up (you do have a trickler don’t you?). Point is don’t panic pick a load in the midrange of load data and shoot away. Maybe by the end of the big jug you will be able to shoot well enough to notice a .2 grain difference, I have yet to be able to. Have fun!

Also as @GeoDudeFlorida mentioned make sure the inside is clean and free of any grease, oil or solvent. Any clumps will cause havoc. Wipe it with a dry cloth.

 

[Thomasss]

I'm not surprised. Alliant told me back in 2016 they removed Red Dot from their hand gun loads list because many powder dispensers just don't meter it very accurately. I suspect Universal is similar in that respect.

 

[mdi]

The most often used powder in my shop is Universal. I have a Lee PPM and a C-H 502. Both drop charges of less than .2 grain variations of Universal and often less than 1 gr. (I weigh a lot of my powder charges and all powder charges when working up a load.). When someone has difficulty metering Universal I would question their methods and equipment...

 

[Bill M.]

Slow afternoon for me today. And I have a new powder measure to play with. So I poured my new Redding pistol measure half full of Universal and dropped some charges. Set on 6 grains (5 drops total 29.9 grains) I got variation of 5.8 to 6.1 and most of them were 6. The measure seems to cut this powder going both ways. More times on the up but certainly on the down too. I thought I got better drops treating it sorta rough than being real gentle. Did not write it down and analyze it.
My calculations show that in my .357 Universal should produce a velocity change of 16 fps per 0.10 grain. I guess you have to decide if you can live with the range you are getting. I know I can. I do not chrono or do SD. I do not shoot with a scope at 25 yards.

Right now I am loading HP 38 because I could get some. The drops seem a little better than with the Universal but are not perfect. I get sometimes get 3" groups at 25 yds with my RD sight and propping my wrists. I expect the ammo shoots better than that