I have a RCBS single stage now and I am looking to buy a progressive or turret press for handgun loading (9mm and 38 sp). Are the Hornady and RCBS presses that much better than the Lee? I am going to shoot about 500 to 700 a month of 38s would I be better off with a progressive over the turret?
Are Higher priced progressives really that much better?
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A progressive will be faster by a good bit. IMO .45 acp is some of the easiest fastest stuff to reload.
On a lee turret, I would batch prep brass and batch prime, then charge, seat and crimp in three pulls while cycling the turret. It's what I got the best speed with. Lee's auto indexer was crap IMO.
Top speed was about 100 rounds per hour, and it took me about 6 months of 500 rounds a month to get that speedy.
I got a Hornady LnL AP after about a year of that, and in short order I got to about 320 rounds an hour, and peaked a little above 400 rounds per hour after I got familiar with it and got all the quirks sorted out.
The smaller the components, the slower I am with both.
The first question is free time vs money, how much do you have of each, and what's it worth to you. The second question is how long can you pay attention for while reloading? I'm good for about 2-3 hours before I start making mistakes. That meant getting through a month of shooting with the turret was 2-3 sessions of 2-3 hours. Basically I reloaded once a week for about an hour, one session I'd do 2 hours.
With the progressive, I could get through the month with one 2 hour session give or take a bit.
With progressives, the lee stuff is definitely a bit more improvised. If you are one caliber, especially a roll crimped revolver cartridge, if you want to save money, a dillon square deal b will work pretty well. But definitely buy something nicer than the lee IMO.
For a turret, the lee is perfectly capable IMO. I'm happy with mine.
On a lee turret, I would batch prep brass and batch prime, then charge, seat and crimp in three pulls while cycling the turret. It's what I got the best speed with. Lee's auto indexer was crap IMO.
Top speed was about 100 rounds per hour, and it took me about 6 months of 500 rounds a month to get that speedy.
I got a Hornady LnL AP after about a year of that, and in short order I got to about 320 rounds an hour, and peaked a little above 400 rounds per hour after I got familiar with it and got all the quirks sorted out.
The smaller the components, the slower I am with both.
The first question is free time vs money, how much do you have of each, and what's it worth to you. The second question is how long can you pay attention for while reloading? I'm good for about 2-3 hours before I start making mistakes. That meant getting through a month of shooting with the turret was 2-3 sessions of 2-3 hours. Basically I reloaded once a week for about an hour, one session I'd do 2 hours.
With the progressive, I could get through the month with one 2 hour session give or take a bit.
With progressives, the lee stuff is definitely a bit more improvised. If you are one caliber, especially a roll crimped revolver cartridge, if you want to save money, a dillon square deal b will work pretty well. But definitely buy something nicer than the lee IMO.
For a turret, the lee is perfectly capable IMO. I'm happy with mine.
ColtPythonElite
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I loaded on a RCBS Rock Chucker for nearly 20 years before buying a progressive. I bought a Hornady L-n-L. I wish I would have bought one years ago. I can load more in an hour with it than I can 4 hours on a single stage.
MtnCreek
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Dillon 1050. Will load the op's required monthly rd count in about 45 min.
steveumd
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Yes, progressive is worth the cost
I have been loading for a little over 25 years. I started on a single stage, graduated to a Lee Turret Press, then Hornady progressive and now have a Dillon 650.
A friend introduced me to the Dillon, he had a 550, and I had every intention on getting a 550 myself. I grabbed the 650 when a friend was going through a brutal divorce.
I load 1000-2000 rounds of 9mm, 40 S&W, 45 acp, 38 spl in a 2 hr session. I have loads I have worked up that are very accurate and the Dillon replicates my loads almost perfectly.
The 650 and like progressive machines are an investment. I am a lifelong learner in reloading and take that approach in the time I devote to use of my machine and load research/development. I still use a single stage for for these purposes. 99% of my shooting is supplied by my 650 and I am glad to have it.
I have been loading for a little over 25 years. I started on a single stage, graduated to a Lee Turret Press, then Hornady progressive and now have a Dillon 650.
