Ginex LRP

[Hugger-4641]

So I bought some Ginex primers a while back when there was not much else available and finally got around to loading some. Loadimg some range fodder and test loads with them and some CCI 34.
Well 50rds of Win brass and CCI 34 with some 165gr Speer btsp went without problems. Then I started trying to prime a few rds of the Ginex to try.
Ended up trying them in Win, Fed, LC, and RP brass. About 50% of them will go into the primer pocket. The RP case that looks normal was the third primer I tried to seat in it. Some wouldn't go in at all, some went in and deformed,, some with a concave face because of the force I had to put on them. Doubt if those will fire, but I had no choice as there's no other way to get the case out of the Lee Bench Prime I was using.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

So I bought some Ginex primers a while back when there was not much else available and finally got around to loading some. Loadimg some range fodder and test loads with them and some CCI 34.
Well 50rds of Win brass and CCI 34 with some 165gr Speer btsp went without problems. Then I started trying to prime a few rds of the Ginex to try.
Ended up trying them in Win, Fed, LC, and RP brass. About 50% of them will go into the primer pocket. The RP case that looks normal was the third primer I tried to seat in it. Some wouldn't go in at all, some went in and deformed,, some with a concave face because of the force I had to put on them. Doubt if those will fire, but I had no choice as there's no other way to get the case out of the Lee Bench Prime I was using.
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I think in this situation I would look at two options: reserve the Ginex primers for brass with larger/expanded primer cups. Also, if your priming setup allows you to turn the case while priming, try seating until you feel resistance, then turn 90-degrees and apply more pressure, then another turn, etc. until the primer is fully seated.

I know that sounds like a lot of extra work but then again it will also go quickly and you won’t waste as many primers, hopefully.

 

[AJC1]

I would try a press mounted priming system to see if the cup helps. My rcbs bench primer also has a primer cup..

 

[nettlle]

Ginex primers are hard to seat. Once you get them seated they shoot well. Everyone should have a RCBS bench primer. Just in case.

Automatic Priming Tool | RCBS

Buy Automatic Priming Tool at RCBS, the leading producer of high-quality reloading equipment supplies for over 60 years.

www.rcbs.com

 

[AJC1]

Ginex primers are hard to seat. Once you get them seated they shoot well. Everyone should have a RCBS bench primer. Just in case.

Automatic Priming Tool | RCBS

Buy Automatic Priming Tool at RCBS, the leading producer of high-quality reloading equipment supplies for over 60 years.

www.rcbs.com

That priming system saved the day when I started loading 45c. My rcbs universal sux with 45c.

 

[MarshallDodge]

Based on what looks to be a ridge around the primer pockets, some of them look like they could use a good swaging

 

[Hugger-4641]

Based on what looks to be a ridge around the primer pockets, some of them look like they could use a good swaging

I would agree if I hadn't just loaded 50rds of the same brass with CCI and no issues. The Lake City brass usually does need swagimg, but I've never had to swage Fed,RP, or Win brass.. I will try swaging some tomorrow and let you know how it goes though.

 

[9mmepiphany]

I would agree if I hadn't just loaded 50rds of the same brass with CCI and no issues.

That you can seat CCI primers without issue has almost no bearing on the ability to seat the Ginex, or any other primer, without swaging. Whenever you have cases with crimped primer pockets, you should always swage them.

Remember that Ginex primers are metric, so they'll be slightly larger in diameter. While American primer may be able to squeeze by a loose crimp, others will not

Disclaimer: I haven't loaded with Ginex LRP yet as my reloading is mostly handgun calibers, but their SPP have replaced CCI in my inventory as I've found them almost as sensitive as Federal SPP

 

[Hooda Thunkit]

That you can seat CCI primers without issue has almost no bearing on the ability to seat the Ginex, or any other primer, without swaging. Whenever you have cases with crimped primer pockets, you should always swage them.

I am in full agreement.

