WARNING- Para-Ordnance Weapons Are Garbage! Do Not Buy Para-Ordnance

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EOTechRulesAll

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I just returned from the range with my Para-Ordnance Carry 12 .45 ACP pistol (stainless steel, night sights, etc), I purchased it a few months ago… It did not work new out of the box, to the point where it required the replacement of many internal parts and the tweaking of a number of other parts (it would jam, misfeed, fail to feed, fail to eject, etc) and I had no choice but to send it back to the manufacturer within the first week of my having bought the thing. To their credit the manufacturer did refund the SIXTY FIVE dollar shipping fee that it cost for me to ship the weapon back to them UPS Next Day Air.



I had fired about 200 rounds through it and they told me I would need to fire at least 200-300 more through it to get it “broken in” and working properly… I tried twice more to fire rounds through it and after the first time (I tried about 50 rounds this time) where it jammed every third or fourth round, I gave up…



Today I tried again… I fired about 150 rounds with mixed success and then began my last batch of 50 rounds (by the way, I am using Winchester new production .45 ACP FMJ and I have used Remington UMC, and Federal JHP rounds, none of them work, by the way) and this is hat happened…



The weapon jammed FIFTY times in a row (I counted out the rounds). Regardless of which factory provided magazine I used, it failed to eject, the slide caught back about half-way, and a new round was shoved forward… I would drop the magazine and at this time a live round also fell out, and then when I fully worked the slide (manually) a spent casing would eject. It did this FIFTY times in a row.





If Para-Ordnance does not give me a full refund of my purchase price or a new gun (that had better work flawlessly out of the box) I will be going back to the range and getting a video of how well their product works, at which time I will post the footage on youtube. I also plan to tell the merchant that due to the discovery of a defect in the product that was unable to be determined through typical inspection, I revoke my acceptance and am requesting a return of my money due to the non-conformity of the gun.





This is what I get for buying a Canadian pistol... Never buy a weapon from a nation that has never won a war, let alone fought one on their own...



I am going to stick to Eastern European firearms, such as the time-tested and true AK-47s from Bulgaria, Russia, Poland, and the former Yugoslavia.
 
You got 1 bad gun out of the how many hundreds of thousands PA has made.

Thats hardly enough data to call them all garbage.

Yours maybe.

or you have bad mags.

Or bad ammo.

Calm down a bit, eh?

Para will fix it and send it back good as new.
 
Mine has been nothing but money. It did take a few hundred rounds to get it working flawlessly, but now that it is......like butter baby.

100_2270.gif

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I am using new Para-Ordnance magazines and new Winchester ammo, FMJ...

I plan to go back to the range and video tape it... But I am telling you, it was FIFTY rounds, at least... I went through no less than four full magazines. The range operator even said he was watching me and he was SHOCKED since he had never seen such a high-style pistol do such a thing. Although he did say he has heard that Para-Ordnances have often tended to be picky in when they work and when they do not work.



I already sent it back to them once, new out of the box the first time out, it did not work... They replaced about one-third of all internal parts and did some tweaking to various other things...


Imagine you buy a car and two weeks after you buy it, the transmission and engine die, you send it back, and they replace them... Does this bode well for the future performance of the vehicle or would you want a new car?

I am not going to spend another $65 dollars to ship it back to them (I had to submit a request to their corporate office for them to reimburse my shipping, which to their credit they did do), and chance that they might not reimburse my shipping...

It did not work new out of the box and it does not work after being sent back in once... They owe me a new gun or my money...
 
I had a 14.45 that had the same exact issues. I sent it back to the factory 3 times. They never did get it corrected. I wound up getting rid of that thing as fast as I could. It didn't matter what I did, it wouldn't feed correctly. They tried to tell me it was the ammo I was using, but I tried UMC and Winchester, and neither worked. I told them, for the money I spent on their supposedly high quality .45, it should fire any ammo I used.
 
I have approximately three dozen firearms. I have been shooting since I was eleven years old... I know guns, I like guns, and I know what I like about guns and what I do not like... A $900 dollar gun that does not work New Out of the Box, and still does not work after being sent back once to the factory, is not a gun I like. I would not count my life on it, ever...

My M9 Beretta has NEVER failed to fire, NEVER jammed, NEVER misfeed, and I have even used Asian magazines in it, and it WORKS EVERY TIME. I would trust my life to my M9 Beretta, I wouldn't throw a Para-Ordnance Carry 12 at a broke-back horse.
 
The Para-Ord hi-caps are kinda hit & miss. Kinda has to do with the reliablity of the hi-cap magazines.
FBI HRT went with the Les Baer/Para-Ordnance P-13.45 SRP to replace their Browning High Powers. But, due to reliability issues involving the magazines, they switched back to the BHP, which they replaced with the Springfield Armory Bureau Model.

From personal experience, the Para-Ord single stack 1911s are excellent.
In fact, Long Beach PD issues the Para-Ordnance P-7.45 LDA to their academy recruits.