A friend introduced me to the Dillon, he had a 550, and I had every intention on getting a 550 myself. I grabbed the 650 when a friend was going through a brutal divorce.
I load 1000-2000 rounds of 9mm, 40 S&W, 45 acp, 38 spl in a 2 hr session. I have loads I have worked up that are very accurate and the Dillon replicates my loads almost perfectly.
The 650 and like progressive machines are an investment. I am a lifelong learner in reloading and take that approach in the time I devote to use of my machine and load research/development. I still use a single stage for for these purposes. 99% of my shooting is supplied by my 650 and I am glad to have it.
Smaug
Member
which Lee progressive are you referring to in your post above, raz-0?
Looking at pix of them, I get the impression that the Pro 1000 is improvised, but the Loadmasters looks a lot better.
Just curious .
"Well begun is half done."
-Aristotle
jmorris
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It's a bullet fed 1050. For 500 a month it is way over kill. You could have a bunch of LNL's for the same money but that one is what I consider high end. I only use that one for rifle, 650's with bullet feeders, for pistol, are just as fast and cost a lot less.
Get a progressive. The Hornady, Dillon, and RCBS are good presses. Each have advantages and disadvantages. Do some investigating around the internet to see other's opinions on each brand. Folks are very loyal to the brand they use so be prepared to "read between the lines".
I have studied turrets on and off for years. I cannot see any advantage to them over a single stage press. The auto-index of the Lee presents a little advantage but it is a Lee. Turret press users will disagree with me on the value of turrets.
I load primarily straight walled cartridges on the progressives and my rifle cartridges are still loaded on a single stage press. I have a Hornady L-N-L and a Dillon SDB. I like them both for what i use them for.
jmorris
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I use turrets also, for less volume, too. They offer the advantage of leaving mulitiple dies preset and you just rotate from one process to another. Lockrings on dies are pretty quick but not as fast as snapping in another shell holder and rotating the head.
I have used my Rock Chucker press for over 30 years but went to a progressive press last Nov. for my pistol reloading as I'm now shooting 1200 or more rounds monthly. After alot of reading and thinking, I bought the LNL AP press. It has been perfect for my needs and produces consistent reloads (I have it set up for 5 calibers). I don't use the auto case or bullet feeder and still have no trouble loading 300 rounds an hour without pushing myself. At this point, you can usually find the press on sale at one of the major internet suppliers for about $390. I think you get alot for the money spent.
redneck2
Member
I use Lee dies, and think they are excellent for the money, so I'm not a Lee hater.
That said, I have a friend that had four Lee progressives, set up for different calibers. They were awful. He had to constantly fiddle and piddle with them. I wouldn't take one for free if I had to use it.
I have a Dillon 550. I suspect the Hornady is just as good.
You be amazed how fast, smooth and easy a progressive is once you get it set up.
That said, I have a friend that had four Lee progressives, set up for different calibers. They were awful. He had to constantly fiddle and piddle with them. I wouldn't take one for free if I had to use it.
I have a Dillon 550. I suspect the Hornady is just as good.
You be amazed how fast, smooth and easy a progressive is once you get it set up.
For .38 Special you can have a Lee Loadmaster WITH dies and a case feeder for $220. Add a bullet feeder for under $25, a case collator for another $12.....let's see UNDER $275 for a full boat progressive press that will more than crank out that 500-700 rounds per month for you. Caliber changes are very affordable as well.
NO, it certainly is not a $1000 Dillon 650 with the same accessories, so I reckon you can spend the $725 difference on components?
My pricing came off Factory Sales website:
https://factorysales.com/html/xcart/catalog/ldmas.html
Dillon is a phenomenal machine with tremendous volume output and well worth the investment...IF you actually need that output and can afford the initial cost. Lee has a whole lot of satisfied users too. As do all the other manufacturers of fine reloading hardware.
NO, it certainly is not a $1000 Dillon 650 with the same accessories, so I reckon you can spend the $725 difference on components?
