LRShooting
Member
Is it a legality issue? Ive wondered why people don't just make their own magazines as substitutes for 80+ dollar rifle mags. You would have to make sure to not have any patent infringements of course, but otherwise I don't get it.
Why Doesn't Anybody Make Their Own Magazines?
- Thread starter LRShooting
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Lack of the metal bending jigs & welders perhaps? Many of them need special bends or cutouts which would be doable but difficult.
The expensive ones are generally linked to the expensive guns so price isn't a concern there. At the other end they are plentiful so no motivation.
I'm just guessing though. Being uncontrolled or flatly illegal there is no middle ground of having something unpapered but legal like making a rifle. Without some trailblazers showing how it doesn't expand to the general population.
The expensive ones are generally linked to the expensive guns so price isn't a concern there. At the other end they are plentiful so no motivation.
I'm just guessing though. Being uncontrolled or flatly illegal there is no middle ground of having something unpapered but legal like making a rifle. Without some trailblazers showing how it doesn't expand to the general population.
LAGS
Member
I have in the past tried to make magazines for guns that I could not find a replacement.
It is not easy, and very time consuming.
It was hard enough just trying to get a Spare Magazine Well made for a friends rifle, that fits in the bottom of the buttstock.
It does take special bending tools and usually a dummy mandral for the initial forming.
It is easier to buy a magazine, than it is to makeone, unless you have no other option.
But Modifying one magazine to fit another gun is a viable option also, and sometimes can be done, but can result in modifications to the rifle.
It is not easy, and very time consuming.
It was hard enough just trying to get a Spare Magazine Well made for a friends rifle, that fits in the bottom of the buttstock.
It does take special bending tools and usually a dummy mandral for the initial forming.
It is easier to buy a magazine, than it is to makeone, unless you have no other option.
But Modifying one magazine to fit another gun is a viable option also, and sometimes can be done, but can result in modifications to the rifle.
wally
Member
If it was as easy as you seem to think, Pro-Mags and Triple-K mags would usually work instead of usually not work.
KansasSasquatch
Member
I could do it by by hand for some guns. It might not be as pretty as most factory mags, but manufacturers have more money for specialized tools than I do. I have modified magazines to work in guns other than what they were originally intended for. I recently modified a 1911 magazine w/ welded floor plate to fit a Springfield XDs and use any standard XDs floor plate or aftermarket floor plate such as those made by Pearce. It's not real practical as its still a 7 round magazine, and Springfield makes 7 round XDs magazine. But it might be fun to take a 15 round 1911 magazine and turn it into a 15round XDs mag 
JHansenAK47
Member
Globalization. A company can specialize in magazines so you can take a premade template and apply it to their design.
Obviously magazines are not necessarily interchangeable but beretta 92 mags can be modified via cutting a new mag latch for the cougar both beretta and stoeger. The K100 grand power can be modified to the CZ75 the same way.
Magazines aren't made to one template but new designs follow proven ones with minor modifications.
That way you can stay competitive and practical all at once.
Obviously magazines are not necessarily interchangeable but beretta 92 mags can be modified via cutting a new mag latch for the cougar both beretta and stoeger. The K100 grand power can be modified to the CZ75 the same way.
Magazines aren't made to one template but new designs follow proven ones with minor modifications.
That way you can stay competitive and practical all at once.
justice06rr
Member
With magazines ranging from $6-40, I don't see the point of making my own mags.
You would have to invest a lot more money into tools and equipment (hundreds, maybe thousands of $$) just to produce them yourself.
AR and AK mags have been less than $10 now that things have calmed down. there is no point in making your own. Just buy as much as you can now that they're cheap again.
You would have to invest a lot more money into tools and equipment (hundreds, maybe thousands of $$) just to produce them yourself.
AR and AK mags have been less than $10 now that things have calmed down. there is no point in making your own. Just buy as much as you can now that they're cheap again.
Ash
Member
Specialization reduces cost and increases performance (assuming quality is retained). Mecgar is the big magazine maker and their magazines are superb. They probably make OEM magazines for just about everyone in the handgun business. They know how to make magazines and that is all they make and what they make is superb. Other companies in the rifle world are the same way. When you make a bunch of magazines, even with keeping high standards, economies of scale kick in and you can make better cheaper.
