Elk Hunter Charged by Mountain Lion

[.38 Special]

Yes, and he "probably" would have hit it when it came in closer, possibly would have dropped the woobie (hopefully) and made a better two handed aimed shot.

For sure, some people are cool under pressure, some are not. Ya got it, or ya don't. I'm thankful that I "got it" and can function well in those situations. If you don't "got it", then training and practice becomes even more important so that hopefully the training takes over in such situations. Of course, "having it" (coolness under pressure) and training combined is the best of both worlds.

Yes, I'm glad he came through okay, and that the bang-bang noise worked, but again we can all learn something from the critique, and being a little hard on the guy. I know I'd be much harder on myself had I made such mistakes. And now because of this I'm a little more "cougar aware". Up to now, I've taken them very lightly.

I like to think of myself as a fairly collected guy. I was a paramedic a long time ago and functioned well through all sorts of nonsense. Mountain lions, for some reason, scare the daylights out of me, and the few times I've come across one it was all I could do to not to curl up into a ball and cry like a little girl.

I'll bet I could still have shot reasonably well - assuming I could remember how to operate the zipper on my chest rig - but never in a million years would I have thought to pull out a cell phone.

 

[starling]

I like to think of myself as a fairly collected guy. I was a paramedic a long time ago and functioned well through all sorts of nonsense. Mountain lions, for some reason, scare the daylights out of me, and the few times I've come across them it was all I could do to not to curl up into a ball and cry like a little girl.

I'll bet I could still have shot reasonably well - assuming I could remember how to operate the zipper on my chest rig - but never in a million years would I have thought to pull out a cell phone.

My best guess there is he was filming it before it really started becoming a threat and got close. Then he realized..holy cow this thing is moving in. Seems pretty strange that it the cat would just approach him right in the open like that. Was acting more like a dog then a cat.

Kind of neat that he recorded it so well though. Give us something to look at, study, and learn from. The guy missed his calling as a wildlife filmaker. Hes deffinitly got some serious multitasking ability under stress.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

I'm telling y'all, dude needs a go-pro! And a drone that tracks him as he strolls through lion country. And maybe a bigger pistol. PCC? Perhaps a double barrel 12 gauge hammer gun. Dude should start a go-fund-me so he can do all this. Dude has potential! As a film-maker...maybe not so much as a hunter.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

Give us something to look at, study, and learn from.

Exactly. Bingo! And as mentioned, I think I'll take them big kitty-kats a bit more seriously now. Might put a little more thought into my back-drop when calling them kitties in. That one that got within ten feet of me, (from behind and on my left) I thought I heard something, but after a good listen, and hearing nothing more, I figured it was a squirrel. Dang! He was a big guy too, those suckers are quiet.

 

[starling]

Exactly. Bingo! And as mentioned, I think I'll take them big kitty-kats a bit more seriously now. Might put a little more thought into my back-drop when calling them kitties in. That one that got within ten feet of me, (from behind and on my left) I thought I heard something, but after a good listen, and hearing nothing more, I figured it was a squirrel. Dang! He was a big guy too, those suckers are quiet.

Put some catnip in your pack and you should be good to go

https://bigcatrescue.org/cats-in-a-spin-over-catnip/

 

[Hugger-4641]

Good to see the hunter chased it off. There is rumors of cougars in my area. I have not saw one yet. My son claims to have. But he stretches the truth often. Camping i did hear screaming from something. And the dogs were going crazy. Maybe it was a cougar???

Just a few years ago you were considered crazy if you said you saw a cougar here in West TN.
Now that they are confirmed by TWRA , you suddenly aren't crazy anymore.
They've been here all along, but now they are prolific enough and cameras are abundant enough that there is no longer any doubt.

 

[buck460XVR]

Poor shooting on his part, plain and simple.

Maybe, but most of us, under duress, shooting a fixed sighted handgun one handed, would probably shoot about the same. I guessing the hunter knew the accuracy of what he and his gun were capable of, and thus why he waited so long to take the first shot.

In guiding hunts and talking to many other hunters, one thing I have come to realize is that hunters often do not understand animal behavior.

