Glock ejects to face

[9mmepiphany]

Thanks for all the input, everyone. This gun isn't just throwing brass at me, it's having failures to extract, and extracting to the left and such. It ran like a top with 124gr. ammo, so I know that's a factor.

If it is extracting, I could almost live with BTF...not really, but I'm being generous...but having failures to extract, with any weight bullet, is just unacceptable in a defensive pistol. I never thought I'd hear folks using 1911 excuses for a stock Glock.

It doesn't matter what weight bullet they test them with. This isn't some collector piece or some super exotic pistol...it is designed as a working gun. Also 115gr bullets aren't uncommon. All 9mm service pistols should work with any factory bullet within the range of 115gr-147gr.

If you aren't aware of the issue with late Gen 3 and Gen 4 9mm Glocks, there is a lot of reading available on the internet. The Cliff Notes version is that the extractor is losing control of the casing after it is extracted from the chamber after being fired. The empty case is floating in the slide, moving to the rear through inertia, supported by the next round in the magazine. When the slide stops, the case is bouncing off the breechface, into the front of the ejection port, and out the top toward the shooter.

There is a easy test to see if your extractor is controlling the case after extraction. Just load a round from the magazine, remove the magazine, and fire the round. If the round drops out the magazine well, it wasn't being held by the extractor

 

[possum]

OP,

See my thread here:
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=746708

I fixed the brass to the face issue on my Gen 4 17. Maybe this will start you in the right direction.

 

[rs7]

Rember, Although they're light, Glock's are bottom heavy with a fully loaded magazine. As you fire,the lower gets lighter, changing the balance of the pistol (this happens less with steel framed pistols) . More effort is necessary to keep a firm wrist lock.

 

[9mmepiphany]

More effort is necessary to keep a firm wrist lock.

This is another oft repeated...usually as "limp wrist"...urban myth.

A firm wrist isn't needed...although Glock shooters will tell you it is...for a correctly functioning gun to cycle. All you have to do is have your wrist/forearm behind it to provide a pivot point.

I often demonstrate this to clients, to show that the gun won't jump out of their hand and hit them in the forehead, by firing a gun supported with just my loosely curled middle finger under the trigger guard holding the backstrap in the web of my hand. The gun does pivot higher, but it always functions. I've done this with just about every brand of polymer handgun out there (H&K, Glock, SIG, S&W, Springfield Armory, Ruger)

 

[Schwing]

Yet another reason I personally am not a Glock fan. I am cross dominant. I shoot right handed using my left eye which just compounds the problem.

 

[W.E.G.]

This is NOT a troll post.

I have owned 5 different 1911-pattern .45 ACP guns, and every single one of them pelted me in the face with brass.

I own several "full size" Gen 3 Glocks G17/G22, and none of them pelt me with brass.

While there is some empirical case to be made that "it doesn't matter" how you hold the gun as it pertains to BTF or other sundry autopistol maladies, it is my firm opinion that it actually DOES MATTER.

What's worse, there may be nothing you can do about it for your particular case. It could be that its just the shape/size/strength of your hand that is the element that is causing the gun to spit brass back in your face.

Changing a critical element - like shooting hotter/heavier ammo, or changing one part or another may remedy it.

I tried to like the 1911. I tried several "remedies" without success. In the end, I picked up a Glock, and to my considerable disappointment, I could find nothing to dislike about how it worked for me.

 

[GLOOB]

If it is extracting, I could almost live with BTF...not really, but I'm being generous...but having failures to extract, with any weight bullet, is just unacceptable in a defensive pistol. I never thought I'd hear folks using 1911 excuses for a stock Glock.

Well, there's a difference between a complete failure to extract and a stovepipe. If the former, then it needs fixing, for sure. If the latter, it really can just go away with break-in. Or a lighter recoil spring (if and when they begin to exist). Or more powerful ammo.

There's a bright side to the fact that American 115 gr ammo can barely function in a Gen4 G19. That means the Gen4 G23 has more room for error than before.

I don't know what to think about the whole outsourced extractor thing. My Gen 3 has a loose extractor, just as bad as my friend's gen4. The rim doesn't get grabbed between breechface and the extractor claw, as it does in many other designs. There's a little extra space. The big difference is the recoil spring. (When new, the gen 4 didn't BTF with WackyMart 115 gr ammo, but the brass dribbled out of the gun.)

 

[trigga]

i have two glocks both in 40 and they eject different, and yes different brand loads can have different power, not to mention weight. Never had one in the face or down my shirt until i started reloading. the weaker loads tend to just drop or barely eject the shells, but it cycles.

