Blackpowder weapons for concealed carry?

[Dr.Rob]

I knew a certain Scoutmaster that carried a loaded (replica) Colt Patterson under his serape at the campfires. He let me shoot it a few times.. really fun pistol. Don't know if he was expecting truble at the jamboree or?? He also had a "Blanket gun", which is a sawed off-trade musket filled with shot or buck and ball.

My Uncle had an off brand Navy "reb" in .44 cal with a short barrel he kept loaded, swore that he never ever used anything but Crisco to seal the cylinders.

There was an interesting article in gun digest YEARS ago about BP revolvers for "realistic" competition. The Colt 1862 police model got high marks, as did the bigger dragoon 44's (namely becasue they were easier to load).

The '58 Remington was said to jam less often, and scored nearly as well as the '60 Colt army, which all the writer thought had the best balance for a big revolver.

Your results may vary.

 

[Gerald McDonald]

Bring this one up to the top again, I have a friend who keeps one of the Starr D/A cap and ball replicas as a truck gun. he shoots it pretty good but has a tendancy to compress all of the powder he can in the chamber, never seal the round thats the 1st in line.

I wouldnt be too bothered with the 1851 Colt replica I have, never had a misfire in about 5 lbs of powder. This one is a 44 cal instead of 36 so trust me 5 lbs is a heck of a lot of shootin when its done about 25 grains at a time.

Gerald

 

[BigG]

According to Elmer Keith in "Sixguns," the .36 1851 Navy Colt (with Round Ball) was a far better killer on game than any 38 Special ever made. He recommended round ball in any C&B gun for killing power.

 

[Ryder]

I've got a 45 caliber "deringer" I've carried concealed while hunting. Carries well, hammer is centerline, with a 4 (or 5?) inch barrel. Not much different than carrying a fixed blade knife in a sheath. No sights but it points well.

Only ever shot one living thing with it. Used it to finish off a tough old buck. Shot him in the side of the neck at a distance of 4-5 feet. Instant termination. I was very suprised with it's effectiveness.

 

[Johnny Guest]

Once upon a time - - -

some years before the Texas CHL law happened, I began looking for a way to legally carry a pistol when I left law enforcement. The law here doesn't count pre-1899 guns as "firearms." I shopped for an old, dogged out Colt Single Action Army. At the time, you could pick up such a thing for maybe $200. All I wanted was a frame and grip straps, so it would be clear that this was an OLD gun.

My plan was to replace all the internal parts, and the cylinder if need be. The barrel would be cut back to about 3-1/2 inches and the grip frame reworked into birds head shape. A set of decent sights, and I'd be ready to go. I thought that if the cylinder was at all usable, I'd handload black powder and 255 gr. SWCs. With a new cylinder, I would have used smokeless, of course.

This "Plan" might not be exactly in line with the point of this thread, though. I've shot up a few pounds of black powder, and would feel fairly well protected carrying a well-tuned .36 Navy with the barrel cut back to four or five inches. It would develoop much the same power as a good .380 auto. Better still would be an 1860 Army with cut back barrel and grip frame reshaped and shortened. A modern cap and ball piece, though, would still be counted a handgun, so the CHL would still be necessary.

Best,
Johnny

 

[Warren]

This thread deserve a bump.

Just a great series of posts.

 

[RyanM]

And relevant. I'm finally buying an NAA Companion tomorrow. Well, actually today. It's really looking like, with the custom stuff I'm having done, a Companion will be a much better carry piece than a cartridge mini. Better reliability, faster reloading, higher power.

 

[Warren]

Will you post a range report?

 

[RyanM]

I plan on it.

It probably won't be soon though, unfortunately. Depends on shipping time, and my days off.

 

[WeedWhacker]

It's really looking like, with the custom stuff I'm having done, a Companion will be a much better carry piece than a cartridge mini. Better reliability, faster reloading, higher power.

I can't argue about the power, and while the debate regarding rimfire reliability vs black powder may be open, even with the hideously complicated finger gymnastics involved with reloading a NAA cartridge mini (half-cock hammer; remove cylinder pin; remove cylinder; push pin through each chamber to eject empties; juggle frame, cylinder, pin, and five cartridges while inserting cartridges into chambers; keep rear end of cylinder pointed UP while re-inserting into frame; keep rear end of cylinder pointed UP while re-inserting cylinder pin and wiggling it and the cylinder back and forth until pin slides in and locks; cock hammer and off you go... finally. If you didn't drop anything), I can't see how BP is going to be faster than cartridges.

For my edification, what's the reload procedure on the Companion, specifically, if not most BP revolvers in general?

 

[Zero_DgZ]

My NAA Companion now goes where I go, with the included waistband holster. I leave all five loaded with the hammer locked at quarter cock like the manual says, with about a half load of smokeless stuffed in there instead of smoky black powder.

Cartridge pistol will be added to my inventory sometime in the next month or so - I haven't settled on a wheelgun or an auto yet. I like the single action because when I draw it and thumb the hammer it goes "click, click, clack" and people know what that noise means.

