45 colt bp loads?

I load 3Fg Olde Eynsford at 40 grns under a 250 grn bullet. I use an Lee dipper sized 2.5cc. I have used Goex at the same granulation but it is dirty. OE is more energetic and cleaner burning. In my 5 1/2 in Colt SAA clone the chrony average is 1027 fps.

If you are using a well made cartridge firing modern gun 4F should not be a problem, but I have never done it.

Do not use ffffg! I fill my cases (allowing for the bullet depth of course) with fffg Goex and it's plenty painful. I will use ffg next time. Only use ffffg for priming a flintlock.

Use 2f or 3f.

Glad to see this, answered some questions I've been wondering about!

I've heard that BP should always be compressed, not loose under the bullet - true?

its always been my understanding that the most common, most popular BP load for 45 colt was a 250 grain bullet on top of 40 grains of FFFg... this performs about the same as .45acp out of similar barrel lengths

I've really been wanting to try this in my Uberti Cattleman, I just hate cleaning up after black powder.

Don't use bullets with normal lube or you will have a problem cleaning up. You need black powder lube on the bullets.

justin22885 said:

its always been my understanding that the most common, most popular BP load for 45 colt was a 250 grain bullet on top of 40 grains of FFFg... this performs about the same as .45acp out of similar barrel lengths

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40 grains fits but is tight in modern cases, depending on the bullet.

rondog said:

Glad to see this, answered some questions I've been wondering about!

I've heard that BP should always be compressed, not loose under the bullet - true?

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True.

I use 3F Goex in 45 Colt BP loads. 4F is reserved for flintlock pan priming. I use a lubed felt wad between the powder and bullet and haven't had any leading so far. The black powder should be compressed a bit.

Remember to clean the brass as well as the gun. I let the deprimed fired cases soak in water while cleaning the revolver then use a 45 caliber brush to scrub them inside and out and let them air dry. The brass will end up stained but that doesn't matter.

I use BP 45 Colt cartridges in a Ruger new model Vaquero. They are comfortable to shoot, but not wimpy, and they have been darn accurate.

I use the same wad, punched from stiff 1/8" felt and saturated with the Gato Feo lube recipe in BP 45/70 cartridges.

Jeff

justin22885 said:

its always been my understanding that the most common, most popular BP load for 45 colt was a 250 grain bullet on top of 40 grains of FFFg... this performs about the same as .45acp out of similar barrel lengths

Click to expand...

In one of my revolvers, 38 grains of fffG and a 260 grain bullet get's me nearly 1000 fps. In my 5 1/2" I get just over 900 fps. Pretty sure that beats an ACP hands down.

I like 3f in some of the medium cases, 45 long Colt, 44 Colt, 45 S&W, 38 S&W Special. I use 4f in the very small cases like the 22 WCF and other small rifle cartridges.

Kevin

midland man said:

so I was thinking about tryin this using either 3f goex but would have to go get some from the reload shop or I have some 4f goex right now so will this work and or what do ya'll use or suggest?

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If you have to go buy powder, then get Olde Eynsford 2f, or 3 if they have it. If not regular goex 3f will do well. 37 grs. of the regular 3f with a thin card wad under a 250 -260 gr bullet makes a nice recreation of the original Colt load.
Schuetzen 2f is also a good powder for this.

I've settled on 35 gr 3fg goex with a poly coated 200gr lead rnfp bullet. Pretty sure I could push it to 40gr goex with considerable compression and not get leading from these coated bullets.

35 grns will give 200 loadings from one pound of powder. I usually fall back to this for my plinking/play shooting loads to conserve a bit, but my historical shooting loads is 40 grns by Lee dipper 2.5cc the 35 grain is the Lee 2.2cc dipper

Always compress black powder!!

My BP cartridge reloader buddy always uses a drop tube to charge his cases, claiming better accuracy, better powder compaction, and cleaner burning. Since he burns about 500 rounds a month in calibers from 38 S&W to 50-110 Sharps, I'd tend to believe him.

