Ammunition is short: Let's make some!

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One of the recurring topics here is the constant shortage of ammunition today. Some of it is hoarding, which is probably a response to the obamination recently foisted upon us. The results have spread panic which has emptied a lot of shelves in gun stores. Being the naive boy I am, I ask myself: Why don't I come up with a solution? Start my own ammunition manufacturing company!

I'm a school teacher, I work in Special Education. The last time I had anything close to any kind of business related education was an Economics class which I barely passed (though I got A's in my History classes.) I was just wondering, would this be a viable option? Does anybody have any idea how difficult it would be to start such a company? How much capital would I need?

Lastly, does anybody have a couple million dollars laying around that they'd be willing to loan me? :)
 
The shortage has been going on for near 9 months.

I would think that by the time you would get tooled up and in business, then the ammunition shortage would be relieved as far as supply goes. It already is showing some signs of letting up.

Ammunition is not produced from thin air. It is produced from brass, copper, lead, etc, all of which are materials of which there is a finite supply. We already had a metals shortage before the election that didn't help the ammunition supply.

If it's hard to find reloading components to feed your own personal press, then where are you going to find the stuff to make ammunition on a profitable scale?

Plus, I doubt I would buy from you, simply because you would be brand new to the business. I would not want to take the risk, if you get what I am saying. Nothing personal. I do not do stuff like buy gunshow reloads or use my buddy's reloads. I am very hesitant about which manufacturers I choose to supply my ammunition...usually, I only buy from very well established reloaders or manufacturers.

Reloading or manufacturing ammunition isn't a mindless task, it's one that takes attention to detail to result in a safe, reliable, quality product.
 
I know that you do need a license from the Federales (BATFE) to manufacture (this includes commercial reloading). This will take a little while to get and will be step 1. You'll need equipment which will probably cost a good chunk I've seen commercial reloaders sell used for $10k + but they weren't super high volume.

Everyone has to start somewhere so if you have the intestinal fortitude and the financial capability to try it without risking your families mortgage payments I say try it.

Don't let the "It'll never work...You aren't established..yadda yadda yadda." guys keep you from your dream. Do be realistic though and make sure you can afford the financial risk. Sometimes things go perfectly and other times they fail miserably just be ready either way and you'll be fine.
 
I would think that to be profitable, you'd have to be ahead of the curve and to have purchased the raw materials and machines when they were cheap. Getting in now you're buying in at basically the high, or just after the high.

In the year it takes you to get established, raw materials could very well come down and supply open up again, destroying your investment and making your business difficult to compete.

Don't forget their is insurance and licensing involved.
 
PM member Freakshow10MM on here. He's an ammo manufacturer, and can probably answer every single question you have. Short of that, I think the answers you've gotten are pretty spot-on.
 
You know how the handicapped people make light bulbs and such? I wonder if that would work with ammo, set them each up with a lee press........The money would go to a GREAT cause too.
 
VikingOne LLC just did that very same thing, I quit goin to that W store. I would rather pay a little more and have a steady supply than get it off and on from that store that starts with a W.
 
I like the way you think. I work with entrepreneurs daily. They're a different breed. It's a tough business. They know that their product probably won't make it. That's just the odds. They press on with the calculated risk anyway. When it does work out, man, it's something beautiful.

You should try talking with the owner of DoubleTap. A couple years ago, I called DoubleTap about some questions about their ammo. I left a message. Low and behold, the owner Mike McNett ended up calling me back and talking to me for about ten minutes. (I was already a customer during our conversation.) He may be too big for that now, but you never know. Buy some of his ammo, and then try to get in touch with him and ask some questions. If you're near where he is, then definitely offer to take him out to a nice lunch before pumping him for information. You may be able to set up your business so that you're working with DoubleTap, as opposed to being a competitor.

http://www.doubletapammo.com/php/catalog/shipping.php
 
Maybe in Alaska where you are --- around here , there are MANY small commersial {SP} reloaders that sell at gunshows---a lucky few make a deal with a local gun store to stock their reloads/ammo.

