Beretta PX4 new shooter

Status
Not open for further replies.

BrewCityProp

Member
Joined
Apr 27, 2007
Messages
23
Location
Milwaukee, WI
I am a new shooter with a question - I will describe best I can but let me know if you need more info.

I purchased a Beretta PX4 9MM with the 17rd magzines. Only about 150 rounds through it so far. I have had a couple "Failure to feed" issues, this has only happened when inserting a magazine into pistol and racking slide to load chamber. (one goes into chamber and a second shell gets in the way and jams slide open) This has only happened when loading that first shell, but 3 times.

The magazines are definately hard to load, (after 6 shells I use the loading tool)

Is it the strength of the mag spring causing this? Is my motion in racking the slide poor and causing this?

I am going to shoot several times only loading 6-8 shells just to break them in since having this happen, is this correct?

I enjoy the pistol and like the fit, felt recoil was definately less than several others I tried. I need to work on my marksmanship (I hit the paper at 50 feet, but seem to put a lot of shots 5-10 in left of center, I am sure this pistol is more accurate than me)

It's purpose is range/home defense. I also wish the sights were easier to see, they have this luminescent material and I would prefer something like a bright white (The sights comee off as white with a dingy green tint to me so they do not pop out to me)

Can the sights be repainted with a brighter color that I can pick up easier?

Cheers
 
Hello and welcome to the forum. I had a PX4 9mm for a while and absolutely loved it. In a fit of stupidity I sold it, and now I wish I had it back.

The magazines are indeed hard to load. I always was able to load it by hand, but after round 10 or so it really became a hassle. This is typical for these guns, and I don't think that the heavy spring is causing your other issue (FTF).

Did you buy the gun from a gun shop or from a big box outlet (Cabelas, Gander Mountain, etc.)? If the place has a gunsmith I would take it to him/her and show them what it is doing. If not, I would send it back to Beretta with a solid explanation of what is happening. Even taking digital pictures of the jam may help.

Are you having this issue with both hollowpoints and hardball ammo? Have you tried different brands to see if it is a consistent problem?

Consider visiting the Berettaforum at www.berettaforum.net. They might also be able to help out with your issues. Good luck to you and again, welcome to the forum.

Todd
 
I also have a PX4 9mm. It might be the motion of you racking the slide. Did you baby the slide? PX4 will have a feeding problem, if you baby the slide (this is a typical problem for most semiauto, but PX4 is more sensitive to it). Next time you rack your slide, just let it go.

I have never have problem with mine. I just heard some PX4 's owner has the same problem. It worths a try.
 
The PX4 (9mm) is my first handgun. It never jammed on me, in the 1500 or so rounds I put through it. Perfectly reliable, and I'm never going to sell it.

The mags are hard to load fully, but the springs will break in after a few times. I used an HK speed loader (forgot the model number) to put the full 17 in the mag the first few times.

As far as accuracy, there were alot of "low left" complaints on Beretta forum.net, but its not the gun. I shoot a few pistols now and have taken a few courses, and the pistol is accurate (though not as accurate as my Glock 22).
 
Thanks for the replies,

I will check out the Beretta forum. I think you are right on me babying the slide chongfa, I will make sure I just let go (was not sure if I could cause that to failure to happen by the way I racked the slide)

since you are beretta owners, thoughts on the sights?

Cheers
 
Racking and magazines

...

As mentioned, no baby/soft racks of the slide, as when you have any ammo, whether snap-caps (for dry-firing) or range ammo, or even more important, hollow points, as mentioned above, and asked, you must rack the slide and let it snap at full force, just like it does on its own when you're firing it at the range.

This should solve that problem.

As far as the magazines being hard to load, you bet. They're brand new, so just get a speed loader (which you'll only use a few times) and everyday, for the next 2 weeks, load each mag with a full load, or 1 shy, if it's that hard, and can be, as was the case with my two 10 round max mags.

And let them stay loaded all the time and in about 2 weeks or less, you'll be able to load them, more and more, by hand only, to close to full, if not, all-full, with ease.

