What else can we do?

[bullzeye8]

As gun owners while it seems like it might be getting a little better for gun rights at the same time I am not sure if it will get much better right now. We have the supreme court going against the constitution saying Obama care is fine, now deciding gay marriage is allowed in all 50 states even though it isn't stated in the constitution, and they denied to hear the Jackson 2nd amendment case even though it is about a right that is clearly given in the constitution. Other lower courts are ignoring what the constitution says about the 2nd amendment. So the only other option is to get legislation passed federally so all states have to grant rights. This will be very very difficult and currently almost impossible because getting the 2/3 majority to overcome Obama's veto is doubtful.

So is there anything else we can do to bring back our gun rights in all 50 states besides just continued education and getting pro-gun people elected which could be a very long process?

 

[hso]

It is important for us to understand the basis of SCOTUS rulings instead of parroting what we hear on popular media.

Yesterday's marriage decision is based on the same Constitutional amendment (the 14th) that provides the argument that driver's licenses and from one state are recognized and accepted in all states and not on what the headlines tout. Simply put freedoms in one state must be recognized in all states. We've tried to make this point with carry permits in the past, but we couldn't get a hearing. NOW we have a HUGE opportunity for us since with this SCOTUS ruling the same point for carry permits and for possession of firearms under the 2A and 14A can be made that legal possession in one state must be the same across all the states. A permit in one must be recognized in any. We can use this SCOTUS decision to file lawsuits forcing the recognition of our enumerated right across state boundaries.

Here's the email on it from CCRKBA

Following today’s ruling by the U.S. Supreme Court that requires all states to recognize same-sex marriages, the Citizens Committee for the Right to Keep and Bear Arms said that the same principle should apply to nationwide state recognition of concealed carry licenses and permits from all other states.

“To paraphrase what Associate Justice Anthony Kennedy said about same-sex marriage,” noted CCRKBA Chairman Alan Gottlieb, “no right is more profound than the right of self-preservation, and under the Constitution, all citizens should be able to exercise the right of self-defense anywhere in the country. It disparages their ability to do so, and diminishes their personhood to deny the right to bear arms they have in their home states when they are visiting other states.”

While many states recognize the concealed carry permits or licenses from other states, this is not universal. In some states, law-abiding citizens have been egregiously prosecuted for conduct that is perfectly legal in their home state. For example, New Jersey has become notorious in recent years for prosecuting honest citizens, the most recent being the unjust treatment of Shaneen Allen, the Pennsylvania single mom who had to be pardoned by Gov. Chris Christie because she crossed a bridge from one state to the other, and was honest about having a firearm when quizzed by a police officer during a traffic stop.

“State drivers’ licenses are universally recognized,” Gottlieb observed, “and with today’s high court ruling, same-sex marriage must now be recognized in all 50 states as well. It not only stands to reason, but common sense demands that the concealed carry licenses held by more than 11 million citizens across the country should now be valid in every state without question.

“We’re talking about law-abiding citizens who have gone through background checks, and in many cases, state-mandated training programs,” he added. “To continue treating their Second Amendment rights as second-class privileges seems unconscionable after today’s ruling.”

 

[Spats McGee]

Caveat: I haven't read the marriage decision yet.

. . . .Yesterday's marriage decision is based on the same Constitutional amendment (the 14th) that provides the argument that driver's licenses and from one state are recognized and accepted in all states and not on what the headlines tout.

While I don't want to derail this thread, I feel the need to point out one important distinction. Drivers' licenses are recognized as between states due to the adoption of a set of model laws called the Driver License Compact. Here's the relevant part of the Arkansas statute:

DRIVER LICENSE COMPACT
ARTICLE I
Findings and Declaration of Policy
(a) The party states find that:
(1) The safety of their streets and highways is materially affected by the degree of compliance with the state and local ordinances relating to the operation of motor vehicles.
(2) Violation of such a law or ordinance is evidence that the violator engages in conduct which is likely to endanger the safety of persons and property.
(3) The continuance in force of a license to drive is predicated upon compliance with laws and ordinances relating to the operation of motor vehicles, in whichever jurisdiction the vehicle is operated.

(b) It is the policy of each of the party states to:
(1) Promote compliance with the laws, ordinances, and administrative rules and regulations relating to the operation of motor vehicles by their operators in each of the jurisdictions where such operators drive motor vehicles.
(2) Make the reciprocal recognition of licenses to drive and eligibility therefor more just and equitable by considering the overall compliance with motor vehicle laws, ordinances, and administrative rules and regulations as a condition precedent to the continuance or issuance of any license by reason of which the licensee is authorized or permitted to operate a motor vehicle in any of the party states.

Ark. Code Ann. § 27-17-101 (West)

I've seen lots on the internet about how the marriage ruling should make CC legal in all states, but I'm reserving my opinion on that at least until I've read the marriage decision. With that said, reciprocity for DLs has been accomplished through mutual statutory recognition, not through constitutional litigation, AFAIK. It might become a constitutional question when one state begins failing to recognize some other state's DL, but I haven't heard of that happening yet.

So is there anything else we can do to bring back our gun rights in all 50 states besides just continued education and getting pro-gun people elected which could be a very long process?

Personally, I think that we should start pushing for the American Bar Association to publish a Concealed Carry Compact, and then push our state legislators to adopt same. Yes, I'm aware of the ABA's position on gun control, but they're the folks that put the various model codes together.

 

[hso]

Good point, but there's a bit of "how" vs. "what" difference here. The numerous interstate agreements like driver's licenses didn't need to go though constitutional litigation because they weren't opposed on a fundamental level. They weren't opposed because they were seen as of benefit across the states to agree. The basis, though for that agreement wasn't simply that it was overall beneficial, but a constitutional basis also existed providing a "stick" as it were to go with the carrot. The agreements are the "how" as opposed to the "what" itself. Some states disagree that the right to carry is of benefit while others don't agree on how they should accept carry issued by other states, yet some like mine address that by simply recognizing any citizen's carry "license" without regard to how it was granted.

 

[old lady new shooter]

As gun owners while it seems like it might be getting a little better for gun rights at the same time I am not sure if it will get much better right now. We have the supreme court going against the constitution saying Obama care is fine, now deciding gay marriage is allowed in all 50 states even though it isn't stated in the constitution, and they denied to hear the Jackson 2nd amendment case even though it is about a right that is clearly given in the constitution. Other lower courts are ignoring what the constitution says about the 2nd amendment. So the only other option is to get legislation passed federally so all states have to grant rights. This will be very very difficult and currently almost impossible because getting the 2/3 majority to overcome Obama's veto is doubtful.

So is there anything else we can do to bring back our gun rights in all 50 states besides just continued education and getting pro-gun people elected which could be a very long process?

A problem I see is that some states (like California, so this is near and dear to my heart) technically allow concealed carry but in some or all of their localities the right is severely restricted based on the discretion of the local issuing agency to decide who should be licensed. How does this situation interact with the idea of states' recognizing each others' permits?