3" vs 4" Barrel Compact 1911

[mnw42]

My 70 Series Gold Cup will feed damn near any thing. I have seen, and shot many an old USGI gun and very few of them had problems feeding much of anything. If they did balk on ammo nine time out of ten it could be traced to a wooped magazine. As it has been explained to me and I have observed, the 1911 is more or less controlled round feed. If Colt could get the Government Model to work with .38 special wad cutters and a standard unramped barrel then I don't think that rapped barrel is all that necessary.

On a compact pistol, on the other hand, this may not be the case.

If I recall the 1911 was designed around the .45 ACP. A friend of mine has a Llima (?) .380 that in nearly respect is a scaled 1911 - including the .380 ACP chambering and is 98% reliable. The smaller you go the harder it is to engineer something to work. Timing has to be more precise 100% of the time, yet tolerate variance in ammunition and environment. A 5" gun has (as designed) a larger margin for these factors than a smaller variant.

I believe this is why most of the sub-compacts sell for over a grand. The greater precision in design and operation requires a greater amount of precision in production. Something that you could get away with producing a 5" gun would have a greater effect on a smaller one.

 

[kashton]

god forbid you buy a 3 inch

 

[1911 guy]

Several month old mis-type.

I have been taken to task on a misprint. The standard test length for a .45acp barrel is 5", not the 4" I accidentally fat-fingered.

You know, there are more myths and misconceptions about the 1911 than you can shake a stick at.

I think I'm going to retire to my little corner of the world where nobody minds if I shoot 5" guns, JHP's and other assorted things that work.

 

[protector 6062]

Please forgive me for puking this thread up again. The technology research and development over the last 7 years may have changed this dramatically. As I have been a member here for a long time but don't post much I wonder IF the opinions of many have changed? I do put a great degree of faith in the opinions of Tuner, Fluff and 1911 Guy if any of them are still on the site and with us (please be on our side of the dirt) would you please weight in on this issue again. If you can and do I'll dance with you at your next wedding LOL. I have an important decision to make that will be costly for my children and grandbabies or maybe a future Sheriff in my county.

 

[Evil-Twin]

I can add some input. I carry a 3 " Kimber ultra carry... I carry it to do a specific job.. Protect me and my family from an attack. since no one gets attacked from 30 or forty yards away. Most muggings or robberies occur at close quarters ( under 21 feet ) statistically )... most muggings and robberies are over in less than 30 seconds ( statistically. ) Ive had two civilian assaults on me ( one ) and once with the family.. Both encounters were within the statistical perimeters. One was 30 years ago, and the other was 25 years ago. I came out on top both times.
Ive been carrying for 50 years, the last 35 years as a civilian.. I carry a 3" Kimber ultra carry.. IM 70 years old.. I practice 3 times a month ( 60 rounds total ) just to keep my edge, muscle tone, and muscle memory... I have many carry guns, but I do not change my EDC or my EDC load...every carry gun I have bought, has been an upgrade from the previous one. I practice with the same defense load I carry. The 3 inch Kimber is easily concealed in my front pocket ( IM a big guy with larger than average pockets, and not a slave to fashion. ) a slim guy could not carry this gun in this manner.
For me the 3" Kimber is perfect, for carry comfort and lightning fast deployment..
At 21 feet

 

[captainamerica]

I agree with your reasons. My snub and 380 are not without limits but I understand the odds and accept reality could be different. That's the reason I am interested in a 3.3" XDS-45.

 

[protector 6062]

Thank you EvilTwin and CaptAmerica your experience has helped me with a difficult decision. I hope some the older mainly gunsmiths would chime in. In the beginning of this thread a non-shooting war existed and 3 of the members like that convinced me not to go under 5". But after 7-8 years of refinement I hoped their opinions might have been changed. Your input does put a different slant on my thought process, thanks again.

 

[Zerodefect]

I recommend the Dan Wesson ECO for a 3" 1911.



The Colt and DW CCO's are nice as well. I'll never recommend a Kimber 3". Sadly, my Glock 23 fills the roll of a 4" 1911, perfectly, for me.

