357sig w/RMR 124gr MW shot from a Ransom Rest

[Blue68f100]

Did a retest on my 357sig load using Herco and RMR 124gr MW, 1.140" OAL, Shot out of my 1911

72F, wind 10-15 to my back

This little sig round pack a punch. My Ransom rest was tilting back so far it was not auto reset. I had to give it a nudge to go back down.

Starling Brass (new, resized)
WSP
Herco Dispensed using RCBS 1500
1.140" OAL

I'm getting low on Herco powder so only 5 shot groups
Crony data on target
BE is 2" dia, 1" outer rings
Distance 25 yrds

7.7 gr Herco


7.8 gr Herco


7.9gr Herco


8.0gr Herco the winner of this test.


8.1 gr Herco starts to open up


I have a little run to go up if I need to but stopped here.

I'm getting some vertical shifting in my groups which I need to track down the cause.

I have 200 of the 8.0 gr loaded so I will get more data as I shoot them on consistency.

 

[LiveLife]

Thanks for continuing ransom rest tests and posting Herco data.

I liked Herco for 40S&W which burned clean, even inside the case and produced good accuracy. Besides BE-86, Herco would be my number three powder for 40S&W right behind WSF.

 

[WrongHanded]

Crony data on target
BE is 2" dia, 1" outer rings
Distance 25'

Feet, or yards?

 

[Blue68f100]

Feet, or yards?

25 yrds

I have steel targets setup at 100 yrds but have not shot at them with the rest.

 

[fxvr5]

You can't tell much with 5-shot groups. Try 20-shot groups.

 

[WrongHanded]

25 yrds

I have steel targets setup at 100 yrds but have not shot at them with the rest.

Nice!

 

[Blue68f100]

You can't tell much with 5-shot groups. Try 20-shot groups.

I prefer a 10 shot group to screen, then step up the round count. But like I said in my original post I'm running low on this Herco Powder. The reason I only shot 5 shot groups.

 

[vaalpens]

Thanks for sharing. I definitely think you can do better than Herco for accuracy.

The grouping you have for Herco 8.0 looks like around 1.21".

The best I have done at 25yards without a Ransom Rest was 1.12" using an 147gr RMR plated bullet and CFE Pistol. At 15 yards with the RMR 147gr MW bullet I have seen .5"/.51" groupings using CFE Pistol. With the 124gr MW bullet my most accurate load is using Unique, with a 1.215" grouping at 25 yards and a .478" grouping at 15 yards.

 

[Blue68f100]

Probably so. I'm still tweaking on my rest as I find things that needing fixing. I'm also limited by the powders I have to work with. This barrel has only had a little over 500 rounds through it.

Your loads at 15 rds will almost double at 25 yrds. And as we all know just because a cretin combo shoots well at close range does not mean it will out further.

 

[jmorris]

Are you loading 6 and shooting 5 shot groups?

If not you might try that and see if that eliminates the single flyer.

 

[Laphroaig]

It's nice to see the 124 Match winners shoot consistently. Five round groups or not they all mostly held the 2" bull. That's pretty good accuracy at 25 yds.in my book. Thanks for sharing.

 

[vaalpens]

Probably so. I'm still tweaking on my rest as I find things that needing fixing. I'm also limited by the powders I have to work with. This barrel has only had a little over 500 rounds through it.

Your loads at 15 rds will almost double at 25 yrds. And as we all know just because a cretin combo shoots well at close range does not mean it will out further.

Nothing is linear, but I convert all my grouping to a 10 yard grouping so I can compare the different results. Even though a 25yd 1.12" is the same as a 15yd .67", the 25yd result is still better in my books. My testing is done without a ransom rest and with a 3.9" barrel, so your 1911 with a 5" barrel should really shine with the 357sig.

Keep us posted with your results. I am always interested in seeing how accurate the 357sig can perform.

 

[Blue68f100]

Are you loading 6 and shooting 5 shot groups?

If not you might try that and see if that eliminates the single flyer.

No, I loaded 5 in the magazine, Insert, lower arm into fire position, release the slide. Then start shooting. The gun should shoot them to the same POI if built right. The 357sig recoil is moving the arm up more than the 9mm and it's not auto resetting. I have to nudge it to fall back down. So that is one area I need to work on. I'm shooing around a bunch of oak trees and their dropping there tassels as I was shooting. I've caught leaf specs under the arm resting spot on the base. Hopefully the raised and smaller contact area will prevent this from happening. May have to add a limiter to jeep it from rotating too far up.

I'm going to setup a spotting scope the next time to see if it's the 1st shoot or not.

I'm modifying my ransom reset. Add the elevation adj to the front. Installed a 410 SS plug for the SS 3/8-24 tpi adjuster to contact. I also noticed that the rotation of the assembly is happening at 3 different locations, so I fixed that.

 

[fxvr5]

No, I loaded 5 in the magazine, Insert, lower arm into fire position, release the slide. Then start shooting. The gun should shoot them to the same POI if built right. The 357sig recoil is moving the arm up more than the 9mm and it's not auto resetting. I have to nudge it to fall back down. So that is one area I need to work on. I'm shooing around a bunch of oak trees and their dropping there tassels as I was shooting. I've caught leaf specs under the arm resting spot on the base. Hopefully the raised and smaller contact area will prevent this from happening. May have to add a limiter to jeep it from rotating too far up.

I'm modifying my ransom reset. Add the elevation adj to the front. Installed a 410 SS plug for the SS 3/8-24 tpi adjuster to contact. I also noticed that the rotation of the assembly is happening at 3 different locations, so I fixed that.