When a company has access to something like that, a proven magazine that functions all the time, they don't need to try and make one themselves. It may save some money, but the risk of manufacturing a sub-par magazine that leads to an overall reduction of reputation can be far more expensive. Most companies are happy to leave it to experts who can do it (and probably cheaper than the company can do it themselves).
When a company has access to something like that, a proven magazine that functions all the time, they don't need to try and make one themselves. It may save some money, but the risk of manufacturing a sub-par magazine that leads to an overall reduction of reputation can be far more expensive. Most companies are happy to leave it to experts who can do it (and probably cheaper than the company can do it themselves).
LRShooting
Member
Im talking about AICS 10 rd 300 wm mags that run 130$ a pop off Midway... expensive to me. I wish these mags ran cheap. I haven't been able to find the Ruger Polymer mags that will swap out with AICS, or so says some people.
Since half a dozen will last your lifetime
and cost just a few hundred $, why bother? Anyone who is capable of doing it right is going to charge at least $50 per hour and it will take them several hours to get set up to make the first one. Might take10 hours, depending. And thata's if they have the proper tools to do it. You might want to look at a book by Bill Holmes, entitled HOMEWORKSHOP SUBMACHINEGUN. The Sten mag is about the easyist mag to make, needing no "springy" feed lips. That's the one that he shows you how to make. The top few inches of the mag just have a steel "sleeve" over the main mag body to reinforce it and prevent the mag lips from spreading apart.
and cost just a few hundred $, why bother? Anyone who is capable of doing it right is going to charge at least $50 per hour and it will take them several hours to get set up to make the first one. Might take10 hours, depending. And thata's if they have the proper tools to do it. You might want to look at a book by Bill Holmes, entitled HOMEWORKSHOP SUBMACHINEGUN. The Sten mag is about the easyist mag to make, needing no "springy" feed lips. That's the one that he shows you how to make. The top few inches of the mag just have a steel "sleeve" over the main mag body to reinforce it and prevent the mag lips from spreading apart.
briansmithwins
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This and economy of scale. Welded sheet metal is among the cheapest ways to make things we know how to do. If you need a few hundred thousands to millions of the same part. Plastic molds for making parts are very expensive to manufacture and that type of die work requires specialists.
And, as was mentioned earlier, you actually have to do the work right and keep the tolerances correct. The magazine is the most fragile critical part of pretty much any sefl loading firearm.
I've always thought the reason AKs and HKs are so reliable is the magazine construction.
BSW
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CaliCoastie
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How much is your time worth? 135 for a specialty magazine? If you could make it in 10hrs, that's 13 an hour now say you need testing and more time at 20hrs you are looking at 6.5 per hr.
As stated is not really feasible to make them if you don't have to. Now if you like tinkering? Have at it, if that's your only option? Well that answers it's self. If I recall aics is an aftermarket add on, geared towards dedicated long range shooting. When your talking a few thousand dollar shooting platform? ..... well..... Sometimes you have to pay to play. I know afellow who has a custom 700 in 338lm as a hunting rifle who hasn't had the chance to play (take an animal) yet
so for most? Not worth it, for some its a labor of love, and for a few is the only option.
As stated is not really feasible to make them if you don't have to. Now if you like tinkering? Have at it, if that's your only option? Well that answers it's self. If I recall aics is an aftermarket add on, geared towards dedicated long range shooting. When your talking a few thousand dollar shooting platform? ..... well..... Sometimes you have to pay to play. I know afellow who has a custom 700 in 338lm as a hunting rifle who hasn't had the chance to play (take an animal) yet
so for most? Not worth it, for some its a labor of love, and for a few is the only option.
I bought a 20mm dieholder the other day. It cost just over the equivalent of five bucks which included mailing it from Hong Kong. I could have sat down and made one, but it's not worth the time I would have to put in just to save five bucks .
RetiredUSNChief
Member
Why not make your own magazines?
Well, for all their simplicity in terms of form and function, they DO require mechanical precision and detail in order to function. Just ask anybody who has had magazine related problems in their guns from factory produced magazines.
However, that said, I do believe some magazine components might be made without too much issue. The removable baseplates for some, as an example. Maybe even the magazine follower, if you pay attention to detail enough.
But the body of the magazine will be beyond that of most people in terms of necessary tooling and shaping of something that has to both fit snuggly into the frame AND allow the slide follower full range of motion AND properly feed ammunition off the ramp into the firearm.