 

[Evil-Twin]

IM new to this forum, and have already broken some rules

This is a great forum, and its hard to acclimated to the rules... considering many other gun forums are the Low road ( in my opinion )..and just surviving in those forums is challenging.

Again IM not sure if I'm breaking any rules.. but as a Photographer, ( 50 year hobby ) I like to offer photographs to better illustrate my comments ( visual aids always help ) so with that in mind, Ill offer a few photos So the OP can see a 3" 45 ACP 1911 in actual use for concealment and deployment.

this is my EDC and EDC load



Side by side with my Bersa 380 ACP for size comparison ( many people choose a 380 acp as a good conceal weapon ) Note the Kimber and the Bersa are about the same physical size and weight.



Remember I said IM a fairly big guy so my cloths have large pockets... I carry the same weapon summer and winter, I practice with the same load I carry for personal defense
IM left handed the Kimber is in my left pocket



IN my jeans ( note! I left the grip slightly visible for this shot to show that its in there ) IN a Mikes # 3 modified pocket holster... Normally it sits deeper in the pocket and completely out of view.



When I feel uncomfortable with my surroundings ( being aware of your surroundings is the first step in personal defense ) I just put my hand in my pocket, and I appear to be an old guy walking with his hand in his pocket. If the situation changes, I can just take my hand out of my pocket and no one is the wiser.



Deployment





My effort here was to help the OP, with some visual aids.. If I broke any rules.. please remove the post ...with my apologies

 

[BlindJustice]

Velocity loss with a 1911 and less than 4" Bbl. len. is significantly more
than goinng from a 5" to a 4.25"/4" bbl. len.

Ref.: ballistics By The Inch BBTI

Concealed carry - the Compact Officers frame
regarless of barrel len. is easier to Conceal. The
smaller frame means 1 less rd in the Mag. Stock
is 6 rds, but Wilson Combat makes a 7 Rd with lo-
profile base plate.

My EDC

Springfield Armory Range Offficer Compact which has
the 4" bbl/Slide, on an Officers Alloy frame for a 28 oz
empty weight. No FTF/FTE after 350 rds.

Randall

 

[Walkalong]

god forbid you buy a 3 inch

Why am I always the last one to find out these things.

It's been flawless so far. I have replaced the slide stop and the thumb safety with Wilson products, and added a metal magwell/mainspring housing.

 

[Evil-Twin]

Why am I always the last one to find out these things.

It's been flawless so far. I have replaced the slide stop and the thumb safety with Wilson products, and added a metal magwell/mainspring housing.

As I said earlier...I do not switch my EDC to accommodate my attire... I carry one gun, and one load...I practice with the same gun and the same load every week. When I was younger, I use to select a carry gun based on what I was wearing.. now that IM old...IM smart enough to know that you don't have the time to figure out which weapon you are carrying that day, in the mille second you hope will make the difference...
The down side of the Kimber ( at least for me ) is it makes all my other carry guns obsolete, and pale by comparison.

 

[WC145]

I recommend the Dan Wesson ECO for a 3" 1911.



The Colt and DW CCO's are nice as well. I'll never recommend a Kimber 3". Sadly, my Glock 23 fills the roll of a 4" 1911, perfectly, for me.

The DW ECO makes for an even better 3.5" 1911 than it does a 3".

I prefer the original Officers ACP size frame and 3.5" barrel (like the DW ECO) when it comes to compact 1911s. They balance and feel better to me than 3" guns and 4"-4.25" CCO style pistols. I have a custom Colt 1991A1 Compact that has been an outstanding carry gun, as well as a lightweight Springfield Ultra Compact 9mm 1911 and it is also an excellent carry piece. Were I in the market today I would not hesitate to purchase an ECO.

 

[Bama Drifter]

Wow... hate posting on 8yr old thread! But did the OP end up happy w/ new 1911 purchase? IIRC Colt offered a unique hybrid called the "Commanding Officer" model years back. It was a Commander frame w/ Officer ACP slide. Then another short run called "Concealed Carry Officer" which made the most sense (put a Commander slide on the Officer frame). The grip is really the part we are trying to conceal; so to me, a bobbed Gov't size works best. Just my $.02 & sorry I'm a late addition to this dead horse thread
YMMV