At first -- you will have a VERY SMALL market--like Avenger29 , I would have my doubts about buying from a new/never heard of reloader. Add to that , myself and about ALL RELOADERS NEVER BUY reloaded ammo -- at time , only factory new ammo.

And make sure you are OVER-Insured ---- "your ammo blew up my gun" can get expensive if taken to court -- much less " your ammo blinded me or killed my son "etc.

Sorry if I sound "doom & gloom " ---- just be aware there are a BUNCH of pitfalls in making/selling ammo ---- I know this for fact as I used to do comerl. bullet casting.

I do wish you good luck and if I can be of any help , just PM me.
 
Walked in to Sportco yesterday. They have over 30 cases of 9MM. $9.99 a box or $199.80 a case. No limit. Had other ammo too.
 
If it's so costly to get goods up to Alaska.....why would you want to make it there and ship it back to the lower 48? I would think your ammo would be 100% higher than other manufacturers. Or would you sell only in Alaska?
 
+1 on the over-insurance.

Guys peddling reloads at the gun shows in my neck of the woods are selling out their inventory. If they've been around awhile and I've dealt with them I don't hesitate to buy their ammo. I've never had a problem with any of it. The ammunition cartel (Winchester, Remington etal) obviously can't keep up with the demand so they need some competition.
 
Thanks for all the input. I was thinking of setting up here in Alaska with Alaskans in mind as my main customers, at least to start. We pay a LOT to get finished products up here when we actually have a lot of raw materials available which we ship out to be made into other products and then sold back to us with double shipping costs and profits included in the price. The raw materials we don't have up here could be shipped in easily enough, shipping is a big business here.

Again, thanks for the input. It gives me something to think about.
 
It's an interesting idea. I doubt that three million would be enough capital however. Maybe five million but I'd still have my doubts. The big problem would be market share. Where would yours come from? The shortage is something that happens every few years. The stuff will probably be sitting on store shelves with no buyers two years from now. You'd be better off to start a gourmet cookie company.
 
A Different business angle

Not exactly what you are looking at, but another possible business venture:

Dedicated Primer maker.

As a reloader, it is difficult to get bullets, but not impossible if you don't go with the named brands. There are several bullet only makers to get items from.

But primers are impossible right now. Everybody that currently markets primers, are also ammunition makers, so with the shortage, very little is being diverted for sale.

Now get this..there are a lot of reloaders that either didn't purchase enough primers before, or have used up their supply. These people are also now among those putting the drain on factory ammo, since they must now purchase ammo rather than reload it.

Unfortunately though..by the time you ramped up, things will probably settle down. But there is always the next craze. I think though, that this shortage will bring more reloaders, so might still be worth looking into.
 
couple million dollars
LOL I can tell you one thing your number is way way short if you are talking about manufacturing cases, bullets, primers and powder. Modern machinery alone is very expensive. I work in the manufacturing industry. In the plant that I work at we have many machines that cost more than a million dollars each. With some running into the 2 to 4 million dollar range each. Add in land, buildings, permits for everything, EPA, engineering, and labor. I would bet 30 million dollars would not even get you started these days.
 
I'm thinking you're right runningman.

A 50 room hotel will cost 2 million to build. A manufacturing plant, with dozens of employees, and equipment turning raw materials into finished products? I'm thinking 30-50 million.

Figure out your likely net profit per day, and see if it would pencil out. And it might, TODAY. But in the long run, likely not. Lots of expensive equipment will be sold for pennies on the dollar (happens every day, like it or not).
 
alaskanativeson said:
....I was thinking of setting up here in Alaska with Alaskans in mind as my main customers

The numbers would scare me....

Alaskan population...700,000 (how many reload now? How many buy off the shelf?)
Most popular calibers used by Alaskans?
Number of rifle calibers offered?
Number of handgun calibers offered?
Cost of machinery to make each caliber.
Competition from other (much larger) manufacturers.
 
My father and his friend tried to start up a munitions company in the late 80s early 90s.

