The dreaded muzzle *brake* thread, with a twist

(Now, I know 223 recoil is not objectionable and lest the pansy comments begin, I also know that brakes can really help keep muzzle deflection to a minimum to assist quick followup shots.)

Click to expand...

What recoil? Seriously, there is markedly less recoil from an AR in .223 than from my nitro-piston .177 air rifle.

If your .223 gas gun is "kicking", there are other things to fix before a muzzle brake.

What do you guys think of the Noveske KX3 "Thunderpig" compensator on a 16" barrel? Does it make any difference in perceived recoil or muzzle deflection?

Click to expand...

The flaming pig does nothing for recoil; It changes the sound signature and directs blast forward. Honestly, if anything, I expect the design could potentially increase felt recoil, though you really can't tell with 5.56mm.

True muzzle brakes direct blast outward and backward, literally pulling the gun forward with basically directed propulsion. They also increase blast significantly. If you're ver shot a braked centerfire rifle without ear protection, you don't want to do it twice. This is why I just deal with the recoil of my 8mm Mag, .350 Mag and .375 Ultra; When sighting in, I use a lead sled. I'd much rather tolerate the recoil of a couple shots in the field than blow out my eardrums.

If you're holding a rifle properly and don't have some kind of physiological predisposition to retina damage (like diabetes), it really takes quite a bit. Honestly not something I've concerned myself with, and that 7-1/2 pound .375 with my top loads comes back with 82 ft/lbs of recoil-roughly 3.5 times that of a .30-06. And though less than the RUM, the 8mm Mag, the .350 Mag and .45-70 are not exactly soft shooters.

The reason 16" 5.56 barrels are so loud is because powder burn is continuing after the 16"s, the barrel isnt long enough to optimize the complete charge. I can shoot my 24" braked 7mm rem mag next to 16" ar's and they are much louder. You are adding inches with a muzzle brake, might as well go with a 20" barrel and get better ballistics and less noise.

Yeah, the KX3 is a muzzle booster, designed to increase bore back pressure and help rifles cycle that have little barrel length past the gas port.

There are much better brakes, if you need one.

BSW

And I thought the 'twist' was spelling BRAKE correctly...

A .223 does not kick. A .223 will not detach your retina. Hitting a cement wall doing 100mph in an automobile will detach your retina.

I've been around people shooting KX3s, they are not ear safe.

Also, since it increases back pressure, it would cause over gassing in a rifle that didn't need it.

BSW

I have not shot one of the KX3's so I cannot comment, but if it redirects noise and blast to the front of the rifle, I wonder whether it would be safe to shoot without muffs?

Click to expand...

Not in the immediate vicinity of the rifle, no.

On my 7.5", we found that if you're 20-25 feet behind the shooter, the noise level is reduced enough to not be offensive without ear protection. As you start moving around the side, though, it's a widening parabolic arc; The closer you get to being perpendicular to the muzzle, the further away you need to be for ears to be safe. If you're 90* to muzzle, you need about triple the distance as directly behind. Can't tell you how far if you start to move forward of the firing line; We don't do that!

The Claymore was about the same.

They are a dramatic improvement over a flashhider. While they do nothing to reduce recoil, the reduction in blast perceived by the shooter makes the rifle seem gentler. With muffs on (I use Peltor Bullseye 7s), the amount of noise I perceive is like firing a suppressed .22 (same for the 7.5 W/KX3, 12.5 W/Claymore and 16" W/Claymore).

The only firearm I have a true brake on is my Armalite AR-50, and it needs it. Believe me, though, the blast coming off the sides and a bit to the rear of that thing is no joke. It knocks stuff off the bench.

Also, since it increases back pressure, it would cause over gassing in a rifle that didn't need it.

Click to expand...

You could remove the cone, and you'd still get the blast directing effect without the backpressure increase. Of course, if you're gonna do that, might as well get the $40 knock-off instead of the $130 KX3.

adelbridge said:

The reason 16" 5.56 barrels are so loud is because powder burn is continuing after the 16"s, the barrel isnt long enough to optimize the complete charge. I can shoot my 24" braked 7mm rem mag next to 16" ar's and they are much louder. You are adding inches with a muzzle brake, might as well go with a 20" barrel and get better ballistics and less noise.

Click to expand...

The gases from the powder burning are still expanding and the pressure is higher at 16" than 20" but the powder has quit burning in any significant way before the bullet has traveled 6" down the barrel regardless of barrel length. The shorter barrel is louder because the residual pressure is higher, nothing more. And you'll find that if you place a sound meter at your head position, the 7mm is significantly louder. The .223 seems louder because of its pitch.

And you'll find that if you place a sound meter at your head position, the 7mm is significantly louder. The .223 seems louder because of its pitch.

Click to expand...

On that point, though, decibels are only part of the equation. Frequency and duration matter. Two noises of the same DB, the one with a sharper pitch is probably more offensive to our ears, and more damaging.

I get good laughs when I hear about recoil causing a detached retina. It would seem to me the retina was already begining to detach and the recoil just jarred it looser. My father had one and it happened when he was walking. According to the doctor it can happen to anyone, esp. the elderly, at any time for no reason at all. He just noticed his periphrial vison on his right side went away.

If a .223 can detach your retinas, you have the world's worse case of bulging eyeballs.

The most effective brake I''ve used is on my Scar17. That thing will "shake the outhouse"!

MachIVshooter said:

On that point, though, decibels are only part of the equation. Frequency and duration matter. Two noises of the same DB, the one with a sharper pitch is probably more offensive to our ears, and more damaging.

Click to expand...

More offensive, certainly. More damaging, that depends.

RPRNY said:

What recoil? Seriously, there is markedly less recoil from an AR in .223 than from my nitro-piston .177 air rifle.

If your .223 gas gun is "kicking", there are other things to fix before a muzzle brake.

Click to expand...

Even a .223/5.56 rifle has recoil, and that recoil acts to slow down your next shot(s) via muzzle rise, if nothing else.

Less recoil = faster shooting. Put a .22lr upper (or conversion) into your AR and shoot for time...let me know if you shoot 5.56 as quickly/accurately as .22lr...because you would be the first.



But detached retina...lolwhat? I don't think so.

If you want a good *brake* to decrease recoil, look into a competition compensator. The JP Titan is a good one, and Battle Comp makes some decent ones as well, but they are more for a "tactical" type rifle than a competition rifle.

I use Stags 3G compensator on my AR, and am going to be running a Battle Comp 1.0 in a match tomorrow to see how it compares.

PWS also makes some good muzzle brakes....but don't be standing near the shooter cause they are loud....

If I'm not mistaken, my SCAR 17 has a PWS. Great for reducing recoil. Not so great for shooters to the side of me.

If I'm not mistaken, my SCAR 17 has a PWS. Great for reducing recoil. Not so great for shooters to the side of me.

Click to expand...

Yep. I have a friend who runs one and I stand well away when he gets shooting...

Muzzle brakes are definitely a good way to discourage people from being close to you.

They generally are not friendly to anybody next to you on the line. The last one I by...felt like I was getting hit in the head by a rubber mallet...and that was 5.56 outdoors in the open

The PWS brake are very effective. They are also very loud and 'blasty'.

I sometimes RO at our local rifle matches. I hate it when a shooter with a PWS brake comes up because the blast from them makes my teeth hurt.

The only brake that comes close to being that bad that I see regularly is the Bushmaster Mini-Y comp. Those are also obnoxious.

BSW