Which Dillon would be best

[hydraulicman]

I see you have a lot of calibers listed that you would like to load for. I say , pick the caliber you shoot the most of and start with that. Load a bunch and shoot a bunch of that caliber then decide what you want to load for next. .308 might be a caliber you would load on a single stage , saving the 9mm / 45 and 223 for the dillon

 

[GaryL]

As far as stick powders in a 550b go, that's how I load my 30-06. I do the initial process like a single stage, then prime and throw a short load of powder in each case (about 0.2-0.4gr short). After I have a batch of 20 cases, I take a case, pour the powder into a beam scale, then trickle powder from another case (just for that purpose) to bring the load up to the desired charge, and then it goes back into the case in a separate block. Once the 20 have been charged, I use a stick to do a quick tamp check, and then shine a light into them all to do the visual verification. Then the block gets processed through the back half of the machine to seat and crimp the bullet in place.

 

[Bayou1535]

Thanks everyone for their opinion, just trying to sort everything out and that is a daunting task for a newbie. Still in the same boat but honestly I think I am leaning towards a 650, I think that if I got a 550 then I would be upgrading in a year or two. I'm sure without a doubt that the 550 would suffice but the 650 has a couple options that I like. I will be only starting with 9mm and figure that out to a "T" before I go to a different caliber. Still have some time to decide and I will continue to read everything I can. Thanks

 

[Lloyd Smale]

ive got a 650 a 550 and three lnl hornadys. What would i recomend for you. A 550 hands down. Nothing is more reliable and unless you need to crank out 1000s of rounds fast there plenty fast enough. the 650 is more awkward to use if your not using a case feeder as thats how they were designed to be used. the lock an loads are decent presses but i seem to be constantly adjusting timing on them and never have to on a 650 and the case feeder on them isnt near as reliable as the 650. One advantage to the hornady case feeder though is its easy to disable and use the press without it. Ive got quite a few presses. I like to keep them set up in a specific caliber but if i had to go down to one press i would choose the 550 hands down.

 

[MtnCreek]

I think I am leaning towards a 650, I think that if I got a 550 then I would be upgrading in a year or two.

Or buy a turret or single stage kit. You'll only spend an additional +/- $100 because the kit will come with things that you'll have to purchase anyway. When you get the loading process down, upgrade to the 650. I don't think it's possable to fully learn the tricks of the trade on a full blown progressive. Then apply what you've learned to a progressive setup. My first motorcycle was a Honda 50. If I started out w/ a YZ125, I would have learned how to handle the bike and not the fundimentals of riding. It'sa the same for about anything: My first horse was a 16yr old Apalossa, now I ride a 6yr old Quarter.

 

[lmccrock]

Brian Enos provides Which Dillon and Dillon FAQ pages which can answer a lot of questions.

Short answer: lots of different calibers, 550. Thousands of the same caliber, 650.

Lee

 

[Bayou1535]

I frequently visit Brian Enos's site and have read the "which Dillon" and tons of other threads. I came to this site and asked because I noticed that there is alot of knowledge here and alot less childness remarks here. Still have time left and will continue to listen to everyone's opinions and have found someone locally with a 550 to see/try to help on the decision.

 

[GaryL]

A few people have suggested a single stage or a turret press for a guy starting out, because they feel that's the best way to learn the intricacies of the process. The beauty of the 550b is you can use it like a multi-station single stage as you get started, and move right into semi-automated production when you get the process nailed down.

 

[cfullgraf]

My first horse was a 16yr old Apalossa, now I ride a 6yr old Quarter.

You know why the indians were such fierce fighters? They rode Appaloosas into battle and were mad as hell dealing with their Appaloosas when they got there.

Back to the original topic. I use both a progressive and a single stage. I find with the progressive, I need to make a run of 300 or more rounds to be more efficient than the single stage. Some cartridges I don't shoot or load very many at a time. Therefore, it is not worth loading them on the progressive.

Also, there are some tasks are more handy to do on a single stage.

 

[Bayou1535]

Quick question in regards to the 550 users, do you find it difficult to look inside od rifle cases to check for powder? I would assume its difficult due to the size of the case mouth. Also does the 550 primer not push a primer up the LNL if a case isn't present. I believe the 650 does prime/casue a primer issue if a case isn't present. Thanks

 

[gshipps]

In a 550 the primer just rides along if no case present. As for looking, easy on pistol not so easy on rifle.

 

[thump_rrr]

Nice thread i have been looking at these presses too but i just can figure out tho whole plague with the hornady. Some people love it and other claim they will not prime right. I just cant see how hornady couldnt tell u how to fix it. Is there CS that bad?

I have called Hornady Customer Service 4 times so far.

The first time was when I purchased a set of .223 dies and some Hornady One Shot spray lube.

I was completely new to loading rifle cartridges and I stuck a case in the sizing die.
I removed the stuck case and tried again sticking a 2nd case.