 

[trigga]

you might have to break it in too although it may be unheard of with glocks. honestly i prefer the gen 3. my g27 wouldn't function right with a 15 round mag reliable until about 200 rounds later. don't know if it was the recoil spring or something but it works now.

 

[eldon519]

I don't think it is specifically 115gr bullets as a flat rule but part of the problem is so many 115gr loads are anemic these days. As was mentioned, when working up a reload recipe from starting charge, the first loads often (but not always) eject erratically because they aren't getting kicked out with authority. 124 and 147 loads don't seem to be so commonly underloaded which might be why heavier loads were recommended. I think there is also a minimum recommended velocity of 1150 fps for 115 but I'd have to double check that.

Anyway, could be weak ammo or could be bad parts. Try it with more potent ammo and see if it goes away. Also if it is weak ammo, it actually might improve with break in as the spring will slowly wear in.

 

[Vodoun da Vinci]

This is another oft repeated...usually as "limp wrist"...urban myth.

A firm wrist isn't needed...although Glock shooters will tell you it is...for a correctly functioning gun to cycle. All you have to do is have your wrist/forearm behind it to provide a pivot point.

Not to get off thread but can you elaborate on this? My G26 does not have any problems for me in almost 2000 rounds down range...not one single FTF, FTE or BTF. It's like a sewing machine with my 125 gr. flat noses.

My Wife is 5' and maybe 115 lbs...she gets stove pipes now and again and FTF. Maybe one out of every 20 rounds. Same gun, same mags, same bullets out of the same box. Same with my Beretta Px4 SC which has never once failed for me.

If not an issue of support or limp wristing what are the other possibilities?

VooDoo

 

[9mmepiphany]

This is NOT a troll post.

Fear not, it doesn't read like a troll post at all and brings up some good points.

I have owned 5 different 1911-pattern .45 ACP guns, and every single one of them pelted me in the face with brass.

The nice thing about a 1911 is that it is usually easy to remedy it by either tuning the extractor or profiling the ejector...or both. If you know what you are doing, you can choose which direction you want the shells to launch at by just changing the profile

That is the same solution I am recommending for the Glock...an aftermarket extractor

While there is some empirical case to be made that "it doesn't matter" how you hold the gun as it pertains to BTF or other sundry autopistol maladies, it is my firm opinion that it actually DOES MATTER.

You're right it does make the problem worst as it allows the gun to lift further in recoil aims the ejection port more at your face as the casing bounces off the front of the ejection port. I was addressing the general belief that limp-wristing a Glock will cause it to not function

 

[9mmepiphany]

My Wife is 5' and maybe 115 lbs...she gets stove pipes now and again and FTF. Maybe one out of every 20 rounds. Same gun, same mags, same bullets out of the same box. Same with my Beretta Px4 SC which has never once failed for me.

If not an issue of support or limp wristing what are the other possibilities?

VooDoo

Without having seen her shoot, I would suspect it is her grip on a grip that is too large for her

If her hand/fingers aren't long enough to optimally grasp the frame and operate the trigger, a common "workaround" is to rotate the strong hand counter-clockwise around the frame so that the center of the backstrap is no longer aligned in the "pocket" formed by the web of the shooter's hand. This means that the wrist/forearm is no longer correctly behind the gun...as I mentioned in post #29...for the gun to recoil into.

I just had this same issue with a client on Monday. She was shooting a H&K P2000 with the smallest backstrap and she was "creeping" her hand around to reach the trigger. The solution was going to something that fit her better, like a Kahr

 

[Bovice]

I am new to Glocks and have a Gen 4 17 and a Gen 3 26, both were factory new when I bought them some months ago. I have only shot my usual 9mm reloads in them. The load is a fairly warm 124 grain round. I haven't had any brass that left the gun to hit my face unless it bounced off of something else to come back, like a stall divider. I have admittedly shot very little 115 grain ammo, and I'm past 1000 with the 17. I'll try 115 grain ammo next time and see if I can get it to hit me.

 

[Vodoun da Vinci]

Without having seen her shoot, I would suspect it is her grip on a grip that is too large for her

The solution was going to something that fit her better.....

Thank you...exactly the solution we used. The Glock 42 she has absolutely no problems with. I'd like that to be a 9mm solution but the size of the .380 Glock solved to feeding and ejection issues for her.

VooDoo

 

[HexHead]

Thanks for all the input, everyone. This gun isn't just throwing brass at me, it's having failures to extract, and extracting to the left and such. It ran like a top with 124gr. ammo, so I know that's a factor.

