Anyone use 45 super or Plus P, in their subcompact

[gym]

Been reading up on the various 45 hi preassure loads, quite by mistake actualy. I was looking at utube reviews on one of my guns, The 45 XDS, and the person doing the review said he used speer or golden sabre, "plus p", 45 hollow points as his carry ammo. I have been using Hornaday 185 grain, and winchester "low recoil", along with 230 grain Hydroshocks. I never used the "super or plus P" loads, having been under the impression that they were not that great for the pistols, and that they didn't make much difference.
Any opinions on this?
Assuming the pistol is a high quality one and is rated for the higher preassures, are they worth using just for carry ammo.
I would assume you need to practice with a few boxes to get the feel of the hotter round. What I read suggested they make the 45 more of a magnum type round. Is this true, I know some expert 45 shooters are amongst us, and am curious as to what you guys are shooting out of your guns.
I have used plus p rounds in my 9's and 38's, when the guns were rated for them, but always felt that the 45 didn't really need them.
Also stumbled on this ballistic chart for anyone interested,
http://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/45auto.html

 

[cluck]

Golden Sabre

I use the golden sabers as defense loads in my USP Tactical. I've only tested one mag (12 rnds) to make sure they operate and feed right. There was not a noticeable difference from the ball plinkers i use. I would definitely make sure your firearm can manage them though.

Oh...sorry. the OP was about subcompact. couldn't help there.

 

[psyopspec]

Years ago I carried +P Golden Sabers in my CCW HK USP .45C. From what I recall there was no appreciable difference from 230 Grain ball ammo. But this was a while back and I was a much less experienced shooter so I may not have been paying proper attention to the details.

As a related aside there was a thread relevant to testing any ammunition you plan to carry. Obviously, answers were all over the board as to the ideal number, but I would encourage anyone to make sure that number is > 1 magazine.

 

[gp911]

I fired some +p in my Glock 21SF and felt there was an increase in recoil, enough to slow my follow-up shots a little. I prefer standard pressure myself. In a subcompact the effect would be greater I bet.

 

[SDGlock23]

There is a review on Underwood ammo site of a guy using .45 Super in his XDs. As to whether it's better, that depends. Many don't like to use +P because as it adds a little recoil (slowing down follow up shots) and they feel doesn't offer any appreciable advantage. I like +P ammo myself, however and load for the .45 Super, but that's going to add about 200-300 fps, which is noticeable.

 

[groundhog34]

I have shot +P in my XDs. The accuracy and recoil seem the same as regular 45 230gr. I suspect that most of the extra powder burns outside of the barrel negating the effectiveness of +P, but what do I know. NOTHING!

 

[MachIVshooter]

I use +P in my S&W CS45, I run .45 Super in the 4516-1 (compact, but not sub)

Bottom two

 

[ATLDave]

In my mind, the biggest benefit of the .45 is that it is not highly dependent on velocity to create a large, penetrating wound. Even standard-pressure FMJ hardball has a pretty decent record, if I recall the data correctly. +P makes more sense to me in something like 9mm, where you're trying to create extra effectiveness with a relatively small projectile.

 

[Zaydok Allen]

I have shot Hornady TAP 230gr +p's out my XDs, and that's what I carry in it. I could definately tell there was sharper recoil with the TAP than the 230 fmj's I was mostly shooting. I'm 99% sure the manual says +p's are fine, but will cause accelerated wear on the gun. So good for carry, good for ocassional practice, bad for a steady diet. Check your manual though. I'm 99% sure I checked, I always do, but now I need to go home and check it again.

I did not think the increased recoil was slowing my follow up shots down at all. Is there that much of a velocity difference? I couldn't tell you, as I don't own a chrono.

 

[Clark]

I have a Para Ord P10.
Other Para Ord pistols have great case support, but the really short ones have poor case support: .235" feed ramp intrusion, where most 45acp, 45 Super, and 460 Rowland brass cases have .180" thick webs.
That will not do with 45 Super.
But Starline 45acp +P brass has thick walls near the web. This lowers the case volume but helps with poor case support barrels.
So with handloads I have got 1226 ~ 1257 fps 152 gr with the 3.16" barrel.
That is 45 Super performance from a pistol that cannot shoot 45 Super factory ammo or 45 Super brass at that performance level.
I have been trying for years to get more recoil springs to fit in handguns. Pressure is not usually the limit, the slide and barrel mass times the recoil spring storage energy are.
When I took apart the P10 I was shocked at the innovation. It has two co-axial springs that act like they are in series. The allows one to use a lower spring index, a spring with higher force, but less difference between relaxed and compressed.
Spring Index: A ratio comparing the mean coil diameter to the wire diameter.
I remarked about that here on THR in 2004, and got a personal message from the patent holder.

It looks like two washers attached to a tube, but believe me, this guy was sharp to come up with this idea.

United States Patent 4,201,113
Telescoping return-spring assembly for automatic handguns

 

[zeke]

While not for practice, am keeping plus p's in the 3 inch 45'w owned. The 3 inchers generally get about 100 fps less than a five inch, and some bullets need to keep above 800 fps or so to increase the relaibility of expansion.

 

[MICHAEL T]

I carry Corbon 185gr DPX plus P in my Defender ,Officers and Commanders.

Do to the loss of FPS in the short Defender I find the plus P puts it back where it should be . Recoil is no worst than the 230 Ball and I really like the DPX copper bullet.

 

[Thompsoncustom]

I've ran about 100rd of underwood's .45 super through the XDS 50rd of 185gr/1300fps and 50rd 230gr/1100fps. I think once you shot some of these they will be come your carry ammo as the jump from standard to +p is nothing like the jump from +p to Super... You can feel the power. lol you'll know what I mean once you try it.

Ran the Underwood 185gr through ballistics gel out of the XDS and if I remember right it expanded to .9ish of a inch and penetrated 11 3/4 inches.

 

[Drail]

+P ammo is 90% marketing. The other 10% simply shortens the life of your gun. Don't waste your money. In a snub or compact you have very little barrel for the powder to work with. But if you really like uesless flash and blast, knock yourself out.

 

[Stress_Test]

Another fan of Golden Saber 230gr here for my M&P .45c

I've shot Winchester PDX1 out of it before, and while not painful or anything, there is more recoil. Same for some of the hotter American Eagle 230gr loads.

The GS 230gr load is standard pressure and moderate velocity. It feels the same as a standard target load and recoil is mild in the 45c

 

[S&Wfan]

Why? There's no need for that shtuff. Regular .45ACP ammo is quite effective and gets on back on target quicker for faster and more accurate followup shots.

 

[hentown]

BIG difference between .45 Super and .45acp+p. You don't want to shoot .45 Super through a compact. I carry 9mm +p+ 127 gr in my G26.

 

[DeepSouth]

I think I remember reading on Buffalo Bore's site a while back that the +P was a 10% increase in pressure and 45 Super was a 20% increase. I shoot +P's in my full size auto's 45 Super's in my 25-2 "Woods Gun" and standard ol' 45 acp's in my sub compact carry guns.

I don't feel the minor increase in velocity is worth the much harder recoil, much worse muzzle jump, somewhat increased muzzle flash, and drastically slower follow up shots to be worth it, now if it was a 35oz 1911....maybe, probably not but maybe. I'd have to shoot it a bit to see, but definitely not in 17 oz 45.