Firearms research for a novel

[Zak Smith]

I believe you could make AP ammo in .40 and .45 if you wanted to. If nothing else, a sabot would have quite a high velocity from the large bore (F=P*A)

 

[UKKnowledgeSeeker]

For penetration high velocity and low surface area is king. Sabots are a bit untried for me...

 

[Shadow 7D]

OOH, well here
how bout a nice Tokarev pushing a sabot
http://www.gunauction.com/search/displayitem.cfm?itemnum=8408469

One of the rifles that competed unsuccessfully for the M4 trials was a H&K that shot saboted ammo, it was VERY effective against armored targets, but, like all AP, it punched a SMALL hole straight through and through.

 

[UKKnowledgeSeeker]

Might include sabots, seems well suited to a burst fire assault rifle somehow. How does one go about solving the dilemma as it seems to me:


High Penetration against Armour = Poor Terminal Effects, Less Energy Dump, Through and Through

High Terminal Effectiveness against the body = Poor Armour Penetration

 

[Shadow 7D]

You don't, you pick the ammo you need to fit the job

un armored rear troop and civies, FMJ
armored troops - AP

or you make something like API(E) Armor piercing incendiary
or this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raufoss_Mk_211

 

[UKKnowledgeSeeker]

I'll work on something...

 

[UKKnowledgeSeeker]

Armour Piercing Fragmentation Round! AP-Frag!
Tungsten or similar tip with a frangible case behind it. Penetrates the target and fragments the case once inside a soft medium.

 

[Dr.Rob]

Seems to me like the average Brit would be stuck with 'stab proof' knives, bricks and molotov cocktails.

Criminals would be armed mostly with eastern bloc hardware that came out of the Balkans after formation of the EU.

The military might hand out what ever surplus arms they've stockpiled/surplused and not destroyed.

The UK's Main battle tanks, planes and aricraft carriers are top notch stuff, the Chinese equivalents are untested in battle. Suggest you read up on Jane's Defense for info on current trend in Chinese hardware. (They have a bunch of oddball small caliber rifles, handguns and PDW's in development and deployed) Also you're in a global recession/decession... doubt the UK will spend a bunch of hard currency re-arming/upgrading what they have in the next ten years.


You might look into the history of the UK's preparation for LOSING 'Operation Sealion' and being occupied my Nazi Germany. Field caches were created and stocked for covert operators (usually 2 man teams) whose main jobs were sabotage and assasination using a variety of crude but effective weaons (think Sten guns and the know how to make bombs whe their supply of military grade explosives were exhaused). See also the Welrod pistol.

 

[gyvel]

Take a look at some Youtube videos if you want to get an idea about the Chinese military forces.

China has no need to invade anybody, especially the UK, because they're already kicking everybody's rear ends economically.

 

[Jim Watson]

Reminds me of what a German said: "Next time we won't have to invade Poland, we will BUY it." That was before they took up the burden of East Germany in the reunification, though.

 

[UKKnowledgeSeeker]

@ Dr. Rob


Sorry for my absence,


Whilst tragic occurrences and the current lack of political support or even presence of a vocal pro-gun community limit the British public in times of peace we have formidable stock piles of weaponry, old service equipment and confiscated, ready to be handed out in the event of serious excrement impacting upon a moving rotary circulation system. The British are famed, in Britain, for their ability to both improvise and make to and mend. A Lee-Enfield or FN FAL are still exceedingly lethal. Even a good old Webley or Sten is much better than nothing. And you mustn't forget the millions of 12-gauge shotguns and hunting rifles abundant in Britain. I would feel more than up to fighting the PLA with something chambered in .375 H&H, 12 Gauge, .300 Win Mag etc. We're not a totally gun free society and we have shown the world more than once the British people are deadlier than our quaint appearance and bad teeth would have you first think! We are not quite as prickling with arms as America, and that irritates me greatly! !


Janes is great, please refer to the past few pages to find out why and how Britain is rearming.


Coincidentally my main characters get helped along by equipment laid back for stay behinds in a hypothetical Red Invasion during the Cold War. Much of the fighting by the Resistance will be reminiscent if the European/Jewish Resistance during WW2. I find the history surrounding stay behinds in both WW2 and the Cold War fascinating and chilling in equal measure. The Welrod, now where could that come in...

 

[UKKnowledgeSeeker]

@Watson & Guyvel


The economy relation West-China is nowhere near as stark or alarming as panicky media portray it to be. They make our stuff. They have money invested into our stock market, currency etc. IT CUTS BOTH WAYS! Except it's worse for them. If needs be we could go to India or Eastern Europe or even Russia for our factories. They can't get magic up such a massive export market as the West. In the real world, if China crushes us they crush themselves. In the books the UK are instrumental in the total embargo placed by the West on China. This crippled Chinas' economy and turned some parts into a North Korea look alike. The Communist regime know their time at the helm is limited unless they have a) an entity other than the national politicians that can be held responsible for the state of the country, like Hitler with the Jews and b) a distraction from the poverty, crime and corruption of China, nothing is better than a Great Patriotic War! Given the location of China an invasion of any West leaning country is improbable, except Japan and AS/NZ. These only really tagged along and wouldn't really be too much of a PR Coup. The PRC want the boogeyman, the UK. .

 

[Far East Sig]

Answering these questions would probably give away more of the book than you want to, I just wanted to give you some things to consider.
A couple of comments
First: Don't forget the flamethrowers - china is one of the few nations to still issue them to troops(i did not think it made sense for Olympic security either but oh well)
Second: Why go to UK? the #1 built in target and release point for political tensions in China is JAPAN. They are still playing sitcoms and TV movies daily on all the bad things the Japanese did in China. It has really created a victim mentality for the people which gets in the way of everything. I could probably start an anti Japanese riot by myself they are so primed for it and I’m a foreigner.
After going back and rereading some of your other answers if the UK started the boycott, then the Chinese people would feel fully justified in taking over the UK to pay them back, plus the propaganda value in the revenge for the loss of face during the opium wars and burning of the summer palace by British troops would be unbelievable. Just depends on how you tie it all together. (Japan would still be blamed even if the UK started it)
Third: How are you going to finish the story? The Chinese leaders cannot lose abroad as they are more afraid of their own people than Nuclear exchange with anyone. They really could care less how many casualties they take as long as they are perceived by their people as having won. Don’t forget the leadership in China were children during the Cultural Revolution and saw what happened to their parents when they lost power, had older brothers/sisters and parents tortured or suicided. (Ding Xiaoping’s son own son was pushed out a window, no wonder he killed the protesters in 1989) They will not go through that willingly.
You might want to use a variation of what Clancy did in “The Bear and the Dragon” but with the great China firewall in place I don’t know if that would work today or in ten years.
You have some real challenges ahead for you to write this story good luck.

 

[Germster]

Which side wins?

Just ask'n.