Those are all symptoms of weak ammo. When working up a 124gr load from minimum, I had loads that wouldn't cycle the slide, to where the brass ejected to the left, straight up, back at me and ultimately around the clock to where I wanted as I upped the charge 1/10th of a grain at a time.

 

[RustyShackelford]

Newer Glocks....

I'm not a Glocker but I'm thinking of buying a new Glock Gen 04 23 .40 or maybe the big Glock 41 .45acp for use on security posts.
My state has new bills to change the armed security requirements & the .40S&W/.45acp may soon be allowed for duty use(s).
I've seen & read a few gun forum posts saying Glock pistols that had problems with feeding/brass cases flying.
I'm not sure if a Gen 04 design or the ammunition is the problem but as a left handed shooter, I'm not thrilled with having hot cases smack me in the face.

Cases can spin up & hit you with many semi-auto pistols. It happened a few times with my M&P Compact .45acp in 2013.
I doubt the wt or design of the rounds are the problem.
Glock USA should T&E a few new designs or R&D new parts to correct these issues.

 

[stressed]

don't gotta worry about that with my Luger, pops it straight up and at times far over behind me..

That's odd. I am lucky as my glocks don't due that. and someone said something about lighter recoil spring.. it will just toss faster and further with lighter recoil spring. i have heavier recoil springs in my glocks and the casings go considerably less distance and less violently.

 

[Spats McGee]

spazzymcgee, if I may inquire, what brand of 115-gr target loads were you using? The 115-grain rounds that I was using were the TulAmmo BrassMaxx, and as I mentioned earlier, I haven't had any of these problems. Perhaps your G19 just didn't like the particular ammo you chose?

 

[spazzymcgee]

spazzymcgee, if I may inquire, what brand of 115-gr target loads were you using? The 115-grain rounds that I was using were the TulAmmo BrassMaxx, and as I mentioned earlier, I haven't had any of these problems. Perhaps your G19 just didn't like the particular ammo you chose?

I was using Parabellum Research 115gr. Perfect Practice. I'm thinking they were a little light for 115gr. It runs fine with 124gr., so I think I'll try some better 115gr. stuff. It's completely impossible to get it locally for under $20 a box though. How peppy is the Georgia Arms 124gr. stuff?

 

[Drail]

You need to buy the "optional" Glock face shield. Seriously, any pistol that throws empties into your face needs some adjustment and fitting. It's not an "ammo" problem. The problem is most of the factories don't care - because people will buy their poorly built products anyway. It's not about "quality" anymore - it's all about sales volume and profits.

 

[9mmepiphany]

I'm not a Glocker but I'm thinking of buying a new Glock Gen 04 23 .40 or maybe the big Glock 41 .45acp for use on security posts.

It isn't a chronic problem with Gen 4 non-9mm models.

My personal suspicion is that it is a byproduct of solving the issues with their Gen3 .40 models.

The good news is that the .40 caliber issues seem to have all been addressed.

My personal favorite, for CCW, has been a Gen2 G19

 

[9mmepiphany]

Thank you...exactly the solution we used. The Glock 42 she has absolutely no problems with. I'd like that to be a 9mm solution but the size of the .380 Glock solved to feeding and ejection issues for her.

VooDoo

While that wouldn't have been my first choice, if it works for you, I'd be happy.

I'd have been more inclined to go the Kahr CM9/PM9 or S&W M&P Shield route to replace the G26; or the Kahr CW9/P9 or S&W M&P 9c route in place of the Beretta Px4 SC

 

[W.E.G.]

I'm pretty sure if I had sent those 1911's back to Colt, or Springfield Armory, or Para-Ordnance, or Ballester-Molina they would have all refused to "modify" the gun so that they wouldn't BTF me.

I like to "spectate" at the range whenever I see somebody shooting a 1911. Some folks seem to have no problems. But, a fair number of them are dishing out BTF to the shooter. My favorite 1911 observation was a BTB (brass-to-bra). THAT was interesting.

If your Glock is dishing out BTF, it might well be that you should "just get rid of it."
Glock is a great gun for most shooters. Glock is not the holy grail.
I know I'll never have another 1911 BTF.
Works for me.

 

[9mmepiphany]

I'm pretty sure if I had sent those 1911's back to Colt, or Springfield Armory, or Para-Ordnance, or Ballester-Molina they would have all refused to "modify" the gun so that they wouldn't BTF me.

You might be safe with that statement about Colt, Para-Ord and Balester-Molina; but Springfield Armory and S&W would have adjusted it on their dime (provide shipping label).

I had a couple of friends who did just that. Besides reprofiling the ejector, they also adjusted the extractor and cleaned up the trigger...while they were in there anyway