The spring? Not worth making on your own...far cheaper to buy the preformed spring.
Well, for all their simplicity in terms of form and function, they DO require mechanical precision and detail in order to function. Just ask anybody who has had magazine related problems in their guns from factory produced magazines.
However, that said, I do believe some magazine components might be made without too much issue. The removable baseplates for some, as an example. Maybe even the magazine follower, if you pay attention to detail enough.
But the body of the magazine will be beyond that of most people in terms of necessary tooling and shaping of something that has to both fit snuggly into the frame AND allow the slide follower full range of motion AND properly feed ammunition off the ramp into the firearm.
The spring? Not worth making on your own...far cheaper to buy the preformed spring.
LRShooting
Member
Well, your pretty well spot on. The reason for needing a AICS Mag is because I am getting a PT&G Savage Stealth DBM. As far as time, I don't have anything better to do after work or school, so why not. Its tinkering time! Id rather go outside and sit in a treestand then watch a movie. Building a magazine would be pretty high on the list of "things I would rather do" if I could. Ill push out the money for a magazine, but if it could be avoided, why not lol
LRShooting
Member
Yea, 5 bucks vs 100+ is not to easy to compare though. Especially when the time I would enjoy doing this would only consist of my tinkering time. However, it seems that it may be a little hard to do (understatement) and Ill probably just buy one. Maybe Ill tinker around and build a barely workable spare if I want something to do.
Ash
Member
By the way, there is no patent infringement that I know of making something for yourself. The only time there is infringement is when you turn around a sell it.
LRShooting
Member
gpb
Member
Why Doesn't Anybody Make Their Own Magazines?
I don't think making magazines is as easy as it would seem. For example, there are a couple of companies that specialize in making "replacement" magazines for obsolete pistols. My experience with these "replacement" magazines has been spotty to say the least. Given that companies that specialize in making replacement magazines seen to have a hard time of it, I doubt if I could do any better. After all, they have all the tooling, machines, materials and expertise that I lack and still they come up short.
I don't think making magazines is as easy as it would seem. For example, there are a couple of companies that specialize in making "replacement" magazines for obsolete pistols. My experience with these "replacement" magazines has been spotty to say the least. Given that companies that specialize in making replacement magazines seen to have a hard time of it, I doubt if I could do any better. After all, they have all the tooling, machines, materials and expertise that I lack and still they come up short.
USAF_Vet
Member
Not really. I work in an automotive plastic injection molding facility. The molds themselves are good for hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of parts with relatively minimal maintenance.
Its much cheaper and much faster than sheet metal stamping, folding and welding.
Plastic injection molds are made of soft steel, so they are easy to repair if they get damaged. Sheet metal stamping molds are hardened steel, and much more difficult to repair.
The end product longevity has yet to be seen, but considering the longevity of polymer frames and mags from the 80s gen 1 Glocks, its practically a non issue.
briansmithwins
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How much does a set of molds cost?
BSW
justice06rr
Member
I wasn't quite sure what mag you were referring to initially, but yes $130 a pop gets pricey. Buying a few of those mags will probably still be cheaper than making one.
you could attempt to make your own mags by examining the AICS mags and seeing if you can replicate it somehow for less than $130. That will tell you if its better to buy or make them yourself.
USAF_Vet
Member
Small molds, a few thousand. Sky is the limit. Door lock knob molds are maybe a couple grand, bumper molds, a couple hundred grand.
I bet Mag pul uses only two different mold types, one for the followers, with multiple cavities, and another with mirrored cavities for each half of the magazine.
Injection molding is not for the home builder. Even small molds like these would need would still run on a hundred ton press.
Metal stamping is equally, if not more expensive, on a mold per mold basis.
If just bending flats, cutting a few spots and tac welding, it is much more conducive to the home workshop.
But with 3D polymer printers, injection molding might become obsolete in the not so distant future.
I bet Mag pul uses only two different mold types, one for the followers, with multiple cavities, and another with mirrored cavities for each half of the magazine.
Injection molding is not for the home builder. Even small molds like these would need would still run on a hundred ton press.
Metal stamping is equally, if not more expensive, on a mold per mold basis.
If just bending flats, cutting a few spots and tac welding, it is much more conducive to the home workshop.
But with 3D polymer printers, injection molding might become obsolete in the not so distant future.
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