Any salvation for the .25ACP?

[gcrookston]

My father-in-law, at the end of WW2 really wanted a luger. When he accepted the surrender of a German Major General he thought it would be his chance... The German officer handed him a 1934 Mauser in .25acp.

 

[PX15]

All this talk of the Italian Galesi 25cal. pistol brings back some memories for me. My first pistol was purchased new in Dublin, Ga. in 1966 for $35.00.

Here's a picture of it, along with my "Pistol Toter's" license.





Later on (early 1970's) when I became slightly more prosperous I moved on to S&W's, Colt's and the like and "loaned" my little Galesi to an Aunt who was working nights and wanted a little "protection".. Well imo the Galesi offered about as "little" protection as you could ask, so I let her use it.

Fast forward 30+ years to 2006 and we are all old and retired senior citizens and wound up moving across the state to property next to her. I had forgotten all about the little Galesi. My Aunt went into a back room, and came back with the little 25cal pistol, and gave it back to me. It had never been fired, in fact had the same rounds in the magazine I put in there so many years before.

The Galesi was frozen solid... After a few days soaking in gas, I finally got it freed up and sent off for a complete spring kit from www.gunparts.com. I had a local gunsmith replace all the springs for me, and "presto" it functioned pretty good again. It was NEVER fully reliable as I don't think I ever ran a full magazine thru it without a problem, but hey, it's mine, and back home again.

Best Wishes,

J.Pomeroy

 

[HisSoldier]

Buntline, I'm sorry you had that experience, but glad someone was there for him. I've read about people dying in Vietnam who weren't even hit, during mortar attacks with close hits, no visible damage at all. That may be different though because there is, I've heard, a phenomenon where explosive concussion will kill without visible damage.

Most people, if someone points a pellet gun at them, will alter whatever intentions they had the second prior to that. If someone points a .22 at me I'm going to take some kind of evasive action, the thing could kill me! That said, I'd hate to be in a firefight with someone who is better armed then I, even more than I'd hate to be in any firefight period.

 

[Nicky Santoro]

Any salvation for the .25ACP?

OP,
FWIW, a few years back a local shyster got jobbed with a .25. Two to the upper thorax, one to the beezer. Last reports indicate that he is still dead.

 

[Fu-man Shoe]

PX15, that's a nice little Galesi, and a neat story.

I'm afraid my new (to me) Galesi is not in quite as good a condition!



I believe there's still life in the old gal yet, though! Once I get a firing pin and spring, and put her all back together,
I expect I'll have a decent little .25 acp to plink around with. I'll update the thread when that happens. Till then, I've
gotta spend some "quality time" with a buffing wheel and some abrasive compound to put a nice shine back on them old parts.

 

[Random Discharge]

Salvation for 25 ACP? Hobby Round?

The CCW movement has produced a pethora of options - there are many better options for defense than the 25 ACP. I think this one has been relegated to a collectors or hobbyist item.

As noted by others, lots of better options, e.g. Beretta Tomcat in 32ACP is almost the same as the 25 model if you like the Beretta. Many others.

My personal preference in ammo is FMJ ball up to and including 380 acp. While many recommend the W-W 32 ACP Silvertips, I think JHP ammo is for 9mm and +P 38 Special rounds or better. Why? I want to be sure I get all the penetration I can from the lighter rounds-expansion won't help if the bullet doesn't get to something that matters. And I am also less than confident that JHP will feed reliably from many lighter caliber platforms. Fiochi tends to run on the hot side - I'd try that in FMJ if you're keeping the 25 ACP.

 

[PX15]

Fu-man Shoe:

I think you will find www.gunparts.com can supply you with the parts you need. I should think replacing all springs is a good start..

Best wishes to ya!

J.Pomeroy

 

[Moonclip]

I would really like a NAA mini revolver in .25acp. Has the ability to use Glasers or Magsafes and I feel the ammo is more reliable than rimfire .22's.

 

[Koblenz]

Moonclip, I once read that the reason John Browning invented the .25 ACP because he could not make a small .22 that would feed reliably. I once owned a Jennings pistol in .22lr and it would not feed more than 3 or 4 rounds before jamming. I sent it back to the factory, and after they returned it to me, it was jamming even more often!

It doesn't seem like Glasers would be a good option for the .25. Even in larger calibers the fragmenting rounds are criticized for poor penetration.

Seen them advertised but I don't know how the Magsafes work.

 

[Moonclip]

I personally would not use the Glasers in .25 either but the option would be there. Yes the .25acp was invented for more reliable functioning. And even in a revolver I'd feel the .25acp would be more reliable as centerfires tend to be.

 

[HisSoldier]

I'm still wanting to see data on the comparison of muzzle energy between a .22 LR and a .25 ACP from a 2" barrel.

 

[FLA2760]

Go for a Kel TecP32 (6.6oz) or their P3-AT,.380 (8.3oz) in a pistol, or an SW airweight J frame in a wheel gun. I just got a Smith 432 PD which is a 6 shot J frame in .32H&Rmag that is 13.5 oz. I use it as a BUG to my Glock27 but would carry as primary if the Glock was not practical. I also have a Kel Tec P32 for the last 5 yeras that has ben 100% reliable.

 

[Seven For Sure]

I'm not trying to be a jerk but I'd save some money, sell it and buy a Kahr PM9. They are well built, small, light and have real sights. They shoot a realitively powerful caliber and they are very accurate. Don't skimp when it comes to self defense. Your life should be worth it. It's probably cheaper to shoot too. I've never seen .25 ammo, I guess it's at the gun shop but I've never seen it. I'd rather have a .22mag revolver, at least it will penetrate.