When I looked at the first picture I thought "That pocket looks to be crimped. I'm betting he has trouble seating the primers. "

I just went through the same problem with some 7.62x54r S&B brass. I was even using S&B primers, and having trouble inserting the primer into the same brand brass.
I looked close and saw that very small tell-tale circle outside the pocket. Even though I have never before seen crimped 7.62x54r brass, I went ahead and cut the primer pocket.

Just a twist or two with a primer pocket tool took care of the problem. A very slight bevel on the pocket entrance makes life so much easier.

 

[Hugger-4641]

I am in full agreement.

When I looked at the first picture I thought "That pocket looks to be crimped. I'm betting he has trouble seating the primers. "

I just went through the same problem with some 7.62x54r S&B brass. I was even using S&B primers, and having trouble inserting the primer into the same brand brass.
I looked close and saw that very small tell-tale circle outside the pocket. Even though I have never before seen crimped 7.62x54r brass, I went ahead and cut the primer pocket.

Just a twist or two with a primer pocket tool took care of the problem. A very slight bevel on the pocket entrance makes life so much easier.

All of this brass was run through my FA platinum primer reamer head, but I'm gonna run it through my RCBS swage die this evening and try again.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

All of this brass was run through my FA platinum primer reamer head, but I'm gonna run it through my RCBS swage die this evening and try again.

That’s nice but keep in mind: the Ginex primers are metric and therefore ever-so-slightly larger. They are going to be difficult to seat in a standard size primer cup. Even one which is just inside the specs. The only way they will seat easily is if you oversized the primer cups of your brass. Then you will have problems with the standard US non metric primers.

 

[CQB45ACP]

Based on what looks to be a ridge around the primer pockets, some of them look like they could use a good swaging

Yes, a real good swaging. Even reaming...never mind, that's another thread.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

Yes, a real good swaging. Even reaming...never mind, that's another thread.

You’re reminding me of the bear joke again

I think the “ridge” we’re seeing is an artifact of the reamer used and the cases not being perfectly square on entry. If you look closely you can see chatter marks left behind by the cutting edge of the reamer. A divot left behind by the reamer will look like a raised burr on camera.
At least, that’s my take.

 

[Mr_Flintstone]

These primers are typically on the upper end of acceptable tolerances. To compound that, they are usually a little harder than domestic primers. This sometimes leads to seating issues, including bending/deforming and not seating primers completely. I typically swage my brass if I'm going to use these.

 

[Nature Boy]

We could put an end to the mystery real quick if someone would just put a set of calipers on a few and see what they measure

 

[Hugger-4641]

We could put an end to the mystery real quick if someone would just put a set of calipers on a few and see what they measure

I will measure them and post this evening.
Fortunately I only have 1k of them, so I'm going to swage some Fed .308win cases and if that works I'll segregate a hundred or so use these primers exclusively in those cases.

 

[CQB45ACP]

You’re reminding me of the bear joke again

I think the “ridge” we’re seeing is an artifact of the reamer used and the cases not being perfectly square on entry. If you look closely you can see chatter marks left behind by the cutting edge of the reamer. A divot left behind by the reamer will look like a raised burr on camera.
At least, that’s my take.

Okay. 1) What's the bear joke and 2) whatya mean again?

 

[Soonerpesek]

Based on what looks to be a ridge around the primer pockets, some of them look like they could use a good swaging

Yes, a real good swaging. Even reaming...never mind, that's another thread.

…and add the fact that metric size primers are being used….

This exact scenario is where Glenn’s tapered reamer would shine…..

 

[Hugger-4641]

So swaging did solve the problem, and the measurements surprised me. Apparently its the softness of the cups that's causing the issue more than size. Not really any difference in dia. and the Ginex were actually more consistent in cup height.




Thanks to everyone for the replies. Gonna stick to my plan and segregate some cases for these primers.

 

[Hooda Thunkit]

So, it turns out that the Ginex LRP are not "ever so slightly larger in diameter" that some claim.

