Do you break in your carry pistol with 500 rounds?

[Warp]

I use Glocks. My "break-in" involves proper installation of night sights and running a box of ammo through it. Done.

I did that with a new Glock once. Second time to the range it proved unreliable on any and all JHP's and even after being returned to Glock it was still unreliable on JHP's. This was after "a few mags" of JHP and a couple boxes of FMJ to start off.

You're only cheating yourself.

 

[Hangingrock]

Most semi-autos have designed lifespan of 50,000 rounds.

Not meant to be argumentative but from what informational source was the figure of 50,000 rounds established?. I always find it to be interesting how certain parameters are established.

 

[FL-NC]

I did that with a new Glock once. Second time to the range it proved unreliable on any and all JHP's and even after being returned to Glock it was still unreliable on JHP's. This was after "a few mags" of JHP and a couple boxes of FMJ to start off.

You're only cheating yourself.

I have about 10 Glocks, and we were issued G19 at one place I worked and G17 where I am now. virtually all problems were due to old magazines, whether the pistols were brand new or had been around for a while. Unreliable Glocks (except those that were really worn out) has never been my experience.

 

[Warp]

I have about 10 Glocks, and we were issued G19 at one place I worked and G17 where I am now. virtually all problems were due to old magazines, whether the pistols were brand new or had been around for a while. Unreliable Glocks (except those that were really worn out) has never been my experience.

That's good.

But it is certainly possible.

It only took me 8 Glocks to have one that wouldn't reliably feed JHP, even though it went 100+ rounds of FMJ and "a couple mags" (may have been 3 mags) of JHP without problem. This was with the new magazines that came with the new gun (failures across all mags, the problem was the gun)

You can rely on "I've tried 10 and they were all reliable so every one always will be", but for something you may bet your life on, well, not sure that's smart

 

[rskent]

You all seem to have some very reliable guns. Much more than me.

I have never had a gun that didn’t have some kind of failure. My last

purchase was a Glock 43. It has settled down to be very reliable. The

first time I had it to the range to try it out I had two failure to feeds and

two bump fires. Never had one of those before, or since. The gun needed

to run a while to smooth things out inside and I needed to get used to

the light weight and fairly stout recoil. All is well now. But it took

more than a few rounds to get there.

 

[.308 Norma]

two bump fires. Never had one of those before, or since.

Wow! I've never had one of those. Did it scare you? It sure as heck would have scared me!

 

[shooter1]

Everything mechanical can, and will, fail at some point. There are too many variables to reliably predict the cycle range in which that will occur. If you run 500 trouble free rounds thru a gun, using a certain ammo, in designated magazines, a failure may occur at round 501. Best we can do is to properly maintain our firearms, and frequently visually inspect the parts that are most prone to wear and breakage that can cause failures.

I think the odds are the same, if not better, if you test your ammo of choice by firing a magazine or two, and calling it good. I hear it often, but have my doubts that anyone buys a new firearm and runs $500 worth of ammo thru it before carrying it. If anyone here does, you have a lot more money than I do.

Good luck to all!
str1

 

[rskent]

Wow! I've never had one of those. Did it scare you? It sure as heck would have scared me!

I don’t know if it scared me, but I paid much more attention to what was going on after that.

You don’t expect that kind of thing with a 9mm. A full house 44 Mag maybe, but not a 9mm.

I hang on much tighter now.

 

[BSA1]

Not meant to be argumentative but from what informational source was the figure of 50,000 rounds established?. I always find it to be interesting how certain parameters are established.

Sorry for the delay. I had quit following this topic several days and just happened to check it again since it is still active.

SIGArms has a program where they take used handguns that are traded in by law Enforcement Agencies, reconditioned them and then resale them. My SIG P239 9mm is one such gun. When I purchased the gun the SIG Gunsmith that reconditioned my gun told me that SIG rates the life of it for 50,000 rounds. The gunsmith estimated that my gun had about 3,000 rounds fired through it when I brought it.

Based on this information I believe that 50,000 rounds is a good number to use on all alloy frame 9mm semi-autos from the big manufacturers such as S&W, Beretta and Ruger.

From what I have read the same semi-autos chambered in 40 S&W develop problems sooner. Since I don't own a 40 S&W I have no first hand knowledge if it is true. Nor do I have any first hand knowledge of the life-span of plastic frame semi-autos. All I know is what manufacturers like Glock tells us.

 

[BSA1]

Everything mechanical can, and will, fail at some point. There are too many variables to reliably predict the cycle range in which that will occur. If you run 500 trouble free rounds thru a gun, using a certain ammo, in designated magazines, a failure may occur at round 501. Best we can do is to properly maintain our firearms, and frequently visually inspect the parts that are most prone to wear and breakage that can cause failures.