This is what I get for buying a Canadian pistol... Never buy a weapon from a nation that has never won a war, let alone fought one on their own...
Click to expand...
Anyone remember the War of 1812?
Brits/Canadians kicked the crap out of the Americans when the Americans pushed north into Canada.
Anyone remeber World War 1 and 2?
Canada fought with the Allies in both world wars. Allies won, so Canadians won as well.
:neener:
 
No doubt.. but..

...

Did you disassemble the gun, inspect it, clean it (of factory shipping goo) to protect the gun during shipping, and laying around till bought "from rust"..

This stuff is thick, and is NOT a lubricant for the gun to work properly, and this includes the interior walls and springs of your magazines..

1911's, especially the smaller 3" ones are far less forgiving of being dirty, powder residue buildups, dirty magazines, and most important, rails and guides that are not good and WET (a lot) with fresh, gun oil, for them to work and run properly by means of "timing".. as something is throwing the timing off, out, with the entire gun, for it to work right.

Be it a hot gun (which happens quick) and what little lubrication is on the rails and guides evaporates, or the mags are dirty, YOU're gonna get feed jams all day long, and with any dirty magazine as well..

It's all about inspection, cleaning, proper, and good WET lubrication for the gun, and clean, dry-walls, smooth follower, and springs of magazines, be them factory, or after market, which some think are better mags, Wilson Combat mags, for one..

Using new, good ammo, was right, and is right..

Not saying you did, but again, the 3" 45's are very unforgiving when it comes to an improper 2 hand grip, as in limp wristing, and will talk to you with jams, because of an improper grip..

Grip, proper timing of both mags and guns rails and guides by means of all that I have said above, fixes 90% of 3" NIB 1911 gun wows..


Have you let a RO, anyone that knows and shoots 1911's try your gun? But again, before the real test can begin, she's got to be clean, lubed right, including clean, dry-mags

*EEZOX, a drying synthetic metal to metal lubricant works great at both light cleaning of one's gun, one's mags, springs, and works wonders for the proper operation of magazines.

*And is excellent for ones metal feed ramp, making it more slippery and smooth..

Ya might want to give your gun another try after ya properly inspect, and service, your new gun (only you know the truth here) and her magazines, and let someone fire her with 1911 time to nail down this problem one way or another..

Learn or Burn,


Ls
 
Sorry to hear you had such a bad experience. They arent bad guns though, I know alot of people who own them and they work great and very accurate for little suckers. You might want to give it a go for another new one because I think you caught yourself a bad one. I was going to say maybe it was your first time shooting a .45 and ya hands are still weak which could cause it, but you been shooting since 11 so thats definitely not it.
 
I cleaned it once I got it from the store, I cleaned it after the first firing, I cleaned it after the second firing, and I am about to clean it again after this recent firing...

I have cleaned the weapon after each firing and after I got it.

I have a 1911A1 Springfield Mil-Spec .45 and it works wonderfully, it is a wonderful piece of steel that never fails me.

I think thus far, the best overall gun I have ever owned, in regards to a pistol, would be my M9 Beretta, with my HK P7/PSP being a close second, although I do not like the bottom mag release and the low capacity, but it is VERY reliable and VERY accurate.


I had an Intratec AB10 9mm and it was more reliable than my Para-Ordnance Carry 12.
 
OMG! para ordnance sucks!?

to think iv been fooled for over 800 rounds!

thats it i must send this POS back!

This is what I get for buying a Canadian pistol... Never buy a weapon from a nation that has never won a war, let alone fought one on their own...
Click to expand...

haha ya, that whole war of 1812... NEVER happened. all lies pressed on us by the historian conspiracy cartels.


im sorry. but i cant take a damn thing you say seriously. your first post is utter garbage. worse than even my rants.

you go ahead and piss yourself. post up a video of youre supposed jamming problem. and il post up a video of my para going for as long as my wallet holds out.

It did not work new out of the box and it does not work after being sent back in once... They owe me a new gun or my money...
Click to expand...

you can make up your own policy's as you see fit. but i assure you the attitude you've displayed thus far WILL NOT get you a new gun. and if it does, its only a accreditation to Para's apearant saintly patience

I wouldn't throw a Para-Ordnance Carry 12 at a broke-back horse.
Click to expand...

if its SUCH a POS. get your money back if you can, or sell it, don't get another one.
 
OK, but..

Quote: I cleaned it once I got it from the store, I cleaned it after the first firing, I cleaned it after the second firing, and I am about to clean it again after this recent firing...

I have cleaned the weapon after each firing and after I got it.
------------
...

Ok, that takes care of the gun, but does it take care of the magazines?

And, invest in 2 Wilson Combat magazines, to compare your factory ones and proven, out of the box, *Wilson Combat mags..