IMHO, this hunter understood completely and correctly read the animal's behavior. Why he felt he didn't need to put the phone down and that he still had the upper hand in the attack. Despite all the criticism here, the hunter stopped the attack, without killing the animal, which may not have been legal. This also may be why he kept his phone on, so he had proof it was a legitimate attack and he did indeed have to protect himself. Here in Wisconsin we have several reports of bear attacks every year by hunters. After being investigated, the amount of legitimate attacks is trivial compared to those bears killed just because they were seen by someone with a gun in their hand. This hunter did everything by the book and was well prepared. I wonder how many of us here would do as well.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

Yeah I should pay some attention to that. Drawing from concealment, and putting the first shot in the vital zone in under two seconds is my favorite, or "go to" drill, but I always have two hands on the pistol when I shoot. But yes, one doesn't always have both hands available in an emergency for any number of reasons. (but certainly not because I'd be holding a cell phone!!!!)

I had a very neat firearms instructor early on that explained you have your dominant hand and Smart Hand. Your dominant hand runs the gun and that it all it does. The Smart Hand does everything else, but also may be required to help run the gun or run the gun when the dominant hand gets hurt. Everything else includes fending off blows, finding car/door keys, staunching wounds, dragging another person to safety, opening doors, giving hand signals to other responders, driving a car, dialing a cell phone to get more help, etc. Cell phones really are emergency equipment, more so than a firearm in terms of frequency of use for emergencies, so the presence of a cell phone in a crisis isn't necessarily superfluous (not unless you are trying to be TikTok famous), but as with any of your gear, the timing and application of its use needs to be appropriate.

I doubt he even realized he was still recording it.

You can tell he doesn't know he is recording by how poorly he kept the mountain lion in frame while the cell phone out in front of him and how well he shot as a result. Oh wait, he did an excellent job of keeping the mountain lion in frame, often centered quite nicely, and a terrible job of shooting. He DEFINITELY was actively using the cell phone to video the event and did a good job with the videography in terms of tracking a moving object and keeping it fairly well centered in frame. So it was no coincidence that he managed to hold a cell phone in one hand while keeping a mountain lion in frame and mostly well centered while in Portrait mode (more difficult than Landscape mode for items moving on the landscape, lol). He got the proper shot, but not with his firearm.

My best guess there is he was filming it before it really started becoming a threat and got close.

And, given the opportunity, I would have been filming as well, until things went south.

Seems pretty strange that it the cat would just approach him right in the open like that. Was acting more like a dog then a cat.

LOL, it is a cat. Your family cat and a mountain lion have a LOT of behaviors in common, but a very different size scale. So what you consider to be behavior of your domestic cat is also the behavior of a mountain lion in many respects. They look similar because they are similar.

Here is a bear just following a 12 year old child, with some very dog-like behavior. My dogs used to follow my kids around like this when they had (and were dropping) food when they were very little. The scene almost seems cute, just a boy and his big, fuzzy pet, just having a good time in nature...

 

[starling]

Maybe, but most of us, under duress, shooting a fixed sighted handgun one handed, would probably shoot about the same. I guessing the hunter knew the accuracy of what he and his gun were capable of, and thus why he waited so long to take the first shot.





IMHO, this hunter understood completely and correctly read the animal's behavior. Why he felt he didn't need to put the phone down and that he still had the upper hand in the attack. Despite all the criticism here, the hunter stopped the attack, without killing the animal, which may not have been legal. This also may be why he kept his phone on, so he had proof it was a legitimate attack and he did indeed have to protect himself. Here in Wisconsin we have several reports of bear attacks every year by hunters. After being investigated, the amount of legitimate attacks is trivial compared to those bears killed just because they were seen by someone with a gun in their hand. This hunter did everything by the book and was well prepared. I wonder how many of us here would do as well.

Hard to say what I would do. If I knew he was stalking I could see myself backing off the game kill and seeing what he would do and go from there. Hoing head to head with a big cat is not my idea of a good time. Neither is trying to move a game kill while an apex predator is looking for an opportunity. This would be like fighting off a big shark while spear fishing and swimming back to the boat with a good catch. Always have to take into account whos domain your in.

There could even be two cats or another predator watching. This is why I would be hunting in pairs in that area. Never hurts to have an extra set of eyes on your side.

I dont think of these like house cats. Your talking knives for fingers, daggers for teath, stealth, speed, and they are strong. They spend much of their day hunting for daily survival where as most people do it for recreation or to fill the freezer. Chances of surviving a phtsical encounter are pretty shakey. They can be on you throat before you even know they are there. They are not concerned with legalities either. This is respecting nature and being in the wild type stuff. People have to follow the rules... wild animals dont. That cat could care less about being recorded by a phone or having him/herself on youtube.