I called customer service and explained my problem and the tech asked if I disassembled and cleaned the dies which I did.
He then had me re-lube the cases and try to size one and he could hear the die screeching.
He explained that maybe the lube had frozen in transport and offered to ship me another can.
I took a tub of Unique paste lube instead.

The second time was when I recieved my Hornady LnL AP Progressive.
The large primer slide would stick when trying to pick up a primer out of the tube.
The tech I spoke to tried everything to convince me that my primers were to blame even though I tried 2 different lots of Winchester primers manufactured years apart.
I also mentioned to him that the spring under the sub-plate which is supposed to keep the tension off the primer punch while it's at rest isn't strong enough.
His reply was "Yeah mine does that too":banghead:
It was my feeling that this guy unlike the others was just there doing a job to pass the time rather than to do whaterver it took to get the customer back up and running painlessly.
He finally shipped me another slider which solved the problem.

The 3rd time was when I converted the LnL AP to run .223 for the first time.
The cases wouldn't slide in when fed by the case feeder and they would rock in stations #1 and #2.
The tech took his time and went through a bunch of things with me.
It was determined that the sub plate was out of tolerance and a new one was to be sent out.
Unfortunately when the box which was supposed to contain the sub-plate arrived it had parts totally unrelated to my press in it.

When I called back the tech was very apologetic and went through the order with me again and also added a new .223 shellplate as well as anything else he thought could casue these issues.
He told me that they're all reloaders and want to get me back up and running smoothly as quickly as possible.

I'm still waiting for this order to arrive since I'm in Canada and it takes quite a while for USPS orders to clear customs.
My suggestion is that if you're getting nowhere with the tech you're dealing with hang up and try again.
If you find a tech that listens and is knowlegeable get his name and extension number and always go back to the same guy.

Once the parts come in and I have a chance to see if everything is OK I'll start a new thread with my experience.

 

[GaryL]

Quick question in regards to the 550 users, do you find it difficult to look inside od rifle cases to check for powder?

I explain my process in post 27 for 30-06.

I don't bother checking every case for 223 blasting ammo. But I do pull a case every so often and check the powder thrown to see how it's going. Of course when you are throwing 4895 into a 223 case, there pretty much is no such thing as an overcharge. The max load is close to a compressed load.

I have a mirror on the press for looking into every pistol case, and that works out quite well.

 

[Bayou1535]

Well I went over to a fella's house tonight and checked out his 550 and I'm glad I did for a couple of reasons. First off his bench was the same height as mine which is 36" and he had the stong mount inwhich I thought previously that I would skip. After seeing the height in person in relation to looking at the case to check powder and operating the roller handle I found out the raised height is a must. His and my bench were both at 36" and I previously thought I would sit but after trying his I would rather stand. The more I have thought about it lately the 550 matches my consumption needs and actually surpasses it. I just don't really see the need for amount of processed rounds and rounds that would be loaded at one sitting to justify the 650. The big hang up for me was being able to see in the rifle case to check for powder and it doesn't look possible but couldn't I use a seat and crimp in one station that would allow me to use a powder checker. From my uneducated and still learning mind I can see sizing in station 1, powder drop in station 2, powder cop/lockout die in station 3 and then a combo seat and crimp in station 4? From what I read everyone sais to seat and crimp in 2 stations but would the seat/crimp allow me free up a station?

 

[petrey10]

i may be off topic here but I am a dillon guy thru and thru but the RCBS Pro2000 does everything the Dillon does but slightly faster... if I were going to get a progressive that loads 5 different calibers then I would get the PRO 2000....

 

[MtnCreek]

Bayou,
The 650 toolhead has an additional hole in it for the powder check. You may be able to modify the 550 toolhead or possibly use a different brand powder check.
Seat/crimp in one stage can work, but it does have its disadvantages.

Also, where is station 4, at the back of the press? I bet you'll have a hard time placing the projectile on station 4.

 

[Bayou1535]

You know your right about placing the bullet in station 4, it would make it not worth while. I was just thinking of an alternative with the 550. I've read many threads that ask how many/average everyone loads at one sitting and it seems to between 300-500 and that what I'm thinking. After loading on his 550 it is very easy to see the charge volume in the pistol case but he didn't have any rifle to try. Thats the only thing stopping or asking further questions is the ability to inside rifle cases. The 550 is well within my amount needs and then some. Just don't see the need for the 650 except for the powder check, roughly $320 difference when you add the case to the 650.

 

[Red Cent]

Get two 650s. One set up for a small primer and one for a large primer. Then buy the toolhead, dies, and powder mesure for each additional caliber. Done. Switch calibers real easy.
I load for 38/357, 45 ACP. and the 45 Colt. Guess how many 650s I have.

I load the 38-55 on a Lee Turret.

For peripheal jobs, a Lyman Spartan (bought it in 1964) is mounted.

 

[CraigC]

I would STRONGLY suggest learning on a single stage or turret. Either is a must for load development and small batches anyway. You REALLY need to be intimately familiar with the whole process before you start automating anything. Folks don't like to hear this but there is a learning process that one must go through and it IS a process. Learning how it all works is not something that can be rushed. There are folks who could not pour pee out of a boot with instructions on the heel and also those who should never be allowed around tools. I am not one of them. I am an anal retentive detail nut, a tinkerer and a patient fine tuner and I am infinitely grateful to have learned on a turret long before getting my Dillon 650.

