6.5 Grendel vs the .243 what would you rather have?

[fpgt72]

I always thought the lines of the A1 are iconic and aesthetically pleasing.

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Polymer and metal, an abstract composition.

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I was about to post:

You can't get them in the same gun if you want an AR platform as you are going to go large frame for the 243 and small frame for the Grendel.


Between the two I would go Grendel.

Beauty is personal....this is why some guys like fat chicks.

As far as black rifles go I always had a thing for xm177 or CAR-15 here there same same.

Building something like that has got my interest from time to time but never did it, and any loose nut can screw one together...it aint hard.

Doubt I ever will, don't want to go to the hassle of messing with all the stupid paperwork to make one "right".

 

[old heeler]

I've been shooting 243 lot of years and I also have 243AI. I sure don't hate or dislike 6.5 as my last one was 6.5x284 Norma. They fire form 220 Russian for 22ppc/6ppc and you don't see any one fire form 220 Russian for 6.5 Grendel.

When they formed 22/6ppc they keep both same from base to start of the shoulder. When they took 220 Russian and formed 6.5 Grendel they changed case. I think Dakota owns right to 6ppc and no sure who own right to formed case.

6 Beggs and 220 Beggs

http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com...0-beggs-and-secrets-of-the-west-texas-tunnel/

 

[cougar1717]

The comparison is a "short action" cartridge to an "intermediate cartridge." I would rather have the 243. It's very versatile, with choices of bullets between 55gr to 108gr. It has the ability to be a varmint, light deer, or target caliber just by purchasing various the twist rates. High bc bullets are available for target shooting at distance. It has more powder too, and that is a good thing. I'm not trying to be macho, but if anyone complains about the recoil of a 243.............smh......I would nicely say that many men, women, and children have no problem sighting in, practicing, and taking a deer with their 243's.

The 6.5G is great for what it is, a longer distance cartridge as long as your parameters reside on a "platform." Open up a world of bolt actions, single shots, short and long action semi-autos, and there are better choices to take advantage of the ability to have a longer cartridge length.
Is 243, the best ever?....nope, but I'd rather have one than a 6.5G.

 

[Newtosavage]

I actually think the Grendel is a better bolt action cartridge than AR. What else delivers that kind of downrange energy with that little powder and recoil? I can't think of it.

 

[LoonWulf]

I actually think the Grendel is a better bolt action cartridge than AR. What else delivers that kind of downrange energy with that little powder and recoil? I can't think of it.

Pretty much anything with a similar capacity and bore size

Of common cartridges tho, the Grendel feels like best over the counter option.

I'm still seriously considering getting a grendel bolt gun. I have no real need for one, and I don't have my loading stuff anymore, but if I see one at a decent price it's going home with me (if I have my permit).

 

[cdb1]

I cast my vote for .243. Back when I was the Rabid Marsupial Control Officer in Alice Springs my vote might have been for 6.5 Grendel.

 

[Varminterror]

I actually think the Grendel is a better bolt action cartridge than AR. What else delivers that kind of downrange energy with that little powder and recoil? I can't think of it.

Pretty much anything with a similar capacity and bore size.

This is really what has been making the drive for development of so many new Mini-length 2.3” cartridges so rapid of late... there just aren’t that many rounds which satisfy the “I barely use any powder, but can still accomplish cool stuff” weight class. 20yrs ago, you had stuff like 221 Fireball and 22 Hornet, some 6PPC, 223 Rem, and 7.62x39mm but really not much in the way of cartridges which only swallowed about 25grn of powder to accomplish everything they ever needed. Today, there are dozens more cartridges in this case class opening doors for more and more shooters to get in on the game - and more and more rifles on the market to eat them.

~25yrs ago, I was content pouring ~60grns of powder into cases to run afield and kill whitetails at 0-400yrds. Today, I balk at using even 40grn to do the same job.

Even with all of these new rounds, there aren’t a great many analogies of the 6.5 Grendel on the market. The 6.5 and 6.8 hang out in the middlelands, without much company. Guys talk about the Wolverine and 7 Valkyrie, wildcats to the extreme, but really, there just aren’t many in the 6.5 Grendel’s case class.

What the 243win did fairly well, is shine the light on the fact killing deer doesn’t require a 180grn bullet at 2900fps. That opened the door for guys to realize how small, efficient cases could be employed to deliver similar killing performance to the slow twist, light bullet OG 243’s, and improve efficiency into tiny little 2.3” cartridges.

 

[someguy2800]

The reason I don't like the 243 is it falls into a no mans land for me where I just don't have any use for it. Its way more powerful than my preference for shooting coyotes or other varmints. As for medium game, if I'm buying and carrying a full size bolt action rifle I'd just as well get a 6.5C, 7-08, 308, ect... that are the same size and weight and give more authority and exit wounding on game. Its a popular round for low recoil shooters but its really in my opinion not an efficient solution to that problem because its way overbore and burns alot of powder for the bullet weight its pushing. I'd rather my recoil come from actually pushing a bullet rather than blasting 45 grains of gas out the end of a 22" barrel.

The 6.5 grendel doesn't really do that much for me either since for me it falls about at my minimum of what I'm comfortable with for deer due to my local conditions, but it is a nice efficient little cartridge that pushes more bullet weight. And it fits in an AR15 which is a platform I happen to like. I think it would be a nice coyote round since the lower velocity isn't going to be so destructive, and if you live somewhere where deer are typically 100-150 lbs it looks like a supurb little meat getter to me. Its a great match for that size of game.