The hunter in the vid has just been conditioned by modern society. He sees something neat and thinks... I have to record this. Nothing wrong with that he just kinda forgot whos domain he was in and got a little distracted from the danger of the situation. People do this every day... driving the car looking at the phone. Walking in the forest looking around and stepping in a hole. Running for the phone or doorbell and stubbing a toe or stepping on your kids Legos etc. etc. Its more common than people realize.

Point is when you are out of your domain in predator territory its good practice to not get distracted and stay in that "situational awareness mode. Kudos to him for spotting the threat early enough to even see it coming. It likely saved his life so promoting this guy like some bumbling idiot is kind of nonsense and silly.

Ill say it again... the guy is lightning fast on the trigger. Watch just before the first shot and you can see the front paw leave the ground. His timing was perfection. He was quicker than the cat. Very impressive if it was not pure coincidence. If he didnt shoot at that exact moment that cat would have been airborn and landed right on his chest and probably would have had his mouth clenched around his throat. Pretty obvious he didnt want to shoot unless it was absolutely necessary....which it was IMO.

Thats me though.. I wont kill stuff unless its for food or absolutely necessary. Even pest animals I tend to deter them or catch and relocate them. Had to relocate a copperhead from our property a few weaks ago. Pretty snake... chopping it up kinda sends a bad message to my kids about respecting nature so I dont do it. Im not some tree hugger either.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

Thats me though.. I wont kill stuff unless its for food or absolutely necessary. Even pest animals I tend to deter them or catch and relocate them. Had to relocate a copperhead from our property a few weaks ago. Pretty snake... chopping it up kinda sends a bad message to my kids about respecting nature so I dont do it. Im not some tree hugger either.

Same here, but anything coming at me within 25 yards is going to be shot. I'm a bit of a tree-hugger, I found some old growth Cedars in a far-off spot in the mountains, and hugged them. It was/is pretty exciting to find something like that.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

Very impressive if it was not pure coincidence

Pure co-ink-a-dense, in my opinion. But...as is often the case, I could be wrong! However, I didn't/don't get the impression he is a very competent person, or competent with a pistol, in this situation.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

Cell phones really are emergency equipment,

I will confess, before all, that actually I do own a phone. Please don't tell. But, it stays in the bottom of the pack, when hunting/hiking/exploring/trekking, or inside vest pocket when riding the motorcycle(s), and I usually only turn it on once every two weeks or so to check the battery...which is often dead. !!! When hunting/hiking/trekking I sometimes take a picture or two with it, as it is lighter than taking a camera. (and no cell-coverage in my mountains) But, compared to the camera, picture quality is not "great". When I hunt the State Land, I have the wife drop me off and pick me up (two miles from home) so I will message her when I'm ready to go home, and where to pick me up. Otherwise...I don't need no stinking phone. Other than waiting for a confirmation from the wife that she's on the way, the phone is always off, don't take calls of messages, or any internet stuff.

 

[.308 Norma]

Might put a little more thought into my back-drop when calling them kitties in. That one that got within ten feet of me, (from behind and on my left) I thought I heard something, but after a good listen, and hearing nothing more, I figured it was a squirrel. Dang! He was a big guy too, those suckers are quiet.

Yeppers. As I said, we do have a lot of cougars around here, and because I'd heard stories is the reason I always coyote hunted with a partner that I'd sit back-to-back with when calling. I didn't want a ticked off buzz saw with fur instead of a "song-dog" coming in behind me thinking I was a dying rabbit.
BTW, I used to hunt black bears up in the Salmon River country with a friend, and believe it or not, that friend had killed a couple of black bears after calling them in with a dying rabbit call. However, he also had a black bear come in from behind him once, so he always had me sit back-to-back with him while he called.
He told me that the time one came in from behind, he heard something, and turned just in time to look a very surprised black bear in the face only 10 or 12 feet away. He said the bear whirled around and tore off up the hill though before he could even get a shot.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

and believe it or not, that friend had killed a couple of black bears after calling them in with a dying rabbit call.

I originally was more interested in calling in a bear. I've had no luck with that, but have had good luck calling in the cats, and one day called in two wolves that came in to 25 yards before I realized something was staring at me. !!! (lost fawn call) I had a good back-drop that day, and one of the wolves slowly walked around to my left, and then behind me. But again, I had a good blow-down and berm, and briars and brambles behind me. However, I don't think they had any intent of eating me or being aggressive, and the other wolf spun around and took off.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

Your talking knives for fingers, daggers for teath,

 

[.308 Norma]

