.38 super or 10mm for defense?

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maybe ill just be really different, and go with 7.62x25mm, same energy as these other cartridges, with higher velocity, flatter shooting... basically a .38 super necked down to 7.62mm.... more energy than the 5.7x28mm as well, with a shorter barrel... put a really short pointed 30 caliber bullet on that and you have the makings of a PDW cartridge
 
maybe ill just be really different, and go with 7.62x25mm, same energy as these other cartridges, with higher velocity, flatter shooting... basically a .38 super necked down to 7.62mm.... more energy than the 5.7x28mm as well, with a shorter barrel... put a really short pointed 30 caliber bullet on that and you have the makings of a PDW cartridge
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The problem with the 7.62x25 for defense isn't the round, it's the guns.

And it comes up well short of 10mm in the energy department; Even in a 4" gun, it can be well over 700 ft/lbs.
 
Nothing at all wrong with 7,62x25, but you're back to handloading your rounds. From the choices you mention, 10mm is really the only option if you want to use mostly factory ammo.
 
I would go with the 10MM. I don't own a 9MM becasue I started handgun defense with the .380 and then went directly to the 45 Automatic. When the 10MM came out I had to have that power in a 1911 gun. So, I never got into the 9MMs for self defense (I know the .380 is a 9MM short). So now my defense guns are in 40, 45 and 10MM. I reload so ammo is not an issue for practice. I like the larger diameter bullets and feel they have more to offer.
 
hmm... this 7.62x25mm cartridge i found (factory prvi partizan load) has a muzzle energy of 560ft/lbs... that beats out 9mm, 40S&W and 45acp about equals the .38 super, but is still beaten by 9x23 winchester and 10mm... but would offer better accuracy and penetration... might be a nice survival load and i bet would be pretty effective on small game, while offering the penetration for larger animals in an emergency...

ill certainly put this one on the list to consider, and unlike the 9x23 winchester, ive actually found a few 7.62x25mm barrels for the 1911 if i didnt want to go with a surplus tokarev or CZ-52, though, the CZ-52 im guessing is fairly accurate in comparizon, due to a fixed barrel..

as long as theres one suitable factory load for CCW purposes, im comfortable reloading for everything else...
 
Why would it be any more accurate? What bullet design is it tipped with? If it's not a known quantity bullet like the Gold Dot, HST, Ranger-T, or Golden Saber, how does it do on ballistics tests?
 
I'm certainly not recommending anyone do this but why not just get a Hi-Point in one of the three calibers and load the case up to the brim with bullseye and top with your flavor of war hammer? They did this with a 9 on utube (well, whatever constitutes multiple "blue pills") and then pounding a bolt down the barrel while keeping the slide from operating via vices/straps and or anvils.
 
not neccessarily more accurate, but certainly flatter shooting due to a much higher velocity
 
i carry my 1968 Super LWC.....you can run the Super up to 357mag speed in 9+1.....i'm runnin' Montana Gold 125gr JHP'S at a little under 1400fps with a 20# RCS.....muzzle flash is kind of bright in low light and sure turns some heads at the range:what:

9qe0bn.jpg
 
You know Coonan Arms makes a 5" 1911 chambered in .357 magnum. Or you could look into a Sig with a 4" bbl in .357 sig.

I don't know, it seems like there are simpler solutions. Of course maybe that's what you enjoy. Personally, I carry a revolver for survival.
 
hmm.. one thing that makes me interested in 10mm... which actually goes back historically to the early 1900s... when john browning and colt were designing the original 1911 prototype, they at first intended it to fire a .41 caliber cartridge they were working on, which fired a .400" projectile but the military wanted .45acp due to their experience with .45lc... something makes me think this original .41 caliber cartridge would have been closer to the performance of a modern .40S&W though..

does anyone have anymore data on this prototype cartridge that never came to be?
 
im going to start another thread.. just to probe the history and try to find information of this mystery cartridge
 
for reasons ive recently discovered.. i think 10mm will by my ultimate choice.. but before i drop the cash on the parts for a custom piece.. i have to ask something else...

.38 ACP, and .38 super have roughly the same dimensions, however, .38 ACP from looking at a manual actually has a thicker case wall to it.... is there any reason its less powerful than .38 super at the same length, or are they just made different so one dont mistaken the much hotter loads in the super and load it into an older, possibly weaker .38ACP firearm?
 
After reading all the previous posts I have to jump in with my opinion. Having owned and shot various 9MM's and the Colt Delta Elite in 10 MM, I'm of the conclusion the way to go is the 10MM, if you can handle it. One good thing about this big 10 is that it's a handloader's dream. You may load it down for practice or plinking loads or load it to factory specs for carry or defense. One disadvantage of the 10MM however is lack of many different factory loads or on dealer's shelves...not a problem with 9MM. For the record I own 2 10MM's...both Colt Delta Elites. :)
 
I think this will work in most guns where the mags are compatible, but it is possible to put a .38 Super barrel and mag in a 10mm 1911 style gun and have it work as it should. I have done this to several Delta and custom 10mm (Caspian frame), and they shoot just like they were made as .38 Supers. If Glock ever makes a mag that would work in the G20 or 29 with .38 Super, a barrel replacement might work in those guns, too.
 
I think this will work in most guns where the mags are compatible, but it is possible to put a .38 Super barrel and mag in a 10mm 1911 style gun and have it work as it should.
Click to expand...

Don't foget the barrel bushing.

.38 Super being semi-rimmed, it is very close to the 10mm rim diameter (about 0.020" difference, IIRC), so extraction shouldn't be an issue.
 
yeah.. i think ill end up going 10mm... it does seem to offer a lot of flexibility... could load it down like a .40S&W i guess.... but i have quite large hands, and recoil doesnt bother me as much.. so i guess the important thing for 10mm would just be finding a load with superior expansion to reduce the likeliness of overpenetration if carried as a CCW handgun

the pistol this will be fired from will no doubt be a single-stack, 4" 1911 ill build myself from parts.. fixed sights of course... actually, if this was a CCW only pistol, i wouldnt put any sights on it as im a strong believer for CCW, you may, or may not have time to aim, so i train more for instinctive shooting for close range... but since i want to use it for outdoors defense as well, and possibly a survival pistol it helps to have atleast fixed sights
 
I've noticed that if 1911 barrels are "standard OD diameter", they seem to work in similarly "standard" ID barrel bushings, i.e., you may be able to use the 10mm bushing with the conversion .38 Super barrel.
 
im rather utilitarian when it comes to things like this.. so the final product would look little more than a military 1911
 
hmm, wouldnt be so sure on bigger hole, ive seen 9mms expand to close to .75" in ballistics testing.. of course, ive seen .40S&W expand to about the same diameter.. no idea how 10mm velocities would effect this
 
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