I think the odds are the same, if not better, if you test your ammo of choice by firing a magazine or two, and calling it good.

If that is the case why not just fire one round and call it good? After all there is the risk the gun may break on the 2nd round.

I hear it often, but have my doubts that anyone buys a new firearm and runs $500 worth of ammo thru it before carrying it. If anyone here does, you have a lot more money than I do.

That is exactly why many of us that like to shoot a lot reload our own ammunition. I don't know where you are coming up with shooting 500 Dollars worth of ammo when the topic is shooting 500 ROUNDS. Big difference between the two.

Good luck to all!
str1[/QUOTE]

 

[shooter1]

If that is the case why not just fire one round and call it good? After all there is the risk the gun may break on the 2nd round.

Absolutely true. Some might be comfortable with one loading and firing cycle before carrying. My comfort level depends at least partially on the platform being tested. Some designs are historically more reliable than others. Your experience may be different. My experience with a proven platform pistol has been, if it cycles through a complete magazine of carry ammo, it will continue to do so as long as it's maintained properly, or something breaks. My opinion based on my experiences and observations. Your experience may be different. I can only speak to mine.


That is exactly why many of us that like to shoot a lot reload our own ammunition. I don't know where you are coming up with shooting 500 Dollars worth of ammo when the topic is shooting 500 ROUNDS. Big difference between the two.

My reference to the $500 was directed to those who shoot 500rds of carry ammo before they trust their carry system. I think we can all agree that most defensive ammo de jour goes for about a buck per pop.
As I am also a reloader, I well understand the difference in cost of factory ammo and reloaded. I shoot 4-5 action pistol matches a month, which involves a bit more than 500rds. My current cost for a loaded 9mm round is about .11 cents per, .40 and .45 a couple pennies more. So, I do understand the economics.
Good luck to all!
str1

[/QUOTE]
Sorry all, looks like I messed up formatting this post.

 

[Hangingrock]

Sorry for the delay. I had quit following this topic several days and just happened to check it again since it is still active.

Thank you for your reply. There is no need to apologize. I found what you wrote to interesting and informative.

 

[Drail]

I can still remember watching a pro shooter for a factory team (I won't mention his name) but he was using a 1911 built by the factory custom shop that was hand tuned and tweaked to the nth degree and had probably fired many thousands of rounds perfectly. In the middle of a stage at a National Match his gun jammed and the look on his face was priceless. That day I learned to never have 100% faith in any magazine fed handgun. From that day forward I only carry revolvers for street use. I built and competed with 1911s for many years and I dearly love the gun but I know how many things can go wrong with one. You would be amazed at how many things can stop a bottom feeder, even one that you trust implicitly. Just because you put 500 rounds through a semi auto does not mean it is reliable enough to self defense. It might be - or it might just stop when you least expect it. If you are going to stake your life on a semi auto you should carry a back up gun.

 

[Warp]

I can still remember watching a pro shooter for a factory team (I won't mention his name) but he was using a 1911 built by the factory custom shop that was hand tuned and tweaked to the nth degree and had probably fired many thousands of rounds perfectly. In the middle of a stage at a National Match his gun jammed and the look on his face was priceless. That day I learned to never have 100% faith in any magazine fed handgun. From that day forward I only carry revolvers for street use. I built and competed with 1911s for many years and I dearly love the gun but I know how many things can go wrong with one. You would be amazed at how many things can stop a bottom feeder, even one that you trust implicitly. Just because you put 500 rounds through a semi auto does not mean it is reliable enough to self defense. It might be - or it might just stop when you least expect it. If you are going to stake your life on a semi auto you should carry a back up gun.

Revolvers fail too you know.

My top two carry guns of late, both semi autos, have a combined 7,360 rounds with 1 failure of any kind...and that failure was with cheap weak ammo in the first 150 rounds from new (FTRTB). They also have at LEAST 550 rounds of JHP through them.

 

[Drail]

Really??? Yes, I know that very well but revolvers fail at a fraction of the rate of semi autos if they are set up properly, built properly and maintained - especially the older S&W guns. There are still a great many more things that can stop a semi auto (or its magazine). I have seen most of them. In all the years I competed with both semi autos and revolvers I only had one malfunction with a revolver and it was because of a case with an out of spec rim (and it cost me a stage). I now measure and inspect cases very carefully for carry ammo. There was a time not too awful long ago when you could take almost any major brand of revolver out of the box and it was extremely reliable. Sadly that seems to no longer be true.

 

[DT Guy]

Really??? Yes, I know that very well but revolvers fail at a fraction of the rate of semi autos if they are set up properly, built properly and maintained - especially the older S&W guns. There are still a great many more things that can stop a semi auto (or its magazine). I have seen most of them. In all the years I competed with both semi autos and revolvers I only had one malfunction with a revolver and it was because of a case with an out of spec rim (and it cost me a stage). I now measure and inspect cases very carefully for carry ammo. There was a time not too awful long ago when you could take almost any major brand of revolver out of the box and it was extremely reliable. Sadly that seems to no longer be true.