The capital required is huge, you will be a publicly traded company, unless the founders have a BOATLOAD of cash on hand. The problem with becoming publicly traded is that you have to cow-tow to shareholders, which is not always what's best for the company...lots of tough decisions have to be made in those circumstances (part of why I sort of pity CEOs, they have a job where doing the right thing can get them sued).
 
Yeah, I hate to be a killjoy....it's just the way it is. It's all the precision machinery needed to make consistant product that costs you. The problem is if any bad rounds come out from a new factory, they'll have a very hard time making it.

Maybe a small operation is doable, but you'd probably be very limited in production capacity. The major thing to think about is getting the permits to have serious quantities of explosives around (as well as picking a place that meets zoning for this).

Hey if you do go through with it anyways, best of luck! Sometimes it's the stubborn that gets things done.
 
Be carefull alaskanativeson, the last school teacher that put something on the internet in reference to being pro second amendment got canned from their teaching position.
 
alaskanativeson

DO NOT LET THESE NAYSAYERS GET YOU DOWN!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I'd still be working for convenience stores hoping get to be 3rd manager in charge of icee machine cleaning if I listened to everyone say no. Rule number 1 get all the negative people out of your way. This is in some ways the hardest because it can mean cutting out lovely old Aunt Betty who just doesn't understand why you quit your job to do those gun things. But, you need to do that at least emotionally until you're established.

Keep in mind though that the current shortage is going to end, but build it into to your business plan such that you are on store shelves when prices drop you can make yourself a nice little business here using this shortage as a lever to wedge your way into a niche. Then when then inevitable slump comes to an end you're in a perfect position to grow. Just realize that it's called the business cycle for a reason, and have faith that it will cycle.

My suggestion would be some (one or two) state of the art high end machines (Dillon has some nice ones) that you man during your long winters, lots of insurance, and a ton of marketing. Concentrate on a couple of super popular loads - 9mm 124gr round nose, and 5.56 mm mil spec come to mind - and wedge yourself into the market with those. Once you have several retail outlets etc stocking your product grow from there.

Concentrate on the basics. Build a good product at a good price, and the American market place will reward you. One thing I think a lot of people do is focus on the product and forget to sell it. Then they sit around going broke wondering why they can't make any money. Make certain that you have a good marketing plan, the money (and most importantly), the WILL TO IMPLEMENT THAT PLAN. If you do that you'll do fine. Just also make sure you have a plan to survive the bottoming of the market when the it comes and it will come.

I once looked at this business, and wouldn't mind being in it myself, but just wasn't in a position to capitalize on it well in my earlier years. I may come back to it full cycle when I get my current business stabilized and have some time/cash to invest in something else. In the mean time good luck, and don't let the naysayers get you down. As my mom would say, "If they could do it they'd be busy doing it not taking the time to tell you why it can't be done!" Mom isn't very politically correct as you may notice, but she is damn smart.

Oh, one other thing, don't listen to the naysayers. Find some forums for other entrepreneurs people like your self that can dream outside the box. They may not understand your product, but they will understand your passion, and encourage it. But, and this is the most negative thing you'll see me say, don't do this unless you're in it for the long haul. Having a passion for your sport is fine, but unless you're ready for that passion to be rule your life you're not ready for this step. But once you're ready to commit your blood, sweat, tears, and gonads to it go for it. Dream big, and MAKE IT HAPPEN. If you'd like to pm me for my email I'd be happy to speak to you in private.

Now don't think I'm some Donald Trump (hair not good enough for one), but I've never given up on myself. And, I can look into my own eyes the mirror every morning in ways I couldn't before I struck out on my own so don't let a bunch of doom and gloom types talk you out of it before you even start. Heck you may get into it, and decide you don't want to do ammo, (one guy suggested doing just primers I think this is a great idea BTW), just don't change course because someone said the road was bumpy. All the roads are bumpy. You at least have the courage to look at your choices, and choose your own bumps. Something that most naysayers have never, and will never be able to do.

Good luck and God Bless

Dan
 
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