What was the appeal of the .38 S&W cartridge?

[TTv2]

Monac you're on the right track. But the factories will never load a 38 S&W up to modern pressures because of the liability. Not every gun owner reads on the forums or read gun magazines and doesn't know that Granpa's old Iver Johnson might be wrecked or blown up with a 21st century loading. And apparently they can't read warnings on boxes of ammo either. Thats why rifle only 32-20 loads had to be dropped because people were shooting them in old revolvers not designed to take the pressure.

I can understand why a modern .38 S&W top break that was built for a stouter load couldn't be done today due to liability, but what I don't understand is why something like .38 Short or Long Colt couldn't be used instead. I mean, even if the manufacturer was giving a wink and nod to reloaders and boutique ammo companies that these could safely shoot .38 +P level loads, but they decided to keep it to .38 Short or Long Colt for the sake of historical accuracy.

If a modern top break revolver were to be made in the US again, I don't think it best to stick with .38 S&W solely because of the ammo availability. Actually, IDK if it should even be a .38, maybe a .45 ACP would be better.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

A) There was one of the Ruger .380 Rimmed revolvers on GunBroker fairly recently, but I can't find it in the "Completed Items". I'll poke around some more, but they seem to clean that out pretty fast,

B) Ruger would do a fine job of making a top break revolver. If I won one of those huge lottery payouts, I would commission them to do it. And I could dramatically increase my odds of winning such a lottery by actually buying a ticket once in a while!

PS - I found the completed Ruger "380 Rimmed" revolver listing on GunBroker: https://www.gunbroker.com/item/891087347

Thanks!

So now the question is, did the winner pay a thousand bucks for an unusual .38 or did they pay it for an unusual Ruger? If the former, shooting it won’t effect value (to the owner) but if the latter, then maybe they’ll leave it be.

A lot of money for it either way.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

I can understand why a modern .38 S&W top break that was built for a stouter load couldn't be done today due to liability, but what I don't understand is why something like .38 Short or Long Colt couldn't be used instead. I mean, even if the manufacturer was giving a wink and nod to reloaders and boutique ammo companies that these could safely shoot .38 +P level loads, but they decided to keep it to .38 Short or Long Colt for the sake of historical accuracy.

If a modern top break revolver were to be made in the US again, I don't think it best to stick with .38 S&W solely because of the ammo availability. Actually, IDK if it should even be a .38, maybe a .45 ACP would be better.

NAA already brought back the modern top break in .22WRFM.

 

[TTv2]

NAA already brought back the modern top break in .22WRFM.

Maybe. Problem is they're asking $500 for a hard to shoot mini revolver.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

Maybe. Problem is they're asking $500 for a hard to shoot mini revolver.

That’s NAA’s market.

 

[TTv2]

That’s NAA’s market.

Uh, no, NAA's market was their $300 Black Widow and $200 .22 LR. The Sidewinder was nice, I've seen those for $300 in .22 Mag only, but people wanted the top break and when you consider the price for them, you're not getting anything that's better or easier to shoot, you're just getting something that you can reload a little bit faster.

Put on the clock, I'll bet some can reload the Sidewinder as fast as the Ranger.

 

[MatrixReality]

The “appeal” of the 38 SPL is that it worked. For decades, and still does. The original loading was with a 158 gr lead round nose. This loading police used to effectively dispatch thousands of criminals over many years. Now we have advanced 38 hollow points that have more stopping power than before. VERY lethal rounds that will stop a large man in his tracks. “What is the appeal of the 38 SPL?” Ask the law enforcement personnel that defended their lives with it

 

[Monac]

The “appeal” of the 38 SPL is that it worked. For decades, and still does. The original loading was with a 158 gr lead round nose. This loading police used to effectively dispatch thousands of criminals over many years. Now we have advanced 38 hollow points that have more stopping power than before. VERY lethal rounds that will stop a large man in his tracks. “What is the appeal of the 38 SPL?” Ask the law enforcement personnel that defended their lives with it

A) This thread is about 38 S&W, the short 38 caliber cartridge that preceded 38 Special by 20-odd years. Hundreds of thousands, maybe millions, of revolvers were made for it, and it remained popular long after 38 Special had been introduced. The person who started the thread was curious why this was so.

B) The effectiveness of the 38 Special RNL load was similar to any other RNL/FMJ round with roughly the same power: Lots of penetration, but not as much shock effect as cops, in particular, wanted, I have read that this load was called "the widowmaker" because of COP'S widows, because it failed to prevent criminals from using a gun or a knife after they were hit. And that standard, if unofficial, advice to cops apparently was that if they had to shoot someone, they should empty their gun into them for their best chance of survival.

Nobody is saying that 38 Special RNL loads were bad at killing people. But often people are shot in an effort to make them stop what they are doing at once. For that RNL was not so hot, and that is why hollow points were developed and became standard issue.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

The “appeal” of the 38 SPL is that it worked. For decades, and still does. The original loading was with a 158 gr lead round nose. This loading police used to effectively dispatch thousands of criminals over many years. Now we have advanced 38 hollow points that have more stopping power than before. VERY lethal rounds that will stop a large man in his tracks. “What is the appeal of the 38 SPL?” Ask the law enforcement personnel that defended their lives with it

.38S&W Completely different. No relation to.38Spl. They hail from a different era and were meant for different types of firearm.