Personally, I think the Beretta's double-stack mags are the best, and most forgiving, in the break-in period, along with, after. My mags are a pure joy to load by hand at the range, or at home, with no sore fingers.

And, FWIW, and many will disagree with this, but it's an "individual choice", but I keep only 1 round chambered, with 9 in the mag, and the reserve mag has only 9 in it, to let the spring, have a touch of breathing room, in HD mode.

But, if I'm out in the concrete jungle, it's one in the chamber and 10/max in the mags for SD mode.



LS
 
I like the sights a lot and I found the PX4 9mm to be VERY accurate. In fact it was one of the most accurate I ever owned (so far...).

Todd
 
I'll give a comment on the sights. Yes they can be repainted. I have painted many a sight using a chewed toothpick as the brush. Just mash the tip of a toothpick in your molars until it looks like a brush, let it mostly dry, and then use some Testors modeling paint in the color you want to try.

Personally, What I wind up doing is getting real night sights on all my handguns. I just get the sights with the bright white PVC capsules which hold the tritium tubes. If Meprolight or Trijicon aren't already making them, they will be soon as the PX4 has been adopted by several agencies.
 
From what I have heard PX4 is really sensitive to babying the slide issue. However it is a good habit to not baby the slide. Even the all awesome, end all, be all, big balls Glock (rolleyes) will jam once in a while, if you baby the slide.

As for shooting low to the left, try use only the tip of your finger up to the part that is behind your nail to squeeze the trigger. Do not go past your first joint of your finger. For the most part, my PX4 is on the target, if I do my parts.

As for the sight, the superluminova thing works for me. It glows in the dark for about 30 mins after 10 seconds light shining on it. However it is kind of cheap, one of my rear sight already has some superluminova paint flaking off. I like the superluminova, but Beretta should make them a little more robust. Other than that, the sights are fine with me.
 
Sights for Px4

...

As mentioned, Beretta's factory, glowsights are only good for only 30 mins on a good day..

I recommend, highly, Trijicon night sights..

If you can, go either yellow, or orange for the 2-dot rears, and without doubt, go GREEN with the front.. as green/glows the brightest, and for the eyes to see BEST at night, bar-none.

Also, having ordered 2 sets of night sights, the Trijicons, and NightSights, and IMO, the rear 2-dot Nightsights are better, and that is what is on my Beretta, rear white/glow-orange, BUT..

NightSights front sight, for the Beretta Px4, "they said", is too tall, rectangular, "not sloped" like the factory sight and the dovetail is too thick, and it sticks up above the barrels flush finish top. Oh, and not to mention, it, NightSights- dovetail ends are cut straight, not beveled, again, like the factory front sights are.

So, I'm using the Trijicon front sight, which is tapered at the end, like the factory sight, and will not, like the NightSights did, hang up on your holster, with its tall, 4 sharp edges.

Bottom line, GO night sights, as they GLOW for 5hrs, been there, seen it, as much as when you first light them up and then go to a dark place.

Buy Trijicons, or make sure of whatever night sights you go with, that first, the dovetails are beveled on the ends and that the sight itself, tappers down, towards the very front of your barrel, like your factory sight, and if only can be found in all white/glow-green 2-dots, front white/glow-green take them, they're great as well, as I have those on my Sig 9mm.


LS
 
Last edited:
+ 1000 on the PX4...love my 9mm, got the Stealth Decocker and slide release, which makes it a "G" Model...awesome

20 round mag is way cool and the gun shoots like a champ...

NEVER baby any slide any auto...don't ride a slide home...slingshot it...let it slam!

Enjoy ;)
 
Campaigning the PX4 in USPSA

I am working the PX4's issues hard to get a nice pistol for USPSA shooting. While I have never had a failure to feed, and can ride the slide home all I want and NEVER cause a jam, I am using a .40 S&W, and IIRC, the gun was originally designed and sized for .40 and may therefore have a few issues in 9mm not attendant with the .40 version.