 

[Bayou1535]

Well getting 2 650's is out of the question

 

[MtnCreek]

Well getting 2 650's is out of the question

Then do what CraigC said and get a single or turret, then add the 550, 650, 1050..... later. That way you'll have two presses and won't even have to spend much more than if you just went out and got the 650 and other do-dads needed for reloading.

 

[lykoris]

Whilst I agree starting with a single/turret press is the appropriate advice for the vast majority of people(they're always useful later as a full time decapping station or for running small batches etc.) there are those capable of starting off on a progressive or somewhat semi-progressive in the case of a 550.

I started on a 650 as I wanted this press ultimately and didn't want the expense of upgrading equipment or outgrowing a press within a few weeks....and knowing myself I knew the latter was extremely probable.

Some people have a far shorter learning curve than others and assimilate information rapidly.

I'm sure I'll get berated for the above comments but advising 100% of people to start off on a single/turret press isn't always the best advice...although in 95-98% of cases it is the best advice.

I started on a 650, then went with a turret with two T7s then a single stage forster co-ax.

 

[CraigC]

Has nothing to do with a short learning curve, intelligence or mechanical aptitude. It has everything to do with becoming intimately familiar with every aspect and every step, manually, before automating any of the process. Learning what every step "feels" like. What problems to look for, what to expect when you do it right and more importantly, what to expect when you do it wrong. You need to know all of this inside and out long before you start doing every step at once.

The money spent on a single stage or turret is never wasted. Unless your shooting is extremely limited in scope, you will always need one at least for load development. The car analogy is a very good one and you would not want to learn how to drive on a top fuel dragster, any more than you would want to drive one to the convenience store to buy a loaf of bread. Nor would you want to learn to shoot with a .470NE. Which is what you're doing if you try to develop loads on a progressive.

I might note that the only reloaders that would recommend learning on a progressive are those who did so themselves. Not only will you practically never hear that from one that learned on a single stage or turret, you will also never hear one say they wish they had skipped the single stage and gone straight to the progressive.

 

[lykoris]

It has everything to do with becoming intimately familiar with every aspect and every step, manually, before automating any of the process. Learning what every step "feels" like. What problems to look for, what to expect when you do it right and more importantly, what to expect when you do it wrong. You need to know all of this inside and out long before you start doing every step at once.

I would argue all of the above is possible with the 650 starting out to reload with standard pistol calibres such as 9/45.

Did I start pumping out 600 rounds an hour as soon as I got a 650, of course not, that was 2 months down the line. If you plan on reloading several calibres on a 650 it's inevitable you will buy a different toolhead per calibre. As such it's possible to put a single die for one calibre in each toolhead and use the 650 as a single stage press to start out on.

so for example in starting to reload 45acp
- you put a single sizing die in the press and decap/resize 100 cases
- you then leave out the toolhead and prime the brass
- you then do the powder on a different toolhead
- bullet seating on another toolhead
- same again with crimping

I might note that the only reloaders that would recommend learning on a progressive are those who did so themselves. Not only will you practically never hear that from one that learned on a single stage or turret

Therefore you're saying people who learned on a single stage/turret will only suggest a single stage/turret press. As I said above there is a very small minority to which this advice may not be the most appropriate.

you will also never hear one say they wish they had skipped the single stage and gone straight to the progressive

No doubt but you will also hear from a select minority that they were happy to have skipped the single/turret stage and gone straight to the progressive.

I needed 600-800 rounds a week in pistol calibres for two people. I didn't need to decap/resize 2,500 pistol cases in a month on a single stage/turret to know the 'feel' of it, likewise for crimping, bullet seating and powder dumping. The only required 'feel' in my opinion on a 650 is a) seating primers and b)finding the rhythm of the press with your own tempo.

Finally I would disagree with you when you say

Has nothing to do with a short learning curve, intelligence or mechanical aptitude

 

[ny32182]

My feeling is that there are two things to learn about: one is the ammo, the other is the machine.

A single stage/turret is a simple enough device that learning about the machine is all but a non-factor, which lets you concentrate on learning about the ammo. After you are comfortable that you know exactly what each step in the process actually does, and how the finished product is actually dimensioned correctly, that is the right time to move to a progressive. Since you already know what the finished product should look like, you can then concentrate on learning/tweaking the machine to do what you want. Starting on a progressive is like solving an equation with two variables in it; it might be possible through trial and error, but it is not ideal.

You can get a single stage press for CHEAP. $150 or less. As many people have stated, you will need one anyway. If you are a quick learner and feel you know all about the ammo after one week, then buy the progressive after one week. Or buy them both at the same time, and just set up the single stage first.

Even an expert needs both. There is no reason at all not to start on a single stage, as you can still make the transition as fast as you want, and you will have a better understanding of the loading itself if you do it that way.