 

[jgoforth]

I carry a Tanfoglio 25 the majority of the time. While I realize it is the weakest round out there it is still capable of killing. I'm confident in it enough to use it. But if push came to shove, I would want my 45 to be there.

When it boils down to it there are two things that a handgun round boils down to: Penetration and Permenant Cavity Width.

The one stop shot factor is a myth. There is no scientific way to test this. The majority of the damage done by getting shot is psychological. If a person sees you shooting them with a small gun, or hears a quite report verses a loud one these can have a direct effect on the reaction to being shot.

As I've shown my 25 off several times to friends, due to its size I often hear "Is that a real gun?" Just due to the fact of the size. This would generally indicate the psychological damage dealt to a person is certainly not as great as say a 45.

I accept no liability for your choice.

With that said here's some interesting reading material.

http://www.firearmstactical.com/pdf/fbi-hwfe.pdf

 

[DDM]

I aquired a F.I.E Model "The Best" 25cal several yrs ago.Ive never carried it but shot it on several occasions never had any issues with it.It even has a slide lock and came with 2 mags.

 

[Moonclip]

I want one of those FIE "the best" .25acp's. I have stupidly passed over two of them. Same as a Astra cub/Colt Junior.

Talking about weak, I have two Beretta 950bs pistols chambered in .22short! And I sort of want a Bernardelli vest pocket pistol in .22long.

 

[usp9]

I admit my "Holy Grail" of pocket guns is a .25 caliber Walther TPH. I'd love to have one, but don't think I'll be able to afford one...sigh......


...and yes, I would carry it on occation.

 

[Owens]

Bought a .25 around 1981. Was marked F.I.E. Cost was $40.00. Thing about it was that it turned out to be a tack-driver. Like a darn fool, I sold it to a buddy at work at the time.
Recently bought a small collection of shootin irons from a retired friend and in it was a Raven in .25. Haven't shot it yet though.

 

[HisSoldier]

Several very interesting posts to me, the ones about "The Best" and the TPH .25. I found out about "The Best" while reading about disassembly of the Astra Cub, and that TPH, I see new magazines for sale but no .25 TPH in any condition. In The Firing Line (I think) it was said that they will not be found in the US often.

 

[Jeff Timm]

Geronimo45 asked, "An interesting study in semi-opposites would be the .455 Webley cartridge (ultimate in big and slow), throwing a slug around 260 grains at around 650 FPS... because the British had the notion, apparently, that the slower the bullet travelled, the more likely it would be to rip and tear the insides instead of just puncturing 'em, thus causing more damage. No idea if that theory was disproved, if there was any basis in fact for it at all, or whether Lord Know-it-All decided, over a glass or two of brandy at the Drones Club, that it must be so."

The Brits actually did some serious studies, including animal shooting, in the early 1900's when they adopted the .38/200 British round. A S&W .38 Case (Not the Special) with a 200 gr soft lead bullet, which had excellent stopping power. Unfortunately the Huns attacked the lead bullet as "illegal according to the laws of war" a very broad interpretation by serious propagandists from a country using poison gas and flame throwers. The jacketed bullet load was not as successful.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Webley_Revolver#The_Webley_Mk_IV_.38.2F200_Service_Revolver

In WWII the Brits went to the Hi-power officially and a lot of lend lease Colts unofficially.

For many years the US ammo makers had a 200 grain load in the .38 Special at standard velocities. Hollow points eventually replaced the big, soft lead, load. The 200 gr load enjoyed a good reputation into the 1960s.

Geoff
Who remembers a part time Police officer in the small town of his youth who was British, carried a Webley revolver, top break, and was acknowledged as one of the best shots on the force.

 

[Moonclip]

The .25acp TPH is suppose to be rather uncommon. I have ony seen a mag for sale at a local shop.

The other FIE .25acp's that is not "the Best" is a decent gun too. I like them better than ravens as they have an exposed hammer.

 

[Koblenz]

or an SW airweight J frame in a wheel gun.

I've already got a S&W M38 Airweight .38, plus a small Ruger 5 shot .357, and a .380 Walther PPK/S. I posted my question mainly to find out if there was any improved .25 ACP ammo that would boost performance of that round.

 

[magnumcarry]

Shoot the bad guy in the face or neck and I bet he will stop and wish he had done something else that day. I have had .25's and now I have a small .22... I feel safe with it when I carry it.

 

[collector14]

The manual that came with my Baby Browning says it will penetrate 3 pine boards of 7/8" thickness at 15 feet (link).



I also have a 1908 Colt (vest pocket gun).



I appreciate both of these guns very much for what they are, (extremely small guns). I have carried these guns on certain occaisions and I have a good understanding of when and under what conditions their use would be appropriate.

I agree with many of the posters that "shot placement" is more important than cartridge selection in this case.

 

[benEzra]

If I owned a .25 ACP, I'd practice with it a lot, and carry it, but I wouldn't count on a "one shot stop" against an attacker. More like, get off the line of force, shoot 2 or 3 times, get off the line of force again, etc., using the gun to create distance. Letting an attacker close with you if you are carrying a .25 would be, well, unwise.

If you are uneasy about Kel-Tec .32's, find a .25 load that's reliable in your gun, is as high-energy as possible, and penetrates well, and practice "shoot and scoot" drills. A .25 definitely beats the heck out of having no gun at all.

Having said that, I believe a lot of the problems with the Kel-Tecs were early production issues, and I have encountered a lot of satisfied owners online.