The decocker is really killing my draw speed as it is stiff and hard to thumb up. This and the gritty trigger both have the same solution, douse liberally with an aerosol charged oil like TriFlow to wash small bits of steel and dirt out of the trigger and firing pin assembly. Particularly helpful is sticking the small "straw" down inside the firing pin block release pin while pushing it down with a dental pick. In general the pressure of the oil will force small debris out of the action. TriFlow works great, and works better if heated in warm water first and shaken well. Occasionally use the same straw and carburetor cleaner to remove all of the oil and debris and get the metal bone dry before applying a new coat of oil. I am also experimenting with Bone's ABEC-5 skateboard bearing oil called Speed Cream. Speed Cream wets extremely well, is clear, and bonds to the metal very strongly. It comes in an eyedropper container and sells for about $10 an ounce. To get the decocker to have a more civil tone I sit watching TV and click the decocker on and off hundreds or even thousands of times. Eventually, as with my 96, the thing gets pretty loose and stops jamming my thumb when I have to do it under time pressure in competition.

This is a very accurate pistol, and as I get mine broken in a bit, I am convinced it will outshoot my 96. It would be so much nicer with a longer slide or at least a longer barrel, but it is what it is for now. I love the rotating barrel lock and have described it in some detail on the Wikipedia page. The cam tooth is bearing a lot of load based on the amount of wear I have experience, so I am now using Kryton Teflon grease on it and like what I am seeing. Kryton 205 grease is $125 an ounce and comes in a syringe, but a little bit goes a very long way. It will not burn, will withstand temps in excess of 650 degrees, and for the barrel extension, at least with Practical shooting, that is a good thing. I also use it on the slide rail and barrel end/slide interface and sear. Very, very little is needed. I am pretty tired, having shot 6 USPSA stages today, but with the exception of 2 Charlies at 20 yards starting with a DA shot, the entire rest of the course I shot 2-Alpha. I hope someday to be as good as this gun. It is winning me over and outshooting Glocks, Sigs, 1911s, and every other gun at the range. Of course, in the end the operator is the key, and I am still more focused on accuracy than speed this early into Practical shooting, but this gun works.

The frame is actually kind of rubbery where the gun meets the man, and that is a good thing I think. In particular, when pressing really hard to get the grip tape to stick I can feel the grip flex. This is no doubt part of the secret of the PX4's light recoil. The very long recoil spring is too, and has been almost completely overlooked by the gun rag experts because it goes through the transfer block all the way to the back of the feed ramp and it is easy to miss its true lenght as a result. The bad thing is the grips are awful and the snakeskin pattern on the backstrap is directional so as to NOT support the weak had grip. ***??? Earth to Beretta, you want to have another look at that already? I have skate tape on the grips now and aside from the beating my hands took after shooting for 2 hours last night and 6 hours today, I think I am getting the grip dialed in now. Have I mentioned this gun is stupidly, amazingly, accurate? Like **** did he just do THAT accurate? I'd love to have it in 9mm about now as I am shooting Production class and get zilch in points for the extra recoil of a major caliber. Anyone want to trade theirs for a CZ75?

Issues:

The 10-rnd mags are crap, bad crap, and worse crap. First, the springs are very weak, and in spite of this they are very hard to load. A good part of this is the very aggressive stagger of the double stack, in part it is because the tooth in the autoloader plastic thinggy isn't flexible enough to get the rounds to choose a left or right path, so the rounds don't want to stagger right going down into the mag. Loading with a thumb has no such problems, but my thumb is almost raw today after all the loading. Second, the springs don't get the job done when you dump a mag in the dirt on a reload and the grit gets in the mag. Oil makes things much worse. I am working with Rain-X, an old snowboard binding trick, and it seems to be working. Rain-X needs to be applied over and over to build up enough thickness, but dries into the metal or "dry" so does not attract and hold dust. I still have to lube the outside of the mag just a bit to get a good release from the mag holder, but so far I am liking the Rain-X solution.