 

[armoredman]

I carried a Colt 1851 Navy repro once or twice, round ball 36. Nice revolver, and I will get another one in 44, steel frame, someday. Smokepoles are just fun, and useful!

 

[RyanM]

In this case, I'm having the chambers reamed, new nipples that take small pistol primers, and whatever else will improve the gun. NAA Companions should work fine with a full scoop full of whatever smokeless you want. I'm pretty sure they used to recommend Bullseye. I plan on trying IMR HiSkor 800-X, since that has very good results in .25 ACP.

If you don't have a spare cylinder, reloading is dirt slow. If you do, all you do is pop out the old cylinder and pop in the new one. Much faster. Can't do that with a cartridge mini unless you glue the cartridges into the spare cylinder or something.

 

[Zero_DgZ]

I always figured a sawn-off, black powder and cap shotgun (bonus points for a double barrel) would be a decent car gun. If my understanding is correct, black powder arms cannot be NFA items (to wit, there's a revolver repro with a center mounted 20 ga. barrel that's about six inches long...) so that would be an interesting close-quarter sidestep of the law.

 

[RyanM]

Depends. Cap and ball guns can be machine guns or "disguised weapon" type AOWs. But they're exempt (for now) from barrel length restrictions.

I ordered that Companion kit today, from capandballreplicas.com. Jennifer, the owner, seems like a nice person. Was more than willing to swap in the standard holster instead of the flap type holster, and then throw in a set of slightly more expensive free grips at my request, to make up for a little of the cost difference. Also got a small discount for asking if they match prices. I'd say I got a pretty good deal. The website said the gun'll take 5-10 business days to arrive. Poo. I don't like waiting for things.

 

[Zero_DgZ]

The Companion's real nice.

Next thing you know you'll be sitting on the firing line with a back of #4 buckshot in your lap, a buncha holes in the target, and you'll be fresh out of those 100 caps you just bought and figured would last a lifetime.

 

[Boom-stick]

How do you carry the NAA?

I've got the Freedom Arms CnB and have been looking for a decent holster.

Dan

 

[RyanM]

I'm going to carry mine in the clip-on IWB holster that comes with it some of the time, and in a pocket otherwise. I plan on making a kydex pocket holster.

I don't know if I'll have enough kydex left after to make another one though. Will have to wait and see. Although, shipping the gun from and to England for fitting would cost like a million pounds sterling. You could try seeing if the holsters NAA makes will fit?

 

[Manyirons]

Tha BOSS carries one /NAA/ in a wrist band tha opposite side of a wristwatch. LONG sleeves of course. Or that little watch pocket in yer bluejeans.

Thought about just havin tha BOSS put a lanyard ring on one and carry it like a necklace.

 

[Carl N. Brown]

The smoke from BP is also good for concealment AFTER shooting.

 

[tmackay3302]

Kind of jumping back to the original topic real quick (everyone else, at ease ). I read a little while back about an older couple that were waking down the road by their house when a man claiming that he had a gun told them to hand over their possesions. The gentleman who was being held up whipped out a snubnose .44 cal bp revolver and shot the guy, who crumpled to the ground and died right there on the spot. I don't know if I got the story 100% right, but you get the gist of it. If someone wants to correct me feel free! I just thought this was kind of a cool story. Gentlemen, as you where!

 

[MCgunner]

The guy may be a complete idiot and probably shouldn't be allowed a carry permit, but the story is hillarious! Thanks for that.

 

[gopguy]

Cap and ball revolvers served real well from 1836 til way up in the 1870s. Wild Bill Hickock stayed with them even after the SAA was on the market.

Wild Bill reportedly also unloaded and reloaded the gun every day out of concern of the powder condensing and grease contamination. Somehow I think the guys carrying those old smokers today are not going through all that trouble...

Really now folks CCW is for protecting your life. I understand the argument about being between the ages of 18 and 21, but unless you are prohibited from having a modern handgun I am afraid you are taking a terrible chance by relying on obsolete technology. Heck, if you have to draw that thing and the bad guy knows much about guns and sees you pull a Colt 1862 pocket Navy or a huge Ruger old Army he may not take you serious......

I have had so many bad batches of caps I would not trust these for self defense and I have a fairly large collection of black powder handguns. Purely for paper punching fun. Do yourself a favor and carry a modern revolver or pistol of reputable make that is reliable.

 

[Tearlachblair]

Now that's an idea..

In the 18-21 range (I just turnd 18, YAY!), can we carry them actually on our person or just in our vehicle?

Now, I just got a Traditions 1860 Army (I'll post pics soon!) and I already loaded it. How long should you keep a BP revolver loaded safely? And how on earth did Wild Bill unload his?

 

[gopguy]

In the 18-21 range (I just turnd 18, YAY!), can we carry them actually on our person or just in our vehicle?

Don't get too excited just yet. Depends on your state laws. I am in Ohio and carrying black powder is handled like carrying any other handgun if it is capped. Another poster earlier was talking about Texas....

You need to check out the laws of Missouri. Look here.

http://www.packing.org/state/missouri/