What is the difference: Federal and ∙Federal∙

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merlynski

merlynski

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I have been sorting 45ACP and 40S&W brass by head stamp and have come across 2 different Federal head stamps. One just has the word Federal the other has a dot before and after the word: ∙Federal∙
Any difference to be noted for reloading purposes?
Obviously Federal thinks they needed to differentiate between them, anybody know why?

Thanks for your replies!
merlyn
 
BrotherMaynard said:
I bought a bunch of once-fired 45 ACP brass late last year and recall that the ones marked "∙Federal∙" were all small primer. I could not discern any other difference but admittedly did not examine them closely other than to sort by primer size.
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I have many small primer cases with both type markings and many large primer cases but NONE with the dots either side of the name. What’s it all mean? Who knows. I treat them all the same.
 
I believe the dots are present on cases made by/on CCI/Speer equipment after Federal purchased them.

I'll look for a reference.

Edit: I wasn't able to find a definitive reference. There were several forum posts similar to this one stating that the dots did represent different tooling or manufacturing locations.
 
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This lot of 45ACP brass was acquired because it is all uses small primers, of which I have plenty.
My son bought a Kimber 45ACP recently but could not find any ammunition. All the cases I had were new large primer, and I have a low quantity of those primers. I gave him one box of factory from my stash, and loaded up 100 more for him. He shot up the first box of 50. I should have some PC cast 230 TC arriving soon, so I will be ready to fix him up.
 
Awhile back I asked Federal customer service about 9mm FC headstamps having dots and no dots, etc., and was told the different patterns identify different locations and machines that the cases were manufactured on.
 
higgite said:
Awhile back I asked Federal customer service about 9mm FC headstamps having dots and no dots, etc., and was told the different patterns identify different locations and machines that the cases were manufactured on.
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That makes perfect sense to me.
 
SCAMP marks are standard for mil spec ammunition to identify the station a particular round was made on. Since the location of the 'dots' begin with the NATO symbol, which FEDERAL does not have, it's highly unlikely the marks the OP asked about are SCAMP marks.
Ammunition manufactured for the military by Federal carries the FC or FCC headstamp (MIL-STD-1461), 'FEDERAL' is commercial.
 
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FWIW, I’ve shot a bit of Federal Premium commercial ammo and a lot of Federal American Eagle commercial ammo, 9mm and 45 Auto. All of the 9mm brass has been headstamped FC, some with dots, some without. All of the 45 Auto brass has been headstamped Federal. I don’t recall having seen any with dots, but I don’t see why they would not use the same dot patterns on commercial 45 brass that they use on commercial 9mm brass.
 
twarr1 said:
SCAMP marks are standard for mil spec ammunition to identify the station a particular round was made on. Since the location of the 'dots' begin with the NATO symbol, which FEDERAL does not have, it's highly unlikely the marks the OP asked about are SCAMP marks.
Ammunition manufactured for the military by Federal carries the FC or FCC headstamp (MIL-STD-1461), 'FEDERAL' is commercial.
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And F.C. — with periods (dots) if those are not the dots you’re referring to.
 
higgite said:
FWIW, I’ve shot a bit of Federal Premium commercial ammo and a lot of Federal American Eagle commercial ammo, 9mm and 45 Auto. All of the 9mm brass has been headstamped FC, some with dots, some without. All of the 45 Auto brass has been headstamped Federal. I don’t recall having seen any with dots, but I don’t see why they would not use the same dot patterns on commercial 45 brass that they use on commercial 9mm brass.
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No large primer 45ACP with dots for me either. But lots of small primer.

Edit: wrong, I found some..quite a few.
 
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I have no idea the why, when or how...
I do know I have more problems with insufficient neck tension (subjective) with the Federal cases that have the dots... in 9mmLuger.
 
CQB45ACP said:
Why “obviously” crimped primers? Does it have to do with the “NT”? AFTE says it means “non toxic”
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"Obviously" because I can see clearly they are crimped. I have seen other cases where it was not completely clear to me whether the primers are crimped or not.
I understand the NT means non-toxic, the only reason (speculation) I can think of to have crimped primers is to make counterfeiting and/or reloading more difficult. I am presuming a price premium for NT cartridges, so the extra steps dealing with the primer pocket would offset the profit from counterfeiting. Personally, there are so few mixed in that I just set them aside and don't bother with them.
 
merlynski said:
"Obviously" because I can see clearly they are crimped. I have seen other cases where it was not completely clear to me whether the primers are crimped or not.
I understand the NT means non-toxic, the only reason (speculation) I can think of to have crimped primers is to make counterfeiting and/or reloading more difficult. I am presuming a price premium for NT cartridges, so the extra steps dealing with the primer pocket would offset the profit from counterfeiting. Personally, there are so few mixed in that I just set them aside and don't bother with them.
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Okay...thanks
I thought it had something to do with markings I hadn’t heard before. But still could I guess
 
The only time I am 'willing' to deal with crimped primer cases is 1xF 5.56 military cases for loading mil equivalent reloads. Since I don't have anything with a 5.56x45 chamber I won't be doing much of that. I de-crimped a lot of 1000 once before, by hand, with a reamer. My fingers hurt for months afterwards. And I am not willing to buy the tools to do de-crimping for something I do not need.
 
Rule3 said:
Lets not make a FEDERAL case about these Federal cases!:rofl:

Perhaps contact them an the mystery shall be revealed??

https://www.federalpremium.com/contactus
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In my 45acp headstamp project I have had the occasion to read some ammo forums...and what we’re doing is nothing wrt discussing minutiae. But anyway attached is a picture of my 45acp library with several different types of Federal large and small.

CABCA29C-E333-48C7-9CD2-A13B4493A339.jpeg
 
higgite said:
Awhile back I asked Federal customer service about 9mm FC headstamps having dots and no dots, etc., and was told the different patterns identify different locations and machines that the cases were manufactured on.
Click to expand...
That would fit in with my observations. I have noticed (been reloading since the early 1970s) head stamps do vary. My first thought was this was due to the die stamps wearing out and being replaced. Long ago (even before me) Remington bought out United Metallic Corporation (another cartridge maker) and head stamps of "Remington UMC" derived. And so it goes. I do not think the head stamp itself means much - other than perhaps the smaller primers. That might be simply because all the small primer cases are made at X factory for that brand.
However, I have also noted the cases do vary at times. This bunch will be thicker walled than that bunch, weigh more, have thinner rims and so on. They all seem to make proper ammunition on the whole. However, I have had some 'combinations' of a thin walled case and a minimal diameter bullet - the bullets were loose, some would not hold at all. But I could not equate any of that to the head stamp. Changing bullets was easier than changing the brass (as I recall) and that 'fixed' the problem.

As always be vigilant and alert. The world needs more lerts.
 
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