Now the really bad crap. The crease that runs from the bottom of the mag about half way up the side to limit the round count to 10 is about 2-3mm too high up and this causes the one and only serious problem I have encountered. When there is one in the pipe, which when time is critical and you don't want to waste a second or two releasing the slide on an empty pipe means always, the mag is very, very hard to get seated and locked into place because the stacked rounds are not sitting on the spring - they are sitting on that stupid too-high crease. Zero give. If you strip the rounds out of the mag you will find a ball-bearing shaped dent in the last round. I had 3 occasions today where the mag did not lock into place and I had to rack the slide to feed a round. I THINK I have this figured out correctly, but I am still studying this issue carefully because if there is something going on in the internals of the gun that is causing this problem then I am going to be bending, wearing or breaking something pretty damned quick because the solution is a thunderous blow to drive the mag into place. This only happens with one in the pipe AND a full mag.

This brings me to a slightly less serious, at least in its consequence, problem with mag changes. If you drive the mag home that hard, the Slide will often release all by itself. This can be quite disconcerting. However, given that driving the mag home like a freight train addressed the more serious problem above, I have decided this is actually helpful for me in competition as I can develop the habit of always driving the mag home hard enough to drop the slide and save myself a second or two - at least until the RO complains. There is nothing complicated going on here. The mass of the slide release button is sufficient that when ramming a mag home that hard, the button lags the frame’s pop upwards, which is effectively depressing the slide release. While of personal benefit to me, I think this is a potentially serious problem that Beretta should address. It happens quite frequently (1 in 5 times maybe?) if driving hard enough to seat the mag with one in the pipe RELIABALLY. If you know what is required I think you could get a self-release nearly every time. Currently, this is my goal. :D

As for sights, well, block sights suck, they are awful in the real world too. Block sights require that you cover up what you intend to hit. That pretty much violates common sense and everything you have every been taught about not pulling the trigger on anything you are not willing to destroy. What would that be? You can’t see it cause you have to cover it up to use the sights properly. Put bluntly, requiring that a shooter cannot ID what he is about to shoot, by design, is piss poor design. The correct solution is something like the DoubleRing sight or Burris FastFire optics. Think about a target popping his head up from behind a wall. How can you watch for the target and keep your sights trained on him at the same time? Well, you can't. Stupid design. Glock’s “6-O’clock sight is a so-so work-around, but DoubleRings are better (not allowed in Production) and halo optics the correct solution to a whole bunch of problems with sighting.

For USPSA we almost always shoot in blazing sunlight where all the day-glow stuff is unnecessary, but I do like the Day-Glow, TruGlow, Sponge Bob Glow Pants, or whatever they call it. It seems to work OK. I would remind everyone that the name of the game is front-sight-focus. In fact, the monthly USPSA magazine's name is Front Sight. It is everything. Keep this in mind when choosing colors. You don't want your rear sights distracting your eye from the all-important front sight.

I hope some of this is helpful. Most of this essay is probably going to turn out to be insightful and on target. Some of it will likely turn out to be wrong. It's a WIP, but it is being worked very hard. Please share your tips and suggestions, it might just same me a lot of time and money.
 
solidpoint said:
The decocker is really killing my draw speed as it is stiff and hard to thumb up.

Convert it to the G-mod with the stealth controls and you won't have that problem anymore. Plus, it makes it easier for concealed carry, too!
 
If you are still having problems with the first round, try locking the slide open, insert the magazine, then release the slide using the slide lock lever.
 
Navy87Guy,

I found a few pics of the stealth controls, but they looked even harder to work with speed as there didn't seem to be much surface area to get a thumb purchase on. Can you find a pic of the controls from the pistol side-view so I can actually see what the control looks like? TVMIA if so.
 
Stealth controls

...

One can convert to a G-model, and use the original "Bat-wing" decocker-safety levers that came with one's gun, for easier activation.

It's what I intend to do down the road with my F-model



LS
 
solidpoint said:
I found a few pics of the stealth controls, but they looked even harder to work with speed as there didn't seem to be much surface area to get a thumb purchase on. Can you find a pic of the controls from the pistol side-view so I can actually see what the control looks like? TVMIA if so.

I have some pics of the stealth controls on my gun on my PX4 page, here: http://home.comcast.net/~navy87guy/home/berettapx4.html

I'm not sure I understand the "speed" issue...a G-model is a decocker-only version. There is no manual safety. Once you LAMR, you decock, holster the pistol, and you're ready for the DA first shot. Since it's just a decocker, the only time you need to manipulate it after you load and before you draw.