 

[labnoti]

Pretty much anything with a similar capacity and bore size

I think there's something to the efficiency of shorter cases. Take the WSM's for example. So I'd say that it's not the capacity in volume, but the shape does have subtle effects. The In it's length-class, the Grendel is a larger diameter case (it pushes the limits of an AR15 bolt-face), it's less tapered than 7.62x39, it has a shoulder angle that makes good use of the length to gain volume, but volume in itself is not the only key. If a cartridge had the same volume but was long and pencil-thin, it wouldn't work nearly as well. Indeed we can see some efficiency is gained with even stouter cartridges like 6 BR or Dasher and especially the WSSM, but at some point, magazine capacity begins to suffer. Maybe with bolt-actions, that doesn't matter as much, but for MSR it's very significant.

 

[Newtosavage]

The reason I don't like the 243 is it falls into a no mans land for me where I just don't have any use for it. Its way more powerful than my preference for shooting coyotes or other varmints. As for medium game, if I'm buying and carrying a full size bolt action rifle I'd just as well get a 6.5C, 7-08, 308, ect... that are the same size and weight and give more authority and exit wounding on game. Its a popular round for low recoil shooters but its really in my opinion not an efficient solution to that problem because its way overbore and burns alot of powder for the bullet weight its pushing. I'd rather my recoil come from actually pushing a bullet rather than blasting 45 grains of gas out the end of a 22" barrel.

You said it better than I could.

 

[Varminterror]

I’ve come to be the opposite - I hunt deer walking 250-325 every winter, with opportunities for 400-800yrd shots (or 2,000yrds if so desired), but also opportunities where a deer running 50yrds means I won’t recover it without dogs. I’ve found I really don’t need more than a 6.5 Grendel/243win class of cartridges. Before my son was born, I spent between 80-100 days each year calling coyotes, filling a hell of a pile of furs every winter - I consistently found the 243win to be detrimental to fur value, and the 6.5Grendel only slightly more useful, taking the vast majority of my quarry with 50grn Vmax’s in 223rem.

The unique part of the 6.5 Grendel in that mix is the size of the rifle - a guy can run a lightweight mini action with a 20” barrel and do everything a deer hunter should ever be doing. I’ve often made the same argument - if I’m carrying a 24” short action rifle, I might as well have a 7-08 for a bit more insurance, but it won’t do anything a 243win won’t do either.

 

[Newtosavage]

Would be funny to see the results of this poll a generation from now. Old familiar calibers are hard to give up on. I'm guilty of it with my own 30-30.

 

[Hookeye]

I've killed hundreds of varmints with .243 win.
Works pretty good, maybe a little too much HP on chucks at times.
Shot one deer with .243 win, 50 yards............would not call it excessive.
Just whistled through.
Of course everybody else on the internet, shooting crap rifles w same ammo get a DRT ..........all the time.
Yeah right.

 

[Hookeye]

Yotes tomorrow...............toting my 700 ADL in...................243 win.

 

[Dr T]

6.5 G. I already have two 243's and a 6 mm Rem. But a CZ 527 in 6.5 G would be sort of nice.

 

[Legionnaire]

If I were starting from scratch, that might be a hard choice. But I've been a .243 and .243 AI fan for a while now, and see no reason to switch ... or add the Grendel.

 

[adcoch1]

If I were starting from scratch, that might be a hard choice. But I've been a .243 and .243 AI fan for a while now, and see no reason to switch ... or add the Grendel.

This is a very good point, and unless you want a mini action there isn't any reason to NOT get a 243. For myself I was looking for less powder per load for general use, and the Grendel made sense. I really think the choice comes down to what rifle its in.

 

[Newtosavage]

Yea, good point. Were we starting from scratch and not limited by necking up/down an already popular case, or fitting a round in a particular action length, then what would we end up with? My guess is something in-between the 6.5 Grendel and 7mm-08 would be designed from the ground up for a popular mild recoiling deer/hog hunting caliber, and something like the 7x57 AI or .284 Win for an all-around big game gun.

 

[Pat Riot]

I picked .243 because I can go to nearly any gun store or sporting goods store (that sells guns and ammo) and find it on a shelf.

 

[LoonWulf]

Just whistled through.
Of course everybody else on the internet, shooting crap rifles w same ammo get a DRT ..........all the time.
Yeah right.

Out of curiosity what ammo we're you shooting?

 

[Newtosavage]

I picked .243 because I can go to nearly any gun store or sporting goods store (that sells guns and ammo) and find it on a shelf.

A lot to be said for that if you don't hand load.

I have been surprised at the rate of adoption of the 6.5 CM. I see ammo for it at our local Wal-Marts, almost as well stocked as '06 and .243 nowdays.

 

[Goosey]

You said "the rifle is the same", so I'd have the 243.

 

[Varminterror]

Were we starting from scratch and not limited by necking up/down an already popular case, or fitting a round in a particular action length, then what would we end up with? My guess is something in-between the 6.5 Grendel and 7mm-08

6 Dasher is where I fall for "king of the small bores".

 

[Newtosavage]

Interesting little round. I'm not sold on 6mm 100-105 grain bullets for deer hunting, but many people have had good luck with them (including my daughter and her .243).

 

[LoonWulf]

Interesting little round. I'm not sold on 6mm 100-105 grain bullets for deer hunting, but many people have had good luck with them (including my daughter and her .243).

I'm comfortable with them, a 100gr 6mm will penetrate, and expand plenty well enough to anchor some pretty big stuff.

But I prefer bigger exit wounds than the 6mms, or slower 6.5s like the Grendel, will usually give. 3k and an extra 20-30gr of bullet blow pretty impressive holes in the normal stuff I shoot.