*Just so ya know, when I got my Colt Defender 3".. after just 100 rounds, and thru the next 100 rounds, I'd get one, two, feed jams per factory mag UNTIL, I bought, as told to do, 2 Wilson Combat mags, and no more jams UNTIL around 400rounds. *That is when I was told, my "less is more" when it comes to oiling gun rails (was wrong) especially 1911's and the entire "timing issue" with the least forgiving of any 1911's, 3" ones. I was told (by my RO buddy) to clean the factory mags, gun, and then make the rails and guides good and WET with oil, to which, that gun, with both cleaned factory mags, and Wilson mags, has gone-on to shoot flawlessly, 900 more rounds, including around 100rounds of JHP's, and with only adding oil, the vertical method, just before heading out to the range, and she is now rdy for a major disassembly, cleaning, but I'm very confident she could go another 400 rounds without one, by just doing light cleaning with EEZOX and re-oiling of the rails, along with easy, light cleaning of the mags..

*my light oiling basically had evaporated, enough, with the rapid Heat the gun puts out quick at that 400 round count and jams starting again.. Again, just a "timing issue" with the slide not flowing back freely, all the way.


And, have you, will you, let someone that is very familiar with 1911's, fire your gun at the range, to compare results?


Ls
 
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Brits/Canadians kicked the crap out of the Americans when the Americans pushed north into Canada.
Click to expand...
...and Americans returned the favor on the Great Lakes; after which the war was pretty much a draw. British North America rejoiced in defending it's border and remained loyal subjects of the British empire. Americans rejoiced in the outcome of their "second war of independence."

Hopefully, the OP can get his Para up and running. The ones I have handled were very nice pistols.
 
Hoppy,

Thank you for saying that. As a newbie here, I didn't want to piss in the sandbox just yet, but that first post is insane. My para has been terrific, after I got it broken in.
 
I love mine C7 . 45 LDA 45

bad mags is my guess. I use Wilsons. Never have had a jam. about 2,000 rounds and still going.
 
for all those suggesting new mags...why should he??? i think his gun should work with the factory mags...

he paid a lot for his gun, and i don't think it's too much to ask for his gun to function properly with factory mags...
 
I would NEVER sell this weapon to anybody and doom them to have the same sort of problems I have... To do so would negate the chance of their returning it to the retailer (who has no contract with them) and it might even get them screwed since the manufacturer might try to claim the warranties only extend to the first purchaser...

I can revoke my acceptance and request a full refund with the retailer... This is all covered under the uniform commercial code...

UCC 2-608(2)
 
Factory magazines cost $50 dollars each... Why should I have to buy extra magazines for a gun that I paid $900 dollars for? If you buy a car and they say "oh well the car is great, just buy new tires" or "just put a different engine in it" would you accept that as valid?

If Para-Ordnance cannot make a pistol that works with the magazines they make and market, they should not be in business, or at least they should not be in the business of making and selling firearms and magazines.

I would be ASHAMED to have my name on something where about 25% of them fail and fail miserably... I have been poking around online and have read that my problems are fairly common with para-ordnance weapons... To the point where it seems one out of four or at least one out of five para-ordnance owners have such issues...

I would be UTTERLY ASHAMED...
 
WOW

:what: I just now saw (clearly) that the gun has no extended beaver tail..

That puts her in a less forgiving class/zone than my Colt Defender.. IMHGO

~ HANG on good ~

The rest of you that have the same, how do they handle for ya? very curious.

Especially curious about one-hand and weak-hand shots.. :what:


Ls
 
I've already spent about 200 dollars in ammo and the weapon continues to show just how worthless it is... I am not going to waste another round of ammunition in such a worthless pistol... Not to mention that it would take about two hours to put 200-300 more rounds through it, since it mostly jams EVERY SINGLE round...

The most I managed today was two magazines where it did not jam at all, and then after I reloaded them again it was hit and miss, and then with my last batch of 50 rounds it jammed EVERY SINGLE TIME.

Out of 400 rounds, being able to say "I fired two magazines with no problems" is pathetic... This is a $900 dollar Para-Ordnance pistol, not an $80 dollar zip gun...
 
In a few months I may very well be entering into a program to train to become an auxiliary police officer, or I may go OCS and enter into the marines, or I may be in a business which will entail late hours and lots of travel time... I want to know I have firearms that I can depend on with my life... My HK P7/PSP has NEVER let me down, nor has my M9 Beretta... I wanted to get a high-capacity, concealable, .45 ACP pistol, and I thought the Para-Ordnance Carry 12 would do well for me, but it has not...

It frequently does not even chamber the first round (and no I am not riding the slide forward, I let it go and sail forward on its own, and it just jams), it also jams when I use the slide release to try to chamber a round (regardless of the angle I hold the weapon at). I want a firearm that works FLAWLESSLY because I am not looking for a gun that looks nice in a display case, I am looking for guns that I can count on with my life and that I can have relatives/family members/etc, and friends, use and count their lives on...

When it is a matter of life and death, one jam is one jam too many... Fifty in a row is an atrocity.
 
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