Hope this helps,

Jim
 
solidpoint said:
The 10-rnd mags are crap, bad crap, and worse crap.

As a California resident, this makes me sad :( I was seriously looking into getting a px4
 
Jim,

So, no dead-stick trigger? Just a hammer drop? OK, now I'm interested. With that going for me I can beat those Glock Nazis all day long. Speaking of Glock Nazis, check out this video. Lynne is a good shooter, was in my training class and shoots both USPSA and IDPA. (I think the IDPA habits are responsible for her pulling the mag out by hand and putting it back in the holder - not good for time in the USPSA game) I am told it was a simple mag-seat problem, but from all the crap you hear from the Glock Nazis I'd have expected plastic angels to descend from G-heaven and seat it for her while Father Gaston appeared from the mist and gave her a shoulder massage. :D

http://www.actionpistol.org/target2007/may/stg1.mov

I think Lonestar's approach is best as I will still need to undo the safety I bet. I will have to talk to the RO and find out. If I don't have to work the decocker during the draw I am going to pick up some serious time. :D
 
RE: 10-round .40 mags - I spent 8 hours making damned sure I had it right, and with pics to prove it and the problem is simply that the ribs that restrict the travel of the stack to only 10-rounds are too long - or perhaps - on the wrong sides. The long rib is on the side the follower garentees will seat the bottom round in the stack, instead of the half-up round, AND, the short rib is on the half-stack side where it's shorter height is worthless. IMHO Beretta and MDS both screwed up and put the ribs on the wrong side. If the ribs were reversed, or followers could be changed, then the double stack would seat 3mm lower, which back at the top where the double stack is turned into a single stack, would exactly make up for the 6mm the sear intrudes down into the mag space.

Another way to say this is the idiots spaced the topmost rib off the top of the mag, not the bottom of the sear. This means that whenever you try to seat the mag with the slide forward in battery you have to put dents in the bottom shell's case and have to bash the mag's top bullet's extractor rim hard enought into the sear to get the bottom bullet case and mag body to dent/bulge enough to make up that 6mm. Way to go you I-tie pukes. Jeeze... what a bone-head move. I have some very good pics to absolutely prove what I am saying, so if the mods want to challenge this I can send pics. I do NOT want to post those pics, nor say anymore though until I give Beretta a chance to fix this once and for all. I love this gun and really want this problem handled gracefully so we can all enjoy its many great features. I don't know if this is a problem for the 9mm or not. Man I want one of these in 9mm bad - so I can shove it up the butts of those Glock Nazis.

BTW, I put skate tape on the top of the trigger guard to keep my finger up out of it so I may have found a solution to the rounded off guard. We shall see.
 
NavyGuy,

Nice website dude! I have a CZ 75B and am thinking about an SP01 depending on how well I like the B. Still waiting for grips and holster. I generally shoot ABG. (Anything But Glock)



The one on the right was 30 shots @ 7 yards, 2 reloads, just a bit under 45 seconds. I call that one my VT target pic. If you give any shooter 600-900 seconds to shoot the sheep it doesn't matter if they have 20, 10, 5 or 2 round mags, they are going to do a lot of damage - and that ain't no 9mm.
 
Solidpoint -

Nice shooting! And I'm glad you like the website...it's something to do in my spare time.

I have a CZ 75BD and I love it. That's what prompted me to get the SP-01. I bought mine from Matt Mink, who shoots for Team CZ. He did a trigger job, installed the CZ 85 combat trigger and competition sights for me. It's a sweet pistol and the one I use primarily for USPSA Production.


As far as the Beretta, once you install the stealth controls, you'll be able to decock and fire the first shot DA. Some people don't like the difference between DA and SA, but it doesn't bother me too much. It will also make the PX4 a bit more comfortable if you ever decide to use it for concealed carry.

I'm not completely anti-Glock. I shoot them well enough, but they just don't thrill me. My son has been shooting my G17 in USPSA Production and he came dangerously close to beating me on a couple of stages in his very first match! It's just a matter of time.

Jim
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top