My pricing came off Factory Sales website:
https://factorysales.com/html/xcart/catalog/ldmas.html
Dillon is a phenomenal machine with tremendous volume output and well worth the investment...IF you actually need that output and can afford the initial cost. Lee has a whole lot of satisfied users too. As do all the other manufacturers of fine reloading hardware.
springer99
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Turret vs. a true progressive? I think it all depends on how much you plan to shoot. I use a Lee Classic Cast 4-hole turrent press with their dies and powder measure and find it perfectly capable of running at 150-175 rounds per hour for 9mm and 45ACP. I do use the auto-prime feature and auto-indexing and don't have any problems with that set-up. If you need a higher production rate, then a progressive is the way to go, but don't think that it will gain you anything in quality loads, etc. The Lee setup is certainly capable of producing ammo to stay in the X ring.
I also use the same press to load 30-06, but in that case, I do remove the auto-indexer and use a separate powder measure to dispense the powder charge. The Lee Measure didn't handle the larger charges required for that.
I also use the same press to load 30-06, but in that case, I do remove the auto-indexer and use a separate powder measure to dispense the powder charge. The Lee Measure didn't handle the larger charges required for that.
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HankB
Member
If all you're going to load is pistol, consider a Dillon Square Deal B. A box of 50 .45 ACPs (or .44 Mags, or .38s) takes about 6 minutes, so that's a comfortable cycle rate of 500/hour. Filling primers & powder, occasionally checking the weight of the charge being dropped, etc., cuts into the sustained rate if you're loading alone, but it's a LOT faster than loading on my Rockchucker.
(BTW, I prefer the SDB to the 550 because the SDB will auto advance and the 550 doesn't, but the 550 will do most rifle ammo and the SDB won't.)
If I were buying TODAY, it would probably be a 650. But my SDB works and was paid for LONG ago.
(BTW, I prefer the SDB to the 550 because the SDB will auto advance and the 550 doesn't, but the 550 will do most rifle ammo and the SDB won't.)
If I were buying TODAY, it would probably be a 650. But my SDB works and was paid for LONG ago.
Hondo 60
Member
I have or had a Lee single stage, Pro1000 & turret press.
Sold the turret press & Pro1000 & bought a Dillon 550.
That was the best money I ever spent on reloading.
The Lee presses work, but you constantly have to fiddle with 'em to keep 'em workin.
I found them very jerky, whereas the Dillon is buttery smooth.
If you enjoy constantly putzing with stuff, then a Lee will be great for you.
If you want to set it & forget it, then a Dillon is for you.
I have no experience with RCBS or Hornady presses, so I can't speak about 'em.
Sold the turret press & Pro1000 & bought a Dillon 550.
That was the best money I ever spent on reloading.
The Lee presses work, but you constantly have to fiddle with 'em to keep 'em workin.
I found them very jerky, whereas the Dillon is buttery smooth.
If you enjoy constantly putzing with stuff, then a Lee will be great for you.
If you want to set it & forget it, then a Dillon is for you.
I have no experience with RCBS or Hornady presses, so I can't speak about 'em.
Hagen442
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Go Blue
Dillon 550 - 650 - 1050
Dillon 550 - 650 - 1050
Whiskey11
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I really only have 3 problems with the Hornady LNL AP (yes I do own one 
).
1.) The primer punches press directly on the cast aluminum frame. They have a tendency to put a wear spot in the frame. I worry about primer seating depths in the long run. From an engineering aspect this was a huge disappointment as the rest of the press is fantastic from an engineering standpoint. It wouldn't take much for them to make an insert that goes in this place made of a harder material to prevent this wear.
2.) The plastic handle it comes with is painful and wears the inside of your hand. I've shaved the plastic mold marks off, but it still isn't that helpful. I'm tempted to jack the wooden ball from my Lee Single Stage press and use it instead!
3.) I wish Hornady would have included two Arco bins and put one on front to store bullets a bit closer to where they are going. Eventually the bullet feeder and case feeder will come into use and this will be a non-issue.
You'll notice that 2 and 3 have fixes that can be found on Ultimate Reloader's webpage. It would be nice if it was included with the press. At a minimum finding a new handle should be a priority as the stock one is painful to operate for long periods of reloading!
