Why do so many Liberals Love Firearms

[Gungnir]

If we had a new re-written amendment

There is no need the 2A is clear, very clear. Heller confirmed "the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed" as the primary directive.

How more clear does this need to be? The "confusion" is when the Brady's of the world start discussing what "arms" means, and what "infringe" means. Changing the syntax is not going to stop them, they'll just select new ambiguities in the wording.

Couldn't it make sense to also require firearm registration

Firearm registration, why? Who gains from this, what is its purpose?

We can throw statistics at the problem and prove that the vast majority of criminals do not get firearms through approved channels, thus gaining no REAL benefit from registration. Since only the law abiding would register. There is also a great and historically justifiable fear that registration would lead towards confiscation down the line.

some amount of accredited training in safeties name?

Accredited training, who decides what is accredited, and who can perform this?

This is like censorship, who decides? When does it become a political pawn? When does it get restricted? You can use this requirement as a gate to prevent people being able to own firearms. No training, no gun, suppose it's decided that there is one training center per state, who now can legally own firearms? What about one in the US, who can now legally own firearms. Then of course who regulates these, and what is the actual training received.

I admit that on the surface it looks logical, however it also removes an element of responsibility, responsible gun owners have taken probably more training in safety, and firearm instruction than would be needed for the term accredited. This may not be "traditional" training, but from friends, neighbors, family members, as well as specific training courses run by the NRA or their local range. Ultimately regardless of training, if you screw up with a gun and shoot either yourself or someone else, it's your responsibility.

 

[hso]

Let's get back on track or this one closes. This is not an open discussion forum. We're supposed to be working on ideas to develop some plan of action. Focus on the question of how liberals in particular can contribute to the RKBA cause (and please don't waste everyone's time with "Don't be a liberal" foolishness).

 

[kilo729]

Consider the actual meaning of the word "liberal" - it's derived from the Latin liber, meaning "free." This country's progenitors were considered liberal in their day, for rejecting the ideas of absolute power and hereditary rule.

Unfortunately, the term has been corrupted over the years, and is now used primarily in a political context to describe a platform which does not necessarily correspond to classical liberalism. In fact, most self-professed "liberals" today are not "liberals" at all - a number may be in some sense or another, but it's a bit disingenuous to call yourself "liberal" if you support prohibitions or tight controls on speech, economic activity, or (to keep things relevant) the means to self-defense.

Of course, the ideas behind liberalism have not disappeared; they've simply been relabeled. The contemporary term for a classical liberal is "libertarian."

Spot on. Now if only people would stop referring to Democrats as "Liberals" and Republicans as "Conservatives".

 

[IndianaBoy]

Example: "If Lincoln were alive today he would be a Democrat." I'm sure there are a few here that would dispute that, but that's the beauty of free speech

Based on what?

I would like to understand your thought process behind this.

 

[Gungnir]

OK not sure whether the getting back on track was directed at me or not, kind of confusing, since the OP keeps throwing things in that are not specifically Activism related.

All I can immediately think of is
1) Take friends shooting who have not previously done so, recruit these people if at all possible to the cause.
2) Make sure your Reps both state and Federal know your position. Also make them aware that you will not support them should they effect the RKBA, also give them your philosophy on what the RKBA means to you.
3) Join the NRA and other gun support lobby groups.

Liberals can contribute to the cause the same way as everyone else. The one possible advantage they have is that they can say "we voted for you this time for these reasons, don't do X this time, or we'll not vote the same way again."

 

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

I am of the belief that you are who you vote for. One can talk about whatever views they want, but the only real way of causing action on those views is voting. If you vote for a person who holds certain views, you are supporting those views whether you want to believe it or not. Voting for anti-gunners makes you anti-gun. It doesn't matter if that's how you feel. That is your mark on the world.

 

[HGUNHNTR]

I am a liberal who enjoys firearms. I do not let my social and political tendencies sway how I feel about the pleasure I get from collecting, shooting, and handling a fine firearm.

My feelings on how I feel my country should be governed has no bearing on how I feel about firearms.

In reference to the above post, voting for a candidate based on a sigle issue would make sense IF that were the only issue of importance. For most people, especially those who care about the welfare of the nation and its people as a whole this is not the case.

 

[rbernie]

Having said all of this - I still do not see any plan forming to help further the RKBA cause within the ranks of the 'liberal' (their term) establishment.

Guys - we're not supposed to just bicker back and forth over terminology. Those folk who support the RKBA and with insights and inroads into the self-proclaimed 'liberal' community need to step up and create some actionable plan for furthering the RKBA. Anything less is just a waste of electrons.

Let's take Gungnir's list:

1) Take friends shooting who have not previously done so, recruit these people if at all possible to the cause.
2) Make sure your Reps both state and Federal know your position. Also make them aware that you will not support them should they effect the RKBA, also give them your philosophy on what the RKBA means to you.
3) Join the NRA and other gun support lobby groups.

I'll start with the last bullet. How many of the 'liberals' on this board are NRA members? How many are actively recruiting NRA members? If you're not an NRA member, have you bothered to write the NRA and tell them why?