Good .38 Spl defense loads?

[Gun Wielding Maniac]

I'm looking for a decent self-defense load for a 6" barreled revolver. Its an older K-frame, so it can't be too hot. Penetration would be the big concern, followed by expansion. Any recommendations? I've heard that wadcutters were the old standard?

 

[Skpotamus]

I'm not to sure aobut a 6" barrel, but I've been very happy with speer golddots in every caliber.

 

[RustyShackelford]

Good carry loads for .38spl K-frames...

I use a .38spl GP-100 with a 4" bar for a duty weapon.

I use Speer Gold Dot 135gr +P JHPs for duty use and .38spl "fang face" Extremeshock rounds for CC(concealed carry)-home protection.

Check www.natchezss.com for prices/styles.

I suggest the Winchester 158gr lead semi wadcutter HP +P and/or Winchester 130gr defense load in .38spl/+P.

NOTE: Have a gunsmith look over your revolver before shooting a lot of +P .38spl rounds. If it's old or worn out you may have problems later on.

RS

 

[Warner]

I concur with the Winchester 158gr lead semi wadcutter HP +P suggestion.

I use the Buffalo Bore "energized" version of same in my modern .38spl snubbies.

 

[s&w 24]

non +p load would be 125 fed nyclads form ammoman.com

+p would have to be 158 gr SWC/HP of whatever brand you like

 

[Gary A]

Since you specifically ask for a load that is not too hot, I'll recommend a non-plus P load. I really do like that plus P 135 grain Speer load, but it produces quite high pressure according to Speer (over 20,000 up to over 21,000 psi) which is hot by .38 standards. Try the Magtech 38 Special SJHP, 158 grains, standard pressure. Product no. 38E. It is rated at 807 fps from a 4 inch barrel which is faster than most 158 std loads but not as fast as plus P loads. Depending on just how "old" your revolver is, if it was built after 1958 and is in good shape, regular 158 grain lead semi-wadcutter hollow points +Ps from either Remington or Winchester should be fine. That extra two inches on your barrel is your friend, boosting velocity a bit.

 

[meef]

Just a bit of info here - and for those who might want to comment on never having been attacked by a gallon milk jug full of water.... I know, I know. There's nothing scientific or fact-filled about what I'm going to say. Again, it's just a bit of info.

I went out shooting last weekend to try out a few of the guns that I had purchased but never gotten around to firing (I just couldn't take it anymore), along with a few of my old favorites. It was a real mixed batch of shooting irons.

At any rate, one of the guns I hadn't fired yet was a S&W 442 that I was itching to try out. Among the items I brought to shoot were a number of gallon milk jugs that I had filled with water.

I shot the jugs with several different handguns and rifles of various calibers and as you might suspect, the jugs always lost - with varying results from simply getting holes punched through and slowly bleeding out, to jumping around a bit and losing their water pretty quickly.

When I was down to the last two jugs, I pulled out the 442 and loaded it with one round each of:

A.) Magsafe 65-gr +P+ MAX load @ 1670 fps/402 ft-lbs.

B.) Speer GoldDot +P 135-gr GDHP @ 866 fps/225 ft-lbs.

In the words of the noted philosopher, Bart Simpson......

HOLY CRAP!



No, I mean it. Really.

HOLY CRAP!



With either load, the results were the same. The jugs exploded!

Plastic and water went flying everywhere. Nothing else I shot that day produced anywhere near the result of these two cartridges. Not larger caliber handguns, not rifles. Not that I shot any fancy ammo from anything else, but still.....

I was very impressed by both of these .38 spl. rounds. Enough so that I would/will carry either in my 442. Likely I will dutch load it.

Not scientific, but quite an impressive show.

 

[weregunner]

These guys have hit the nail on the head. Forget the wadcutter stuff . The velocity is was to low for self defense. Little or no expansion.Deformation,yes. No bullet has a sharp edge that will cut flesh if the bullet is standing still. Ever hear of anyone getting first aid cause their carry load cut them? Flesh is very resistant and snaps back to where it was previously been, unless something disrupts it. What wadcutters do on paper does not happen in flesh. Accuracy testing was done on wadcutters reversed in the cartridge case. Accuracy suffers drastically as distance increases. Every year a writer in a magazine does the reverse wadcutter theme. The results are the same. Works at handshake range. Quite a few of the reverse loads shot don't even expand. Have you ever heard of verifiable shooting s with regular wadcutters or reversed ones? Home loaded brewed defense ammo has to be verified in court when a shooting happens. This can be done with commercail ammo. This can be verified in a lab by lot number of the ammo used. Many shots will be needed as well as possible retests.Do you want to bet a lengthy prison stay or worse on home made loads? Even if you keep records you have to prove that all the ammo was loaded the same way without change. Mas Ayoob puts out at least two soft cover books on combat handguns a year. He covers the whys and wheres on all this. So do other knowledgeable writers including Chuck Taylor and Spaulding.Dr.Topper has also written on this if you can find his works. So pick one of the good JHPs and you can't go wrong. Since no handgun bullet is a deathray one will have to take caution and may ahve to shoot quickly and accurately.Follow up shots are easier when not +P. Good luck on your choice and stay safe.

 

[Snowdog]

Just my opinion, but from the testing I've done involving playdough/JHP expansion experiments, I've found some of the "top choices" for Snubbies are less than ideal for longer barrels.

For example, among my first JHP tests (2" M85CH) was the Winchester 130gr SXT, an excellent choice for snub nose revolvers:

130gr SXT on the left, 135gr Speer Gold Dot on right

But from a longer 6" barrel, jacket/core separation is common, even after the denim.

Same 130gr SXT out of a 6" Taurus 689, notice the jacket/core separation (left), SXT from snub on right for comparison

Lighter JHPs such as hotter 110gr +P/+P+ usually offer picture-perfect expansion from a shorter barrel, yet fragment from longer ones

CorBon 110gr +P JHP after 2-layers of denim before play dough from a 2" barrel:

The same Corbon 110 +P JHP after identical test from a 6" barrel:

This photo demonstrates how one hollow-point (110gr Winchester Ranger +P+ JHP) expands beautifully from a 2" barrel after 2 layers of denim, whereas a Winchester SWCHP+P sometimes has issues after denim if fired from a snub nose

The additional velocity from your revolver's longer barrel really does expand your options a bit. Personally, I would either go with a heavier HP such as the venerable 158gr SWCHP+P, or a heavier JHP that wouldn't over-expand from your 6" barrel... unless fragmentation/shallow penetration appeals to you, as I know it does for some. Another option is a bonded core JHP such as Speer's excellent Gold Dot line.

Good luck!