I do love the caliber change overs even though I don't use it for multiple calibers yet. I've done SOME .308 reloading on it using the Lee Neck Sizer in Station 1 to deprime, using station 2 as a place to put powder in when ram is full up and station 3 bullet seating die and 4 and 5 empty. Thankfully it uses the "same" shell plate as .45 ACP that I normally reload for (NOTE: Shell Plate #1 is not technically for .45 ACP, but it does work. Some problems with ejecting brass may occur, just don't force anything and it'll be ok).
I am absolutely in love with the half stepping on the up and half on the down. No spilled powder here. Primer system is reliable and only had one in 1300 reloads come without a primer and it happened right as I ran out of primers so it was my fault for not catching it before the bullet got seated.
The powder measure is very consistent and the indexing is flawless. I did have to adjust it slightly to get it to index correctly but it took all of 5 seconds with an allen wrench to get er done.
Worth the 400$ I paid for it! Can't wait to get the case feeder and bullet feeder upgrades
).1.) The primer punches press directly on the cast aluminum frame. They have a tendency to put a wear spot in the frame. I worry about primer seating depths in the long run. From an engineering aspect this was a huge disappointment as the rest of the press is fantastic from an engineering standpoint. It wouldn't take much for them to make an insert that goes in this place made of a harder material to prevent this wear.
2.) The plastic handle it comes with is painful and wears the inside of your hand. I've shaved the plastic mold marks off, but it still isn't that helpful. I'm tempted to jack the wooden ball from my Lee Single Stage press and use it instead!
3.) I wish Hornady would have included two Arco bins and put one on front to store bullets a bit closer to where they are going. Eventually the bullet feeder and case feeder will come into use and this will be a non-issue.
You'll notice that 2 and 3 have fixes that can be found on Ultimate Reloader's webpage. It would be nice if it was included with the press. At a minimum finding a new handle should be a priority as the stock one is painful to operate for long periods of reloading!
I do love the caliber change overs even though I don't use it for multiple calibers yet. I've done SOME .308 reloading on it using the Lee Neck Sizer in Station 1 to deprime, using station 2 as a place to put powder in when ram is full up and station 3 bullet seating die and 4 and 5 empty. Thankfully it uses the "same" shell plate as .45 ACP that I normally reload for (NOTE: Shell Plate #1 is not technically for .45 ACP, but it does work. Some problems with ejecting brass may occur, just don't force anything and it'll be ok).
I am absolutely in love with the half stepping on the up and half on the down. No spilled powder here. Primer system is reliable and only had one in 1300 reloads come without a primer and it happened right as I ran out of primers so it was my fault for not catching it before the bullet got seated.
The powder measure is very consistent and the indexing is flawless. I did have to adjust it slightly to get it to index correctly but it took all of 5 seconds with an allen wrench to get er done.
Worth the 400$ I paid for it! Can't wait to get the case feeder and bullet feeder upgrades
Lost Sheep
Member
Continuous processing is (usually) inherently faster
Each to their own preference. That's mine. Some people do like to prime off-press and I don't fault anyone for that.
My auto-indexer has performed flawlessly and my style is amenable to continuous processing rather than batch, though I am pretty happy with either over continuous on a progressive (but my experience with them is limited, I admit).
Respectfully,
Lost Sheep
At that kind of volume, I opine that it is a toss-up as to whether you would be more pleased with an Auto-indexing turret (Lee Classic) or a true progressive. It will depend on your personal style.
Of course, if you up your shooting volume, that is likely to make a difference.
Lost Sheep
I was able to do 100 rounds in 47 minutes the second time I used my Lee Classic Turret by performing all the operations on the press.
Each to their own preference. That's mine. Some people do like to prime off-press and I don't fault anyone for that.
My auto-indexer has performed flawlessly and my style is amenable to continuous processing rather than batch, though I am pretty happy with either over continuous on a progressive (but my experience with them is limited, I admit).
Respectfully,
Lost Sheep
Fatty,fatty said:
At that kind of volume, I opine that it is a toss-up as to whether you would be more pleased with an Auto-indexing turret (Lee Classic) or a true progressive. It will depend on your personal style.
Of course, if you up your shooting volume, that is likely to make a difference.
Lost Sheep
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