It turns out that Ginex LRP are indeed within spec, and in fact have diameter fluctuations the same as CCI.

It turns out that it was indeed a problem with the cartridge case itself, not the primer.

Given all that, why segregate brass for Ginex?

 

[Hugger-4641]

So, it turns out that the Ginex LRP are not "ever so slightly larger in diameter" that some claim.

It turns out that Ginex LRP are indeed within spec, and in fact have diameter fluctuations the same as CCI.

It turns out that it was indeed a problem with the cartridge case itself, not the primer.

Given all that, why segregate brass for Ginex?

Because, other than LC brass and a couple others, I'm not having to swage if I use CCI or Federal primers. Most of my brass in .308 is Fed, Win, and RP. I only have 1k Ginex and have a lot more CCI and Fed primers. No reason to do extra work or create loose primer pockets in all my brass sooner than necessary. I'll load the Ginex in a select batch and if the pockets loosen after 1 or two loadings, no biggie. I'll keep swagimg just enough brass to use up the Ginex. If the pockets don't loosen, then I might consider trying them in other brass or calibers.

 

[deadeye dick]

I think in this situation I would look at two options: reserve the Ginex primers for brass with larger/expanded primer cups. Also, if your priming setup allows you to turn the case while priming, try seating until you feel resistance, then turn 90-degrees and apply more pressure, then another turn, etc. until the primer is fully seated.

I know that sounds like a lot of extra work but then again it will also go quickly and you won’t waste as many primers, hopefully.

I do the same thing, turn and seat. It's a PITA but only have a few in my 38 SP cases

 

[EricBu]

I think everybody here is spot on. Myself, I love the Ginex primers, the Large Rifle are fantastic. I get the absolute best SD's on my long range stuff with it. As far as how I use them...all my bulk loaded brass is double swaged, and I lube it with a 1:10 mix of lanolin/99% alcohol from an aerosol sprayer. My long range stuff is all done on a single stage or a 550, so I just make sure I put some extra back into seating them, and check each one. The bulk stuff is processed on a 750 with an autodrive and swaged once with a swage it, and trimmed and sized there as well. I clean it again, then when I load it on a Mark 7 revo, I don't run a sizing die, but lube the brass anyway. I swage it aggressively (I use a cut out, and run the swage all the way up) with the Revo swage under a FW Arms spring loaded hold down. With that setup, the Ginex primers seat fully without issue. I do .30-06 on another 750 without a auto drive, and on that setup, I have to be very conscious of seating it fully. This year or next, that will replaced with a Super 1050, just because I don't think my shoulder has another year of handle cranking a 750 on it. On that, it's all new Starline brass, so no crimp to remove, but it's still a very tight seating.

 

[9mmepiphany]

under a FW Arms spring loaded hold down.

I keep seeing these pop up.

What do they do different/better?
Are they worth it?

 

[Evintos]

I keep seeing these pop up.

What do they do different/better?
Are they worth it?

They only work on presses that have a toolhead/die that come down onto the shell plate versus a ram raising a shell holder/plate up towards a fixed die. They improve consistency in primer seating depth or swage depth by holding the brass down onto the shell plate so when the primer (or swage rod tip) gets pushed into the pocket, it immediately goes into the pocket. With a press capable of using a hold down die and adjustable primer rod heights, you can target a specific value below flush you want your primers to be seated (relative to your primer pocket depth and primer thickness).

With normal priming in most presses or hand primers, the primer rod pushes the primer up into the pocket, however, since there's clearance between the top of the case rim and the shell holder/plate and nothing is holding the case down, the pusher will push both primer and case upwards until there's a hard stop (rim contacting shell holder/plate), before the primer enters the pocket. Since there's variability in case rim thickness, you have less consistency in primer seating depth (thicker rims encountering a hard stop before thinner rims) even with micro-adjustable primer seaters.