9mm 115g Berry's plated bullets.....

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Ok went to the range today and shot the loads I made yesterday along w/ a box of cheap winchester loads I got from wally world. I first shot the winchester loads out of my glock 34 and didn't have any problems w/ cycling and fairly accurate. I then shot the reloads i made and had one failure out of 17rnds. Better but not good enough. I still have some Berry's plated 115 bullets and some 700-x and hp-38 powder...anybody out there that uses that combo of supplies want to share a load that works really well in their pistol?
 
I still have some Berry's plated 115 bullets and some 700-x and hp-38 powder...anybody out there that uses that combo of supplies want to share a load that works really well in their pistol?
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I don't load 115 gr in plated bullet but use 4.8-4.9 gr for Winchester 115 gr FMJ (.355") at 1.125" OAL. Berry's bullets are sized to .3555" so I would use the lead load data to be on the safe side. Try 4.5-4.8 gr at 1.125" OAL.

Here's the load data from Hodgdon's website:
115 gr. LRN W231/HP-38 .356" OAL 1.100" Start 4.3 gr (1079 fps) - Max 4.8 gr (1135 fps)

115 gr. SPR GDHP W231/HP-38 .355" OAL 1.125" Start 4.7 gr (1075 fps) - Max 5.1 gr (1167 fps)
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FYI, you'll probably find that 124/125 gr plated bullets will cycle the stiffer recoil spring Glocks better than 115 gr and use less powder (around 4.3 gr of HP38).
 
J.L., could you let us know what gen. Glocks you have and what brand dies you're using? It would also be helpful to know what failures you're having, feed, fire, extraction.

At this point I'm wondering about your loading methods, no offense but Glocks have very forgiving chambers that feed most anything. With your OAL there shouldn't be any problems unless you're belling out the case mouths and not crimping them back down again (you mentioned using a light crimp). Some dies like Lee's 3-die set seat and crimp in one step and are doubly difficult to set up.

Any light you can shed would help.
 
The Glock 34 is a new gun I purchased it a couple of months ago (newest gen). The Glock 17 is a (i think) gen 3 used and is much more forgiving. Both guns run great w/ no failures at all w/ factory ammo. The problem I am having is extraction the shell getting stuck in the slide half way out (stovepipe) when using my reloads. I noticed when shooting the factory load the shells were flying alot further behind me while the loads I made were dropping on me or just next to me. I am using a lee turret press w/ a crimp die in the fourth spot. I have the seater dialed into seating the bullet to 1.135 currently and am using the crimp die at what I think is a light to med. crimp (I can JUST see where the crimp made its mark along the top of the shell). Any help is appreciated. I am starting to think either I need to get my hands on some titegroup or bullseye powder and try some of the loads that have been proven by other people. It doesnt seem like alot of people use the 700x or hp-38 for 9mm.
 
The problem I am having is extraction the shell getting stuck in the slide half way out (stovepipe) when using my reloads. I noticed when shooting the factory load the shells were flying alot further behind me while the loads I made were dropping on me or just next to me.
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Classic signs of not enough pressure to push the slide all the way back to reliably extract and cycle the slide. It's the stiff recoil spring. The problem is aggravated by the light bullet. With new Glocks, I often need to push the light 115 gr bullet to max load to properly cycle the new Glocks. Heavier 124/125 bullets will definitely help with reliably cycling the slide using mid-high load data.
I am starting to think either I need to get my hands on some titegroup or bullseye powder and try some of the loads that have been proven by other people. It doesnt seem like alot of people use the 700x or hp-38 for 9mm.
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Not at all. You need more pressure. I have used even faster Bullseye, Promo and W231/HP38 and Greed Dot, which are all fast burning powders with great results in my Glocks (Gen3), even with stiffer recoil springed G27. Use more powder (up to max load data at the specified OAL - I use 1.125" for 115 gr) or use the heavier 124/125 plated bullet.
 
Your load is underpowered. No reason you cannot make fully functional loads with 700X or W-231 loading the Berrys 115 Gr RN at 1.130 to 1.135 O.A.L..

It takes more power to get the same velocity with plated bullets as it does with lead.

The Midway PDF I linked to shows up to 4.3 Grs 700X or 4.5 Grs W-231 with a Ranier 115 Gr plated bullet. No reason in the world not to use that with the Berrys.

If 4.3 Grs of 700X and that Berrys 115 Gr RN @ 1.130 won't function in your Glock I would be very surprised, but then I don't have a Glock either. Do you have any check weights to verify what your scale is showing?

Some dies like Lee's 3-die set seat and crimp in one step and are doubly difficult to set up.
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Nonsense. Any one who can't set up a seater/crimper in 9MM to do both things in the same step in doesn't need to be reloading. Very simple.
 
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Read the post Mr. Grumpy, I'd guess we are advising a relatively new reloader and often times things like a multi-function die are not apparent.

As for your suggestion, well the MidWay chart is off the chart according to every other chart and according to Berry's. If everything were as simple as add more powder there would be only one powder. A chronograph is helpful but will not give pressure readings. He started at .1gr above max for lead data which should have fired without issue were that the problem.

To JL, checking the scale is as simple as placing a single bullet on for a 115gr reading. If you have lighter bullets available you could check those as well.
 