A Ransom Rest has an auto reset?

The Ransom Rest comes with a elevation adjustment to the front, doesn't it?

 

[Blue68f100]

This is one I built, still fine tuning it.

https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...ersion-of-a-ransom-rest.904119/#post-12261988

 

[fxvr5]

This is one I built, still fine tuning it.

https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...ersion-of-a-ransom-rest.904119/#post-12261988

I see. It's not a Ransom Rest. Why did you lie and say it was?

 

[JimKirk]

Those velocities are mild coming from a 5" barrel with a 357 SIG ...

Longshot powder will bump that speed on up to 1450/75 fps using the RMR MPR 124 grain and a 4.5" barrel Glock 31 .... IMR 800x will bump it another 20/30 fps .... both these powders yield these velocity with lower max pressure over many of the other powders ...

I can get the 147 grain Hornady XTP to the same 1300+ fps with 800x ...

Only draw back ...800 x does not meter well.

 

[jmorris]

Ah, I forgot about your rest build thread. I thought you were using a Ransom too.

They have a ~ 5 coil 1.87 wire spring on them compressed to under 1.5” giving around 139 lbs of force pushing the two parts together, creating friction/resistance to rotation. They don’t just flop around.

Do you have a 22 upper for a 1911?

 

[Blue68f100]

Those velocities are mild coming from a 5" barrel with a 357 SIG ...

Longshot powder will bump that speed on up to 1450/75 fps using the RMR MPR 124 grain and a 4.5" barrel Glock 31 .... IMR 800x will bump it another 20/30 fps .... both these powders yield these velocity with lower max pressure over many of the other powders ...

I can get the 147 grain Hornady XTP to the same 1300+ fps with 800x ...

Only draw back ...800 x does not meter well.

Once things settle down I will try some different powders. But for right now I have to use what I have.

The 800 has been discontinued if I recall.

 

[Blue68f100]

Ah, I forgot about your rest build thread. I thought you were using a Ransom too.

They have a ~ 5 coil 1.87 wire spring on them compressed to under 1.5” giving around 139 lbs of force pushing the two parts together, creating friction/resistance to rotation. They don’t just flop around.

Do you have a 22 upper for a 1911?

I'm using Bellville springs to hold the tension on the arm. I can set it so it will return to ready position or I can add pressure so it just rotates up. Just rotating up is what it was doing with the 357 sig. loads. With the 9mm it would rotate up then fall back down, auto reset for the next round without me touching anything. I think I found the source of my horz shift, was rotating on a non trued surface, fixed. The vertical shifts I was picking up time to time was all the dust/debree blowing around and coming from the trees landing under the stop. I'm hoping with the adjuster and raised steel pad to contact this will be fixed.

I do not have a 22 upper for my 1911's. I've looked at getting one but, never did.

 

[jmorris]

The vertical shifts I was picking up time to time was all the dust/debree blowing around and coming from the trees landing under the stop.

May be a good reason to up your tension a bit so it doesn’t fall back to the stop on its own, make it harder than aluminum and make it a smaller contact area.

The large area makes sense if you are worried about peening the aluminum as you have a lot of surface area of contact.



On mine I used a bolt head, turned completely flat and locked into the threads in the base plate, it doubles as the point of rotation for the rear windage adjustment.

The rounded face of the adjuster gives a much smaller point of contact between the two.

But the bottom contact needs to be large enough to cover the range of elevation adjustment you want it to have.

Down.


and up.


An increase in tension, that doesn’t let it “auto return”, will also keep surfaces from hammering against one another.

 

[Buck13]

I see. It's not a Ransom Rest. Why did you lie and say it was?

That seems a little harsh. I see him as using the term to make clear that this is a mechanical rest, not hand-holding on sandbags. Doesn't look like a sincere attempt to be dishonest. Maybe removing the capitalization would satisfy you? Or writing "ransom-type rest?"

Admittedly, no telling if this setup is as consistent shot-to-shot as a Ransom Rest, but...

 

[Buck13]

Those velocities are mild coming from a 5" barrel with a 357 SIG ...

Longshot powder will bump that speed on up to 1450/75 fps using the RMR MPR 124 grain and a 4.5" barrel Glock 31 .... IMR 800x will bump it another 20/30 fps .... both these powders yield these velocity with lower max pressure over many of the other powders ...

I can get the 147 grain Hornady XTP to the same 1300+ fps with 800x ...

Only draw back ...800 x does not meter well.

IMHO, Longshot doesn't meter all that brilliantly. Maybe it's my measure, but I get lots of charges that are +/- 0.1 grain from the goal weight. 0.2 grains out of 5 or 6 seems like a pretty large percentage. 800x is much worse?

 

[Lennyjoe]

800x is much worse?

You cannot throw 800X out of a Autodisc or even an evenflow with good accuracy. I use a Frankfort Arsenal electronic powder dispenser for my 800X loads. It’s time consuming but 800 X is a great powder, especially for 10MM.

 

[JimKirk]

IMHO, Longshot doesn't meter all that brilliantly. Maybe it's my measure, but I get lots of charges that are +/- 0.1 grain from the goal weight. 0.2 grains out of 5 or 6 seems like a pretty large percentage. 800x is much worse?

My Uniflow throws Longshot pretty much dead on ....

800x gets metered low and trickled up to dead on ... It is still the velocity/pressure best for 357 SIG with 124 & 147 grain bullets ...