Not to downplay the importance of being "situationally aware" while hunting (or anything else) while in "cougar country," but I doubt there's been more than a year or two go by in the last 15 years when a cougar didn't wander into the "big city" of Pocatello, Idaho in the winter. They're often first spotted on campus at Idaho State University, or in the old cemetery - probably because there's a lot of trees in both areas.
More often than not, a couple of small dogs get taken before the Idaho Department of Fish and Game darts the cougars and hauls them back up into the hills. Of course, now that concealed carry is legal even on Idaho's college and university campuses (with an Idaho "enhanced" CCW license) maybe there will be fewer small dogs taken before the culprit cougars get darted and hauled off themselves. And we could even start a "What Gun for In-town Cougars" (the four-legged kind) thread.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

Not to downplay the importance of being "situationally aware" while hunting (or anything else) while in "cougar country," but I doubt there's been more than a year or two go by in the last 15 years when a cougar didn't wander into the "big city" of Pocatello, Idaho in the winter. They're often first spotted on campus at Idaho State University, or in the old cemetery - probably because there's a lot of trees in both areas.
More often than not, a couple of small dogs get taken before the Idaho Department of Fish and Game darts the cougars and hauls them back up into the hills. Of course, now that concealed carry is legal even on Idaho's college and university campuses (with an Idaho "enhanced" CCW license) maybe there will be fewer small dogs taken before the culprit cougars get darted and hauled off themselves. And we could even start a "What Gun for In-town Cougars" (the four-legged kind) thread.

 

[toivo]

He was hunting with a long gun, right? So the only reason to use the pistol was to keep one hand free to record the encounter with the phone. Not smart, IMO. It could have gone very badly, and he's lucky that it didn't.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

He was hunting with a long gun, right? So the only reason to use the pistol was to keep one hand free to record the encounter with the phone. Not smart, IMO. It could have gone very badly, and he's lucky that it didn't.

That still seems to be a bit of a mystery. As mentioned before, there seems to be a recent youtube fad where you strap your rifle to the pack, and only take it off when you are glassing, or after you "spot" something. So...perhaps? Or I wonder, did he just have it slung? That kind of really doesn't make sense to me, that anyone would leave a rifle slung on their shoulder, grab the cell phone, and wave a Glock around, in that situation. As far as as a video providing proof of a defensive shooting, I'd take care of business first, and take my chances with the game dept. later. So yeah...where WAS the rifle??? Previously, I could understand a bow being strapped on the pack, again, as bow hunters after elk would usually (always?) call until they got an answer, then set-up, get ready, and try to call the bull all the way in. Not so much the SOP for rifle hunting.

 

[Navy87Guy]

Sometimes it’s better to be lucky than good — as long as you know the difference!

It looks like the first shot might have hit the cat, but it collected itself and went back on the attack. The second shot (a clear miss in the dirt) managed to scare it off. But now there’s an angry, wounded cat wandering around in the woods. Yikes!!

It’s amazing to me that he managed to back up without tripping over a tuft of grass or bush. I have no doubt that if he had ended up on the ground, we’d be watching an entirely different video!

 

[alsaqr]

He was hunting with a long gun, right?

See post 21. It was archery elk season.

 

[buck460XVR]

See post 21. It was archery elk season.

The second sentence in the linked article says it was an early season rifle hunt.

 

[tominboise]

It's archery elk season in Idaho at the moment. I presume the guy was archery hunting and carrying the pistol for issues like this (legal to do in Idaho).

Turns out I was incorrect - the article states that it was in an early rifle season hunt. Most elk hunting here now is archery, hence my confusion. Anyway, if I have a choice of rifle or pistol for a mountain lion, I am choosing the rifle every time if I can.

Given the rise in grizzly bear population in the intermountain west, many hunters are packing along handguns as bear protection (myself included). I don't know that I'd choose a 40S&W for it, but better then nothing.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

As I usually carry a cap-N-ball revolver, I can't say anything negative about the Glock. But, I always keep my rifle in hand, never slung or strapped to a pack. It is my primary weapon. Indeed, I'll take the rifle over any pistol every time. (multiple shots at a wolf pack closing in, might empty the revolver first)(carefully with well aimed shots) If in the mountains with a bow, then I'll carry my .44 Mag or .45Colt. Although, I have wandered the mountains with bow and Plains Pistol (loaded with a slug and 65 grains of Swiss) which in hind-sight I'm not sure if I'll do that again. !!! (not with the bow, with a rifle or musket, the Plains Pistol is a good companion)

 

[toivo]

See post 21. It was archery elk season.

Rifle hunt, according to the article:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/w...pc=U531&cvid=172d43317d4d4171bb49e80ebcf7b174