My G34 does not like light loads. I had to install an 11 lb recoil spring to get it to eat starting loads with total reliability. I am referring to the starting load data for jacketed bullets while using plated bullets. If I used lead bullet data, I doubt it would even run.
 
Read the post Mr. Grumpy
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:D I like it.....
.


And you are spreading plated bullet fear mongering IMHO. They are not evil and don't come apart unless abused.

Plenty of tested plated bullet data, which that Midway data is part of. They did not pull it out of a hogs butt, they used test equipment.

From the link I posted:

Plated Bullets

They are not lead, so don't use lead data. They are not jacketed, so don't use jacketed data.

They are somewhere in between. There is some good plated bullet data out there.

The velocity limits of 1200 FPS is a very good guideline. They can sometimes take a bit more, and sometimes a bit less.

I run some Ranier and Berrys bullets with full jacketed data. That can not be done for all bullets and calibers though. Lead data is too weak, and jacketed data can get you in trouble if you are not careful. The attached PDF's and the links to Accurates, Midways, and Vihtavuori's old data will be a great place to start.

I have only been able to tumble plated bullets at high velocities in revolvers. I have run them at over 1300 FPS in autos without issues and good accuracy.
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Along with the links to verified plated bullet data.
 
Help please! I have used factory ammo in my 17 and never had a malfunction until I used my reloads.
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JL, the fact that factory ammo worked fine in cycling the slide is your answer.

I think simple load test of say 10 rounds at higher powder charges not exceeding lead max load at 1.125" OAL should give you a good idea. Most load data at high to near max will give you similar to factory ammo pressures.

If you ever shot CCI Blazer rounds with brass cases and thought the recoil was a bit much than say Winchester white box, it is because the bullets are plated with larger diameter than the FMJ WWB. The larger diameter bullet has tighter bullet-to-barrel seal and generates more pressure thus more recoil. If you are shooting 115 gr plated bullets, high-near max lead load data should bring you up to high range of jacketed load data.
 
I have used the Berry 115gr RN plated with W231 at an OAL in the range of 1.150". I don't have the data in front of me, but it seems the loads in the Hornady book went up to 4.7gr or so. I was loading in the 4.3-4.4gr range and having a fine time with a CZ.

I'm with Walkalong. There's nothing wrong with these bullets, if they are 115gr. First thing is to weigh the bullets. Berry has been known to ship the wrong bullets before.
 
next reload

I just checked the oal of the winchester white box bullets and they are 1.155. I think my next load will be the same berrys plated 115 bullets, hp-38 at 4.5 grains w/ the oal set at 1.14. The last load I made was the same powder and bullet at 4.3 grains w/ the oal set at 1.135. Out of 17 rounds I had one failure to eject w/ the last load. Hoping the extra pressure will help the slide to eject the shells better.
 
Johnny Lightning, since you are loading them at the longer OAL of 1.14", could you load some at 4.7 gr also, to compare. I usually need to push the load data to near max on new Glocks with the 115 gr 9mm at the shorter 1.125" OAL. It will just take a moment of your time to load the 4.7 gr rounds.

Let us know how things go.
 
i went on to the Berry's sight for some insight on how to make reloads using their bullets and they said to use reload data between lead loads and fmj loads....that being said i should be fine at 4.5-4.7 grains w/ hp-38.
 
I've loaded and shot thousands and thousands of Berry's 115 gr. RN plated bullets. Most have gone through Springfield XD's, but a couple thousand have gone through other pistols as well, including Glocks. With the proper powder charge and OAL they will function through any decent pistol. I use SR 7625 for most my loads, but I've also used Winchester 231 and Alliant Bullseye powders.

The bullet is a good one. In fact, my last order for them from Berry's was for 10,000. They work, period.

Hope this helps.

Fred
 
Grats.

You know, I can't help but wonder. Obviously, manufacturer instructions say to not exceed mid-range loads. Speer GDHP's are plated, and they run pretty hot. I'm curious to know if anyone has ever tested the practical velocity limits are for Berry's.
 
I'm curious to know if anyone has ever tested the practical velocity limits are for Berry's.
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I think that depends on the barrel they are shot out of. Conventional rifling with square lands/grooves may cut into the plating deeper than rounded hills/valley hexagonal rifling of Glock barrels.

Recovered plated bullets shot from Glock barrels even when pushed to max load data and beyond show very little marks on the side of the bullet, but bullets shot from land/groove barrels will have cut rifling marks. If plating separation does occur, I think it will start where the bullet was cut from the lands.
 
The plating on Speer Gold Dots is about twice the thickness of Berry's, Ranier, etc., so they can be driven faster.

As for testing the limits of Berry's plated bullets, yes I have. When the Berry's 124 grain FP bullet is driven over 1,450 fps in a 357 Sig, they will tumble badly. And if you're not careful, they will hit the shade support rod on the left side of your chronograph...........

Hope this helps.

Fred
 
What about the right side? :D

I have driven some Ranier 115 Gr bullets over 1200 FPS, and they handled a little over 1300 easily, and close to 1400 showed no ill effects. I haven't shot the Berrys 9MM bullets at that speed yet.
 
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