While I generally agree with this, I would add that the (relatively few) revolver malfunctions I've experienced usually needed a bench and tools to rectify; they weren't comparable to the the 'stoppage' you are likely to get with an auto.

Larry

 

[Drail]

Yes, but more important to me is what caused the stoppage and can it be prevented from happening again. But you are correct - most of the time a revolver stops working you will need at the very least a Swiss army knife and a few minutes to put it back in service.

 

[JTQ]

I can still remember watching a pro shooter for a factory team (I won't mention his name) but he was using a 1911 built by the factory custom shop that was hand tuned and tweaked to the nth degree and had probably fired many thousands of rounds perfectly. In the middle of a stage at a National Match his gun jammed and the look on his face was priceless. That day I learned to never have 100% faith in any magazine fed handgun. From that day forward I only carry revolvers for street use.

Revolver's aren't immune either

 

[Drail]

While I fully understand that a defective firing pin can break I have never, ever seen one break in a S&W revolver in over 20 years of tuning them and competing with them. But all of my experience has been with revolvers made long before S&W changed the design and went to the frame mounted pins. I would love to know if that was the newer style frame mounted pin that failed and how that pin was manufactured - forged, cast or MIM. I am going to guess that it was the new style. If it was - there is the problem. None of my S&W revolvers have the frame mounted pin and I would not buy one that had a frame mounted pin. Note that Jerry said in twenty years of running revolvers (and he runs them hard) he has never seen a firing pin break. That's a pretty good reliability rate as far as I am concerned. I would really love to know what he found out on that gun because I am sure he took a very hard look as to why that happened. I still have much more faith in a DA revolver than any semi auto. If Jerry's firing pin was defective as manufactured then it makes no difference whether it was installed in a revolver or a semi auto.

 

[Blue Thunder]

I took a Gun Fighting Course 6 years ago with my Carry G-19 that had a couple thousand of WWB ammo thru it and a box of Personal Defense ammo thru it. Two day course with an advertised 500 rounds of ammo to bring. Brought 300 rounds of Remington Golden Sabres +P and 350 rounds of Winchester Ranger T +P+ 127 gr. Shot all 650 rounds with zero failures to fire or extract. I also had 15 mags for the gun who all got tested. It did cost almost more to shoot the ammo than the cost of the course, but I wanted to know about the reliability of the Gun that I stake my life on. I settled that question in my mind and all is good to go. Since then I have run another 500+ rounds of Ranger T plus range ammo of a couple thousand thru it with no issues and the gun is still in one piece with all factory original parts in it.

 

[BSA1]

ALL handguns used for self-defense whether revolver or semi-auto should be tested with several hundred rounds.

A few years ago I brought a Law Enforcement Agency S&W Model 10 trade in for $200.00. It checked out fine in the LGS and function fine the first time on the range. However on the next couple of range visits the gun would bind up after about firing three rounds making the trigger pull so hard it was near impossible to shoot it. Checked the usual causes and even replacing the ejector rod with no improvement. I sent the gun back to S&W and they fixed it for $100.00. Repair ticket says "Correct ammo binding." Gun now has a new out-of-box action and functions perfectly.

If I had took the cheap way out with testing this gun by only shooting one or two boxes of ammunition through it I would not have discovered the ammo binding problem.

I now trust this gun for S.D.. I just need to start shooting it regularly once the weather warms up to start getting the action smoother.

 

[SonofGilnockie89]

For me it depends. If the new gun is a platform with which I'm less familiar then I'll try and get 200 rounds or so through it for familiarization. When I switched back to the G19 last year I put 50 rounds through as a function check and haven't worried about it since. I do always run at least a few rounds of any new to me carry ammo just to be sure but I don't buy this notion that modern firearms need to be "broken in"

 

[Warp]

For me it depends. If the new gun is a platform with which I'm less familiar then I'll try and get 200 rounds or so through it for familiarization. When I switched back to the G19 last year I put 50 rounds through as a function check and haven't worried about it since. I do always run at least a few rounds of any new to me carry ammo just to be sure but I don't buy this notion that modern firearms need to be "broken in"

I think it's more about testing and verifying function than 'breaking in'

 

[BSA1]

I did that with a new Glock once. Second time to the range it proved unreliable on any and all JHP's and even after being returned to Glock it was still unreliable on JHP's. This was after "a few mags" of JHP and a couple boxes of FMJ to start off.

You're only cheating yourself.

I think it's more about testing and verifying function than 'breaking in'

Excellent responses although those that do not do so will probably continue not to.

 

[Blkhrt13]

Every single one but my revolvers