Powder INC. ships powders in 5 lb increments and can mix makes and granulations. Price shown is product and shipping, total price for you.

http://www.powderinc.com/catalog/order.htm

My BP cartridge reloader buddy always uses a drop tube to charge his cases, claiming better accuracy, better powder compaction, and cleaner burning. Since he burns about 500 rounds a month in calibers from 38 S&W to 50-110 Sharps, I'd tend to believe him.

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Your BP buddy is getting better accuracy while sacrificing how many rounds he can make per hour. It's one thing for a big single shot caliber such as 45-70 or 50-110, where you don't go through many rounds in a day. But I have found that using a drop tube for revolver cartridges such as 45 Colt is completely unnecessary. I load all my BP revolver rounds on a progressive press, and using a drop tube would mean taking each case off, dropping the powder, then putting it back on the press. Conversely, one could decap, size, and prime, then drop tube all the powder in, then go back to the press to seat and crimp. Just not worth the extra effort to me when I can crank all the rounds through the press the way the press was designed to be used.

That 40 grain figure can vary a bit. Modern solid head cases do not have the interior capacity of the old balloon head cases.

In this photo, a balloon head case is on the left, a modern case on the right. It was easier to fit 40 grains of powder into a balloon head case than a modern case. You can get 40 grains into a modern case, but you have to compress it more.





My standard 45 Colt load is 2.2CC of Schuetzen under a 250 grain Big Lube bullet. I forget what it actually weighs, I think it is around 35 grains or so. This charge gets compressed 1/16" - 1/8" when the bullet is seated.

The original load for .45 Colt was 40 grains.
It was soon reduced when some of the old wrought iron cylinders failed proof.
Then the Army went to .45 Govt/Schofield with even less.
In the 1880s the commercial powder charge was 35 grains.

I have read of people pulling down antique cartridges. They seem to have used a coarser grind of powder than is common now.

^^^ This is the same load I use for play/plinking.(35gn) Only difference is I use Olde Eynsford FFFG instead of Schuetzen. Even if I load 2.5cc 40 grains I do not need a powder drop tube. A funnel in the powder thru belling die and tapping it out lets the powder pack itself with room to seat into a compressed charge.

The original Frankford Arsenal .45 Colt loads used by the US Army did not contain 40 grains of black powder. The charge was 30 grains.

The original UMC loads used a 40 grain powder charge with a 255 grn bullet. The Army had it reduced to 35 grain charge and later the 28 grain charge (and 230 grn bullet) eqaulivent to the 45 Schofeld round.

Either powder charge/bullet combo was nothing to sneeze that's for sure!

When I load my plinking rounds with 35 grn charges and then my historical loads to 40 grains I cannot realistically tell a difference in recoil or point of impact from the two.

It is not proper to suggest that 4F powder be only used for priming flinters. Such tomfoolery is the policy of lawyers and insurance companies.

In the 1860s, Hazard's Pistol Powder was of the same granulation as today's 4F black powder. It was loaded to about 1/10 of bullet weight. So a 216 grain .44 caliber picket bullet would be propelled by about 21-22 grains of 4F.

Ever wonder why the little Pocket Colt was so popular back in the day when it bounces off pine boards today? Hazard's Pistol Powder.

That being said, I believe that such only applies to cap and ball revolvers. It is my understanding that the original Remington .45 Long Colt loads used 40 grains of 2F powder giving the bullet about 1000 fps. Cases of today have slightly less capacity around the primer and folks substitute 3F.

The original Frankford Arsenal .45 Colt loads used by the US Army did not contain 40 grains of black powder. The charge was 30 grains.

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Howdy Again

That looks almost the same as my box of Frankford Arsenal cartridges.





As I believe has already been mentioned, it was discovered early on that 40 grains of powder was too much for the Malleable Iron cylinders of the very early Colts, so the charge was reduced to 30 grains for the Army. But later commercial cartridges did hold 40 grains of powder, and later Colts had steel cylinders that could handle the charge.